"Nitrate builders"

[reddrum]

So I hear all the time people saying don't put bioballs and sponges in the back compartments because they are nitrate builders. The sponges I understand because they can trap food/waste etc. However, if you are not creating nitrates than that means your wastes remain in the form of more toxic ammonia and nitrites and eventually are broken down to nitrate anyways. The nitrates are going to be there eventually, so what does it matter? I would like to hear some peoples input.

[Big_Pun]

i agree with you i have sponges in my first chamber, and i dont have any problems, i thought they held good bacteria, i did fresh water for the past 8 yrs with no problems running sponges, dont think this would be any diff in a reef tank. i just rinse them off every once in a while and switch one out every month( 3 sponges in chamber).

[Bill S]

The issue with sponges and bioballs is what happens after an extended period of time. If you rinse them regularly, they will be much more effective. A sponge filter is more a mechanical filter - or that's how it should be used.

[Texreefer]

The problem is a long term build up of nitrates.. you do still want to remove nitrates.. bioballs are a nitrate haven and you will run into all kinds fo problems long term with them

[Gilbert]

so would replacing the bio-balls with rubble rock take care of the problem?

[hobogato]

not necessarily. the key to nitrate removal by bacteria is low oxygen areas where facultative anaerobic bacteria are forced to strip the oxygen off of nitrate for use in their metabolism. the remaining nitrogen dissolves into the water and then out to the atmosphere as harmless nitrogen gas. no matter what you use, bio-balls or rubble, you have to have some way to export or convert the nitrate.

[Texreefer]

Most systems that don't run a fuge or a deep enough sand bed, don't have the ability to remove enough nitrates through the process that Ace described, which is why over time excess nitrates will build up in a system, especially a system with bioballs that are generally high flow and high oxygen areas. Thus the need for nitrate removal such as skimmers, macro algae etc.. most sponges are taken out periodically and rinsed which helps remove built up nitrates, most people don't take their bio balls out and rinse them. Nor should they if this is a main source of biological filtration. If you choose to stick with bioballs, make sure you siphon the area periodically and employ some other means of effective nitrate removal

[reddrum]

not necessarily. the key to nitrate removal by bacteria is low oxygen areas where facultative anaerobic bacteria are forced to strip the oxygen off of nitrate for use in their metabolism. the remaining nitrogen dissolves into the water and then out to the atmosphere as harmless nitrogen gas. no matter what you use, bio-balls or rubble, you have to have some way to export or convert the nitrate.

That was my point exactly. Who cares if you are using live rock rubble, bio balls, or a wet dry filter the end product is all the same. I think you should focus more on how you are removing nitrates than what is forming them.

It is just kind of a pet peeve I have developed because I always see people using the "nitrate factory" argument.

[reddrum]

The problem is a long term build up of nitrates.. you do still want to remove nitrates.. bioballs are a nitrate haven and you will run into all kinds fo problems long term with them

So to me a "nitrate haven" would be a good thing. This impies that they are efficient at converting ammonia and nitrite to nitrate (which they are indeed). As far as trapping waste I personally would like the wastes to be trapped somewhere because ultimately we are dealing with a closed system, so if the waste is not trapped and removed it will be cycled throughout the tank until it is broken down to our good friend nitrate.

[Agent Jones]

if bio balls are so bad why does every LFS i walk into have them on their setups? and some places i have been do have been running their tanks for 10+ years.