ok what the heck is the "Hiatt Crash Cart" I must have missed that thread?? Im willing to try anything at this point.. i will call you this afternoon Thanks!

Erik - Hope your Lion is ok.. He looked good compared to the fuzzy. If you have room for the puffer that would be cool... just let me know...ohh and add some garlic to the food.. and feed more frequently..

Ram - i know its very weird... only the lions.. the weird part was when the Radiata was dead :cry it really looked alive... other than the fact it was on its side and not perched.. it didnt lose its color, its eyes were clear not cloudy... but it was stiff... not sure if thats any indication of anything but i did notice that..

Cliff im gonna clean the skimmer pump when i get home from work.. i did notice that yesterday there are very few microbubbles in the chamber and that isnt creating any foam at all......

One last thing that ive really been thinking about and i havent found any info on was what are the effects, if any, of a "venemous" fish dying in a tank? is that excreted somehow into the water? could that be the reason that only the lions have died? are some fish more resilient than others?

any thoughts anyone?