Trying something new...non coral experience :P

[Mr Cob]

I have been captivated by coral for the last 5+ years in this hobby. Time for something new.

Clownfish rearing.

That scares me honestly and it's full of all kinds of words that just don't interest me at all. Nannochloropsis, Tetraselmis and many other terms that just make me run the other way.

But, my wife is excited about the Black clowns and I have to admit that I am as well, a little reluctant about jumping into the whole process though.

So, here is my plan...


I may not be ready for this first clutch but will be for the next
Up my feeding for the parents to 2-3 times per day and increase variety of foods to ensure healthy eggs
Skipping the whole Phytoplankton culture step in order to cut down on this learning curve. In place of the live phytoplankton I have ordered: RotiGrow® Nanno (http://www.reed-mariculture.com/product_rotigrow.html)
For rotifers I just ordered a live culture of L-type rotifers (Brachionus plicatilis) from Reed Mariculture:Live Rotifers (http://apbreed.com/product_live_rotifers.html)
culture rotis in 2 x 5g black buckets with lids and of course airline tubing and pumps - SG 1.007 - 1.014, Temp 68-88f, PH around 8
picked up a jewelry lope to measure concentration of rotis /ml
picked up a 53um Sieve for scooping rotis
will harvest 25% rotis daily regardless of use to keep a steady cycle going
clownfish larvae will be added to 2 gallon black buckets that I picked up that will each have a heater and airline tubing with pump. I will split the first clutch. Doing this to increase my chances since I don't know what the heck I'm doing.
feed larvae 4 x per 24 hours - roti concentration at about 15 rotis /ml
10% water changes for larvae, daily, after the first 48hours
after metamorphisis the clowns will be transfered to 5 gallon buckets with heater/airstone/false anem or maybe some acrylic tanks....have yet to get this far.
after 12 days start doing 25% water changes every 2 days


Growout tank will be in the 30g IM Nuvo tank I'm setting up with RBTA's.

A pic of my parent pair:
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8322/8010870669_a5f10871b1_z.jpg



_________________
1 year UPDATE 10/2013:

Current pairs we are working with..


1) Onyx (wild caught) x Premium Onyx Picasso SPAWNING = Onyx Picassos
2) Phantom black snowflake (Sea and Reef) x Buckshot black snowflake (Proaquatix) (have not spawned) = Black Snowflakes
3) Onyx (wild caught) x Premium Snowflake with serious buckshot (FEA) SPAWNING = Snow Onyx hybrids
4) White Stripe Maroon x Goldflake maroon SPAWNING = Goldflake maroons
5) Snow Onyx x Premium Picasso (known spawner female) = hybrids (i think these will make black knights)
6) Black Ice x Black Ice (spawners not in cycle) = Black Ice
7)Gold Stripe Maroon x Goldflake Maroon (known spawners) = Goldflakes maroons

[Mr Cob]

also purchased Rotifer Filter Floss

http://reefnutrition.com/specialty_feeds.html#rotiferkit

This will hang like a curtain in the 5g buckets with a weighted bottom, it's supposed to collect all of the detritus or roti waste and keep it from accumulating on the bottom. Guess we'll see.

[KING]

Hey good luck rob..nice to see some 1 doing black clowns..not the fancys lol..an the mom an dad look clean..all black face..

[Zack]

This is going to be awesome!

[reefreak]

What I was going to do with my 29g but I'm going to have to postpone it.

[BBQHILLBILLY]

Sounds like a plan. Should be fun.:bigsmile:

[Scutterborn]

Something I, too, am interested in doing. I'll let you be the guinea pig before I go dropping all that coin!!

:)


- Ben -

[ElChicano]

Looking forward to this. Couldnt ask for a better looking pair of clowns to do this with.

[Mr Cob]

Thanks for all the comments.

A little about this pair.. from what I can see this pair looks pretty perfect, no over or under bites, no smashed in heads or popping eyes so they should be a great pair to breed.

Scientific Name: Amphiprion occellaris (solid black and white with complete stripes)

I think I'm going to have some time to get set up. I do not believe the male has fertilized the eggs as they have done nothing over the last 5 days. They remain tiny little swaying specs.

[350gt]

Good luck rob.......



hope it works out for you......

[Mr Cob]

thanks Tony. I asked Reed Mariculture to hold my order so I don't have to worry about keepibng a live rotifer culture going until I plan to pull a clutch. After talking with KING he advised me to hold off for a bigger clutch. So...focusing on beefing the parent's nutrition up and doing some more researching to be as prepared as possbile. The first clutch was a bust (don't think the male fertilized the eggs).. and I may sit out the second clutch depending on size. I added a plastic lid with the hope that they will make life easy for me and lay the eggs on it.

Female in the foreground..
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8048/8097764840_f2e9d31987_c.jpg

[g-ray]

Cool good luck with this rob.

[Mr Cob]

thx Gary.

The blacks are sitting in the sump now...they will go in my 30g Nuvo tank.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8195/8101714535_6257c97fe0_z.jpg


Their replacements for the 29g BioCube...(Black Misbar male and large Platinum female)
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8046/8101726600_7d9c671d1b_z.jpg


http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8335/8101713661_b2ba812309_z.jpg

This means I probably disrupted the black pair and a second clutch will have to wait but being that the Nuvo tank is rimless I would rather chance a less expensive pair in that tank. The good news is that the black and platinum are a bonded pair and the female has layed before for another male.

I'll continue to update this thread as things move along. Feel free to chime in with feedback... I don't claim to know anything about breeding clowns just yet.

[ElChicano]

Looking good rob, Im looking forward to seeing the offspring of the Black Misbar and large Platinum.

[Mr Cob]

ME TOO bro! :bigsmile:

[Zack]

Wow that is awesome! If you ever do raise a clutch from the all black pair, I'd love two of them. Good luck man, the second pair is beautiful also.

[Mr Cob]

thanks Zack...can't wait to get some babies...might have to work with both pairs for a couple of months before I get any action though.

[Mr Cob]

Just documenting species.

Black Darwin Pair (both are Amphiprion ocellaris F3)
Black Darwin misbar and female Platinum (black is Amphiprion ocellaris F2 and platinum is Amphiprion percula F3 or True Percula)

For those interested in a short read on the crossing possibilities.. (don't read if you don't like designer clownfish..haha)
http://reefbuilders.com/2010/12/06/sustainable-aquatics-released-ocellarispercula-clownfish-crosses/

[Texreefer]

I call dibs on the first pair of ROBphiprion misbarred platinums

[Mr Cob]

haha Mike "misbarred platinums" ...that's funny, I'm just hoping I can get some hatched eggs, then I get to worry about making it past 48 hours...and then to metamorphosis! lol

[KING]

Man..they are nice rob..glad u found some..an good luck on ur pairs..keep us posted

[World Class Aquatics & Exotics]

:thumbs_up: :-)

[Mr Cob]

Man..they are nice rob..glad u found some..an good luck on ur pairs..keep us posted

Thanks for letting them go bro, I lub dem!

Got some things in yesterday, here is my ghetto rig...big buckets for rotifers and small for clownfish larvae. Plus the rotifer sieve and rotifer floss. If things work out I'll upgrade later.

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8196/8107521361_81738538ef_z.jpg

[reefreak]

I have an extra rotifer sieve if needed rob.

[Mr Cob]

Thanks Jeremy...if we get a trade going anytime soon I will take it..otherwise I should be good with the one. I'm still in the market for BTA's...have yet to scoop up a GBTA.

[clownfishgems]

Thanks for letting them go bro, I lub dem!

Got some things in yesterday, here is my ghetto rig...big buckets for rotifers and small for clownfish larvae. Plus the rotifer sieve and rotifer floss. If things work out I'll upgrade later.

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8196/8107521361_81738538ef_z.jpglooking good, nice buckets.. you gonna use buckets to raise the fry?

[Mr Cob]

lol, yes, until they hit day 30.

Picked up a jewelry loupe to count rotifers..
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8473/8110615806_f09991a39f_z.jpg

[Mr Cob]

started a rotifer culture today.. don't really need it yet but my buddies at Reed Mariculture sent me an order a few days ago of RotiGrow and live Rotifers by mistake! I had placed an order but canceled it a couple of weeks ago when I realized that I would not be ready with larvae for awhile. I contacted them to let them know that they sent me a canceled order and they recognized the mistake and told me to enjoy them. What a stand-up kind of company. When I do need to order from them they will surely get my business again. I just got a $120+ order for free.

So.. I started the rotifer culture today to practice. I split the Rotigro into 2 separate ice trays that I froze. My plan is to thaw individual cubes as I need them. I also kept some in the fridge that I will use right now. It's my understanding that they can last in the fridge up to a month and in the freezer indefinitely...you just don't want to re-freeze them.

I added about 3.5g of display tank water to the 5 gallon bucket but sent the water through a sieve to make sure it did not have any particulate matter in it. Floated the rotifer bag then released them after adding: air line, rigged up some roti filter floss to hang upright in the bucket and then added 2ml of rotigrow.

I'll snap some pics when I get a chance but just wanted to document the process. I suspect a lot of the culture may already be dead since they have been in the fridge for about 4 days but from what I read I should be able to get the culture going again with the remaining live ones.

Water change tomorrow of about 2 gallons and add another 2ml of rotigrow.

[Mr Cob]

Nothing beats a good trade. Thanks KING! I owe you one man.

:bigsmile:
Breeder tanks.. I'm planning to cut some acrylic to turn this duo breeder into a quad breeder in order to get the most out of this setup because I do not want to set up anymore tanks right now.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7261/8165903199_e32380d969_c.jpg

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8065/8165934196_6ccbc001cf_c.jpg


And my new baby...well actually she's as big as KING! lol, dude, you have some serious clowns man. This momma is huge. ..and thanks for the tips Rudy, on how to get black ice babies :P

Snowflake (f) A. ocellaris x Darwin black and white (m) A. ocellaris
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8067/8165903897_08ec4ee803_c.jpg

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8198/8165903565_9155e61977_c.jpg

With all of the excitement I wasn't too interested in taking pics of the roti culture..perhaps when I get bored. Did a 2.5g water change in the roti culture, sieved out some rotis and fed all my tanks. That was fun. The roti culture doubled in density from yesterday.. have not counted yet, but did have fun looking at them through the jeweler's loupe. My kids got a kick out of that one.

[Mr Cob]

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8064/8165942265_bff50ffb98_c.jpg

[Flyride95]

Man they look awesome. Can't wait to see the fry.

[Mr Cob]

thx dude!

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8480/8165972918_d59dd9ccda_c.jpg

[KING]

You trying to say im fat Rob..lol

[Mr Cob]

hahahaha, nah man just strong and tough like momma clown.. it's funny, the male quickly went submissive with the snowflake where as he's been fighting with the semi-picasso female for a few days now and his fins are all beat up. lol Guess he realized he didn't have a chance with a fish 3 times his size.

[Mr Cob]

had a piece of black acrylic cut today to seperate the breeder section on the left into 2 individual sections which make up around 10g of water each and then I decided to keep the right side as one which is 20g to use as a growout section for clowns past the 1-2month mark.

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7264/8168066381_90de492a28_c.jpg

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7123/8168094556_cc2c142653_c.jpg

[RayAllen]

Very cool Rob, Look forward to the progression.

[Mr Cob]

thanks Ray, appreciate the support. I'm pretty excited about fish... first time, I've always been all about the coral maing.

[Mr Cob]

Made a trade with one of my breeder friends in Austin tonight and put a couple bucks in my pocket ...as a result the Biocube is without an MP10 now :( but my female has a male... New Black Ice male to pair up with my female semi-picasso :)

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8070/8173821660_31622647f3_c.jpg


http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8480/8173789467_688cd4617f_c.jpg


pretty stoked right now

[Flyride95]

Man he looks amazing.

[Mr Cob]

thx dude, can't wait to get the breeder tank going so I can get moving and some better shots. I had to make 2 holding containers for the extra clowns and put them in the 30g IM.. it looks funny, but I'm sure I will get some additional use out of the containers once I have babies all over the place.

The snowflake and darwin are bonded and no longer fighting..they stay together in the tank.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8205/8174156009_87dc2a3f8e_c.jpg


Here is the holding container for the black ice male. I took two net breeders and sealed them together and removed the bottom out of the top one. Seems to be working perfectly. I will introduce the semi-picasso to him in a couple of days. I also added a temporary plastic trim to keep the fish in the tank should I get an accidental jump.. just protecting the investment.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8065/8174189048_c87b10edd8_c.jpg


The other container.. a plastic walmart container that i ziptied some mesh to.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8067/8174189406_be5e741230_c.jpg


http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8202/8174156235_7b0075813d_c.jpg

[jwalk034]

This is just to freaking awesome man! Cant wait to see this in person!!

[Mr Cob]

Thanks Josh, nice seeing you anf your grandpa today.. sorry I couldn't have you come in to check it all out, timing was bad for the human babies. lol

Thanks for the trades! I should have everything I need to get the breeder system built now. The stand I got from you was too small though.. but not to worry I put an order in with TT for a custom built stand on store credit. I might keep the one I got from you Josh as a backup should I need to set up another growout tank.. or it might go up for grabs in a trade lol.

[allan]

Hey, rob, do you want the heater? Not sure if I missed your response or if I ever hit send...

I'm so confused.


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[Mr Cob]

Yes, Allan, just need to figure out when I can swing by. I will PM you when some time frees up. Thx bro.

[Mr Cob]

I finally took some time to get a few pics of the rotifer culture. I kept the culture that I got from Reed Mariculture in the fridge (laying flat on a towel, towel is porous allowing the bag to breath) for about a week and a half. The majority of the culture died off which was evident in the smelly water. BUT..enough lived to keep the culture going.

The first day I only had about 1 or 2 rotifers per ml, and a week later I'm up to about 10/ml. I believe I need to be at a density of around 15 rotifers per ml in order to feed clownfish larvae.

Other recommended numbers that I found in case you are curious:
SG: 1.007-1.014 (I'm at 1.020, I have no idea if this will be a problem)
Temp: 68-88 (I'm at 74, or same as house temp, not running a heater)
PH: 8 is best (7.2low-9high - no idea where I'm at)
Feeding: I'm feeding 4ml of RotiGrow per day for a 5g bucket (I started at 2ml and raised it up to 4ml, I believe I will stay at 4ml)

Some pics..

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8065/8182863702_8bf420ba9c_c.jpg

I cut a hole in the top of the bucket to hang some floss. Just used some fishing line, an acrylic tube and a weight at the end to keep the floss hanging in the water.http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8210/8182864070_73b4c89288_c.jpg


http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8349/8182864318_f6a999a014_c.jpg

[Mr Cob]

Found a little more about why it is recommended to keep Rotifers at a lower SG.. they reproduce faster, but there should not be more than a 0.007 swing from culture tank to larvae tank otherwise they go into shock and sink to the bottom. So.. I think my specific gravity of 1.020 will be fine as long as I'm maintaining the density that I need.

Link for more information:
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2002/9/breeder

[Mr Cob]

The Snowflake and Darwin pair already gettin to it.. only been together for a week or so.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-9LxofiBRDQ&feature=player_detailpage&list=UUNIvoK9 hPHXk75olX9C5coA

[Flyride95]

Very nice! Keep is updated I really want to see the offspring.

[Mr Cob]

Rotifer sample..

Cool little creatures.

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[Mr Cob]

Rotifer vid


http://youtu.be/wrp0RDu1i7s

[reefreak]

How many times do you feed a day rob?

[Mr Cob]

How many times do you feed a day rob?

Feeding rotifers 4ml of RotiGrow a day for 4g of water in a 5g bucket. No idea if I should be doing more or less. The culture seems strong. I harvest whatever comes out in a 2-2.5g daily water change and feed to my other tanks.

[Mr Cob]

Just started setting up a new tank that I picked up from Josh in a trade..tank stand and light. Also got the large rock from Lucky. Thanks guys.

This is a 40g breeder tank and will be for clownfish growout. In order to simplify this tank and not have to worry about another full on system with a fuge sump etc.. it will be treated as a macro tank. DSB in the back right corner and loaded with different macros and a hang on back skimmer..heater and koralia. That's it.

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8208/8194366307_24ea52c6b5_c.jpg

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8208/8194365991_5c0b789167_c.jpg

I have one more system to set up and that's the 40g breeder divided acrylic tank. I have everything I need for it just waiting on the stand that I picked up on store credit with TT. I had them build it 40" tall to give the pairs some privacy from my 4 shorties (kids)

[Mr Cob]

Picked up the stand for the sectioned breeder tank today. Allan over at Texas Tropical did a really nice job on it. 40" tall.. and another item on store credit..lol. You should see my corals.. they are all frags now.

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8478/8207831414_97b280faa7_c.jpg

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8198/8207831000_b1119a1a1d_c.jpg

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8065/8207831140_9ed65fd002_c.jpg

I haven't decided if I will add another divider to the right side yet. I have one more that I picked up from regal plastics but still thinking about if I want the swim room for growout or divided for another 2 pairs.

[KING]

Nice rob..good luck..

[Mr Cob]

thanks my brotha.. pretty stoked about it all

[ElChicano]

Sweet set up you got going. I need to hurry and set up another tank, in time to get some clowns from you.

[Mr Cob]

thanks Hugo, appreciate it. Gonna be awhile before I have clowns.. I did pick up another snowflake female in trade today. I will pair her with a black ice male that I have. Both have very nice blues and should make a nice pair.

The new Snowflake female
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8200/8226436950_69788e85cd_z.jpg

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8479/8226436622_35d6b955c1_z.jpg

Black Ice male
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8484/8226438368_b2867e96cc_z.jpg

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8206/8225382943_ed9b5941f1_z.jpg

[Mr Cob]

..and on a negative note my Rotifer culture crashed yesterday. Not sure what happened I was really going strong. Perhaps 4ml of RotiGrow Nanno (daily) was not enough for the growing culture or maybe it was too much. Clueless at this point and will have to do some more reading. I'll have to test the water and see if it wasn't related to a water parameter.

The good news... I can take a break from worrying about a rotifer bucket maintenance for a bit... and focus on the breeder stall build.

[Mr Cob]

Got the last section of the breeder system in and a little bit of water...still need a sump. Got one coming in from LFS on store credit hopefully this week.





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[Mr Cob]

Black Ice A. ocellaris X Black Ice A. ocellaris



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[Paul28]

Those are insane man !! Nice

[Mr Cob]

thx Paul...the Platinum and Darwin got the boot lol...they are in a black container I made until the breeder system is ready...you can see the bottom of it in all the pics at the top. The 29g BioCube will be reserved for my best pair...canopy and all for added security. lol

[Paul28]

Very nice

[RayAllen]

Sweet clowns Rob! im thinking of going with a black and white pair in the 40g.

side note: good to see you posting again Paul.

[allan]

Rob, I'm not a clown... I mean, I'm not a clown guy, but those look fine as heck. Makes me wish I had something other than the pink skunks. I'm also very impressed with the whole growing thing.

[Paul28]

Sweet clowns Rob! im thinking of going with a black and white pair in the 40g.

side note: good to see you posting again Paul.


Yeh its been awile :)

[Mr Cob]

thanks guys

[reefreak]

Rob what's going in your 29g?

[KING]

Man...

[Mr Cob]

Rob what's going in your 29g?

Well... 29g is becoming the RBTA tank and I will put my favorite breeder pair in it. I may also use it to help with clownfish growout...I don't know.


Man...

lol

[Mr Cob]

Just enjoying these fish : )




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[Flyride95]

Man they look awesome. Keep us updated on them. I may be interested in a pair after my move. That is if you would want to part with any. :)

[Mr Cob]

thx!

Here is the other side of the female Black Ice..

http://www.austinreefclub.com/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=23296

[Mr Cob]

Gettin crazy...

Snow Onyx pair
Snow Onyx x grade A Picasso
Snowflake x black ice
A little two month old baby to practice with : )

Check out all of my rigged containers lol


http://www.reef2reef.com/forums/attachments/fish-breeding-forum/44284d1354687319-clownfish-breeding-build-thread-first-go-uploadfromtaptalk1354687314334.jpg



http://www.reef2reef.com/forums/attachments/fish-breeding-forum/44287d1354687358-clownfish-breeding-build-thread-first-go-uploadfromtaptalk1354687352769.jpg


http://www.reef2reef.com/forums/attachments/fish-breeding-forum/44285d1354687331-clownfish-breeding-build-thread-first-go-uploadfromtaptalk1354687326423.jpg






http://www.reef2reef.com/forums/attachments/fish-breeding-forum/44286d1354687346-clownfish-breeding-build-thread-first-go-uploadfromtaptalk1354687341278.jpg


http://www.reef2reef.com/forums/attachments/fish-breeding-forum/44288d1354687370-clownfish-breeding-build-thread-first-go-uploadfromtaptalk1354687366088.jpg




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[allan]

This looks like fun, can't imagine why you aren't pulling your hair out with all the details... oh... wait... :D

[Mr Cob]

Lol because it's all out already!

It is fun dude.. I really can't get enough of these clowns. My only problem at the moment is space! My wife is a big help as well right now. I think she likes the fish much more than the coral.


Look how cute this little dude is.. his name is Serg for sergeant. "sarge"

17878


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[allan]

Cute, dude.

I was reading an article about rearing hippo tangs the other day. I don't believe I got what it takes.

Watching your thread and talking with a few others doing the same thing makes me think I'm missing out on something interesting. You guys rock.


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[Mr Cob]

yeah, you are missing out on alot of work! lol I haven't even started rearing yet! I will be passing on collecting any clutches that come up until I have everything down and the pairs into their breeder system.

Still have a lot left to construct. Hoping the second stand from TT will be done soon so I can get moving on this. Having to do daily water changes to the tanks since I have so many fish in them with 3-4 feedings a day.

[clownfishgems]

Lol because it's all out already!

It is fun dude.. I really can't get enough of these clowns. My only problem at the moment is space! My wife is a big help as well right now. I think she likes the fish much more than the coral.


Look how cute this little dude is.. his name is Serg for sergeant. "sarge"

17878


Sent from my HTC VIVID using TapatalkThats one of the nicest fish ive seen ..:shades:

[Mr Cob]

Love that little guy! Kind of miss him today...lol

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[Mr Cob]

Temporary solution for getting a few pairs out of the containers until I can get the breeder stall systems complete.

Platinum x grade A picasso
Snowflake x Darwin
Snow onyx x Darwin mis bar

17905

17906

17907

17908

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[Mr Cob]

Snowflake x black ice

17929

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[Mr Cob]

Got the sump installed this weekend, it's an Aqueon ProFlex 2 and fits perfect. I also lined the stand with pond liner to assist with water spills.

I just need a light for the fuge area and waiting on a skimmer.

This will support 4 breeder stalls. I will have 2 of the exact systems set up for my operation. Planning to operate with 6 pairs and the open 2 stalls will be used for growout and or to move adults around.

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17943

[Mr Cob]

Made a little more progress after dealing with ich on the black ice x snowflake pair. I lost them both : (

Added two pairs to the breeder system today.

Snow Onyx x Snow Onyx (hybrids)
Platinum x grade a Picasso (true percula)
http://www.maast.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=18005&d=1355606499



http://www.maast.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=18006&d=1355606599


The black ice pair in my biocube
http://www.maast.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=18007&d=1355606621



http://www.maast.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=18008&d=1355606674


Really loving this sump I added to the 4 stall breeder system:
http://www.maast.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=18009&d=1355606721

[Mr Cob]

The Black Ice pair has been nesting and the female is looking beefed up. Hoping to see some eggs soon.


http://www.maast.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=18107&d=1356581057
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[Mr Cob]

Trying something new with my snow onyx female... Just added a Premium Snowflake from Proaquatix. She was ripping into him so I put her in a holding container until the male has a chance to see his new home lol.

http://www.austinreefclub.com/uploads/monthly_12_2012/post-1834-135665389653_thumb.jpg (http://www.austinreefclub.com/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=23578)


Also just made this pair, not sure if I will keep it or not though. I really only want one maybe 2 True Percula pairs to work with.

Both are picassos..

http://www.austinreefclub.com/uploads/monthly_12_2012/post-1834-135665385346_thumb.jpg (http://www.austinreefclub.com/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=23576)


http://www.austinreefclub.com/uploads/monthly_12_2012/post-1834-135665387051_thumb.jpg (http://www.austinreefclub.com/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=23577)


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[Mr Cob]

My 2nd favorite pair that I will definitely keep going... My first fave is the black ice pair. Yes, I'm a nerd and rate my own fish. Lol

Darwin mis-bar x Black Snowflake :)

http://www.maast.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=18113&d=1356660650



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[Mr Cob]

Here is the other percula pair, platinum and picasso. The platinum is really white.

http://www.reef2reef.com/forums/attachments/fish-breeding-forum/46228d1356670015-clownfish-breeding-build-thread-first-go-uploadfromtaptalk1356670016301.jpg

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[Mr Cob]

Ok, I have been in and out of so many pairs over the last couple of months, just trying to figure out what I want to work with and then dealing with the clown's likes and dislikes lol.

So, here is what I'm working with as of right now.

In order of my preference...

1) Black Ice A. ocellaris (f) X Black Ice A. ocellaris (spawning pair)
2) Darwin Misbar A. ocellaris (f) X Black Snowflake A. ocellaris
3) Snow Onyx HYBRID (f) X Premium Snowflake A. ocellaris
4) Grade B Picasso A. percula (f) X Platinum A. percula
5) Grade A Picasso A. percula (f) X Premium Picasso A. percula

Fish on the side as backup males: (if things stay the same above then I will pair up the two premiums below as my personal pair to enjoy in a reef)
Premium Blacker Ice A. ocellaris
Premium Snowflake A. ocellaris
Platinum A. percula

[Mr Cob]

Here's some attention to the backup crew...

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[Mr Cob]

I have had a few PMs about my holding containers. Clownfish depot turned me on to my favorite:

Hanging Basket: LINK (http://florida-aqua-farms.com/shop/hanging-basket/)

None of the containers I purchase are large enough so I mod them by combining two baskets with either sealant or zip ties and then removing the bottom out of the one on top.

Couple pics to show you how I put them together..

http://www.reef2reef.com/forums/attachments/fish-breeding-forum/44287d1354687358-clownfish-breeding-build-thread-first-go-uploadfromtaptalk1354687352769.jpg

http://www.reef2reef.com/forums/attachments/fish-breeding-forum/46251d1356716058-clownfish-breeding-build-thread-first-go-uploadfromtaptalk1356716065754.jpg








and the net breeder: LINK (http://www.thatpetplace.com/net-breeder?gdftrk=gdfV2226_a_7c268_a_7c6967_a_7c20423 3&ne_ppc_id=1463&ne_key_id=26446944&gclid=CMKj_66YwLQCFYKPPAodPTYASQ)
http://www.reef2reef.com/forums/attachments/fish-breeding-forum/44285d1354687331-clownfish-breeding-build-thread-first-go-uploadfromtaptalk1354687326423.jpg

[Mr Cob]

A few pics from my cell phone tonight as I was moving pairs around. None of them are spawning otherwise I would not have moved them.

Picasso and platinum
http://www.maast.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=18214&d=1357022836


http://www.maast.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=18215&d=1357022857



Snow onyx and premium snowflake
http://www.maast.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=18212&d=1357022786


http://www.maast.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=18213&d=1357022812


Picasso pair
http://www.maast.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=18211&d=1357022763



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[Mr Cob]

http://www.maast.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=18216&d=1357022982

[Mr Cob]

Getting closer to being fully set up.

Got both breeder systems in place today. Still working on the 2 stall one and decided to make two baffles that will be removable to have some flexibility on 2-4 stalls.

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Installed pond liner in stand...

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[Mr Cob]

My new pair came in today... Made a trade with a vendor.

This pair is wild caught...and were caught together about 6 months ago.

Onyx A. percula (f) X regular A. percula

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[Mr Cob]

Got water in the second breeder system today : ) so happy to be done with that!

18410

http://www.maast.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=18410&d=1357543920


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[jwalk034]

Looking great man!! Very nice set up!! Keep us updated.

[Mr Cob]

So I finally narrowed it down to 3 pairs.

I can run 4 pairs with my current set up but will keep the 4th stall open for a special pair that I may or may not come across.

I also decided not to work with hybrids for now.

1) Black Ice (f) A. ocellaris X Black Ice A. ocellaris
2) Onyx A. percula (wild caught f) X Platinum A. percula
3) Darwin misbar (f) A. ocellaris X Black Snowflake A. ocellaris

Pics...



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[OrionN]

Rob,
You are really going at it with all these pairs.
Are you raising any baby from your spawning pair yet? Do you have a thread on it somewhere?

[Mr Cob]

I couldn't really figure out what I wanted to do on pairs so I just brought in as many fish as I could and just kind of got a feel for things. I narrowed it down to 3 pairs.

I'm going to get in gear now that I'm done moving fish around and equipment. I just started power feeding and raised heaters to 82...and plan to start collecting soon.

The Darwin and black snowflake probably won't do anything for awhile...unless their Creator decides otherwise. : )

The onyx and platinum were just paired but she is huge and I'm hoping it won't be long for them.

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[Mr Cob]

Looks like I have pair number 4 in place. I took the large wild caught male true percula I got with the onyx and paired him up with my premium/extreme snowflake male. Will let the perc go female.

So, I will be working with a hybrid pair after all. I was thinking that since the true perc is wild that I will be starting with good genes for a pair to breed and produce hybrid offspring.


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[Mr Cob]

Tell me this lady don't look pregnant...? Lol


18570


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[BBQHILLBILLY]

:bigsmile:congrats

[Mr Cob]

Thx dude!

Split the rotifer culture tonight and added heaters to both. These are now sitting in a stand in the garage. You can also see two ways to hang the rotifer filter floss. The one with the tube has a weight on the end of it to keep the floss hanging upright. Both ways seem to work and you can see both are dirty and collecting waste.


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[txav8r]

Bro! I need to come check out your set up!! Looks like you are doing awesome!!

[Mr Cob]

Bro! I need to come check out your set up!! Looks like you are doing awesome!!

Thx bruddah Jack! I have really been enjoying these fish and the whole process of setting things up and pairing the fish. But I'm anxious to get the ball rolling and to collect some babies now that the build is done and I'm about to get bored lol. Really just waiting for the 2nd breeder system to finish it's cycle...which will be used for grow out.



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[hobogato]

nicely done rob, i am looking forward to seeing pics of all the little wiggling babies

[Southern Flame]

Y'all have me wanting to try this captive breeding :) it looks like loads of fun and would make a very interesting science project for my 7 yo

[Mr Cob]

My new broodstock pair...

Snowflake A. ocellaris (lots of serious blues on this one, need to get some better pics) X Wyoming White (absolutely beautiful fish)

I never understood the full rave on Wyoming Whites...but after now owning one I do. The colors are so vibrant, it really is something special. Platinums and Maine blizzards just don't compare.


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[FireWater]

Looks good Rob. Any kid updates on your other pairs..

[Mr Cob]

Looks good Rob. Any kid updates on your other pairs..

Lol, no kids yet. I'm hanging in there though.

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[hobogato]

man, how many pairs do you have now? when they all start spawning you are gonna have more fry than you know what to do with.

[Mr Cob]

Yeah Ace, there's no way I will be able to pull from all of these pairs. I have 9 right now. I'm really only set up to pull one clutch a month, maybe two.

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[Mr Cob]

Really wish I was posting something more than swaying tails in a pot but that's all I got for now.


I'm thinking this pair will be the first to get me some babies:
Onyx (wild) x Premium Onyx Picasso

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s3eMT995N7Q&feature=share&list=UUNIvoK9hPH Xk75olX9C5coA


Here is my favorite pair:
Darwin misbar x Black Snowflake

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtyO4sO7Rkk&feature=share&list=UUNIvoK9hPH Xk75olX9C5coA

[reefreak]

Dude that onyx looks huge!

[Mr Cob]

lol, yeah, she nasty

[ducati996]

Pretty good pairs

[Mr Cob]

Here is the Snowflake and Wyoming White pair (Sea and Reef), they are younger than my other pairs but they are still of breeding size. A little over 2" on the snowflake and 1.75" on the WW.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SjU8EA-fBb0&feature=share&list=UUNIvoK9hPHXk75olX9C5coA

[RayAllen]

Love the Wyoming whites. Nice vid Rob.

[Mr Cob]

Thx Ray, appreciate the comment. I will most likely be getting rid of the Wyoming white, the female snowflake is not liking him and they are not bonding. I will try another WW if they don't work it out soon. It's a beautiful fish.

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[Mr Cob]

My wild caught onyx and onyx picasso (proaquatix) pair are spawning right now : )

Taking some vid, will try and post later. Looks like male is fertilizing eggs but they are kind of dark looking, not sure what that means. I was expecting orange eggs.

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[Mr Cob]

So, here they are spawning.

This last week big mama kept moving the pot to where I could not see into it, so I finally stopped moving it back and let her be. Lastnight a little before 9pm she started to lay while pumps were off and I was feeding tank rotifers.

You can see the male following and fertilizing eggs. When she was done I moved the pot to see inside and they are nice and orange. :)

VID:

http://youtu.be/9RD0RXD_KVg

[LuckySingh]

Nice bro

[Paul28]

Very nice !!!

[Mr Cob]

...and 13 days later (counting from night to night) at exactly the same time, a little before 9pm while feeding tank rotifers they slam down a nice nest 5 times the size of the first one. Can't wait to see nest 5!

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8386/8555422931_380a43a425_c.jpg

[Mr Cob]

Vid of their second nest (Onyx Wild Caught X Onyx Picasso):


http://youtu.be/7kausZsmQwA

[Scutterborn]

So, here they are spawning.

This last week big mama kept moving the pot to where I could not see into it, so I finally stopped moving it back and let her be. Lastnight a little before 9pm she started to lay while pumps were off and I was feeding tank rotifers.

You can see the male following and fertilizing eggs. When she was done I moved the pot to see inside and they are nice and orange. :)

VID:

http://youtu.be/9RD0RXD_KVg

I had my false percs doing this exact same thing in my tank the other day. It wasn't until I saw this video that I knew what they were up to. No eggs though. Maybe just preparing. Thanks for the post and expanding my brain!


-Ben-

[Mr Cob]

Thanks Ben, yeah I had another pair doing the same and I sold them off, a few days later the new owner told me the pair layed. lol I was a little bummed that I missed out on it. Nice to know all the signs lol.

Just thought it was worth mentioning that the pair that just spawned has only been together for about a month and some change. Big mama joined my project late last year with another wild caught male. I separated the two from the start and paired her with a platinum..as evident in this thread, last pic I took of them together and posted on this thread was 01/14/2013.

http://www.maast.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=18570&d=1358224646Mon, 14th Jan 2013 10:37 PM

Shortly after this I decided to pair her with my Onyx Picasso and their first clutch was on 02/28/2013 :D ..and second 03/13/2013.

I guess my point is this.. don't let anyone ever tell you that you won't have eggs anytime soon with a newly bonded pair.. if you believe God created the heavens and earth and everything in them, then why not? Surely the Creator Himself can expedite some egg laying :)

[350gt]

Lol all the wrong in the world and god created eggs for a pair of clowns..:angel:

[Mr Cob]

Sorry you feel that way Tony : (

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[Mr Cob]

Noticed silver eyes today on the eggs.

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[Scutterborn]

Noticed silver eyes today on the eggs.

What would that seem to indicate?


-Ben-

[Mr Cob]

What would that seem to indicate?


-Ben-

That things are looking good and the male fertilized the eggs. : D

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[Scutterborn]

Groovy!


-Ben-

[Mr Cob]

eggs hatched night of 3/18 and 3/19 - no collecting, got the cycle down now and hope to collect batch 3

[Mr Cob]

Big mama is laying her 3rd nest right now.

(16 days later from last nest, counting night to night)

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[Mr Cob]

Big mama laid nest #4 at around 9:20pm tonight. Well over a thousand eggs.

I'm going to try and pull the pot in a few days and see if I can get a clutch. About half the eggs have been making it to hatch night and they are hatching over a two day period making it very difficult for me to collect.



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[OrionN]

I am glad that that wild caught Onyx produce for you. We got to trade some babies sometime.
If you pull the pot, the egg will be over growth with fungal in a day. The eggs that did not hatch the first day will unlikely hatch. If you pull the nest you need to treat the water with anti-fungal or soak the eggs in anti-fungal.
I find that at 83 degree, my egg hatch exactly at 7 days (eggs that laid on Sunday will hatch next Sunday for me). I wrap the aquarium (5 gal) in thick bath tile let no light in at about 7PM and open it up 3 hrs later, all the egg hatched. Pitch black in very important to get the eggs hatch promptly. Ever since I wrap the nursery aquarium, none of my spawn require 2 days to hatch. In fact by 11 PM all the eggs have hatched. If you can try this and you will not need to treat the eggs with anti-fungal.
Good luck

[Mr Cob]

Thanks Minh, I'm running at 83.2 round the clock, not sure why I'm getting the 2 day hatches. I had planned on pulling the pot and letting rigid airline nurse the eggs... But now I'm not sure after your post... really don't want to treat anything.

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[KING]

Minh...any idea why my clowns keep eatting the eggs on 4th an 5th day..this pair is on clutch #5..

[Mr Cob]

Minh...any idea why my clowns keep eatting the eggs on 4th an 5th day..this pair is on clutch #5..

That's kind of what's going on with this pair...they eat over half the eggs and on hatch night I have 200-300 left that hatch over a 2 day period. I was thinking they were killing off the bad eggs since they don't eat them all.

I was going to try and do more water changes to see if that helps any.

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[OrionN]

The male does not fertilize well so the eggs that got eaten early is due to bad male, non fertilized was removed. Eggs sometime died and they eat and remove them. Late developmental arrest is due to poor nutrition of the female.
The eggs get darker as they age, The bad one turn light and cloudy. They need to remove the bad egg because these are source of fungal and bacteria growth that kill the rest. One day without the male attend them, even with air aggitation, the eggs will develope a fuzz around them and died (fungal infection)

[OrionN]

With my pairs, one male is really good and that nest lost maybe 10% due to non fertilization and the other pair lost about 25% due to non fertilization. My pair ususlaly not loosing egg late in the process. Looking at the eggs, you can really see the bad ones as they die and stop developer then remove by the male

[Mr Cob]

Thanks for chiming in with your expertise Minh, great info that would have taken some time to figure out or research. Appreciate it.

Do you pull the pot on hatch night or are you collecting as they hatch?

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[OrionN]

They laid on tile and reobe the night of the hatch at about 6-7 PM. Once they are ready, total darkness will stimulate them to hatch all at once

[Mr Cob]

Here's the nest being layed from the other night:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_-0mROa84E&feature=share&list=UUNIvoK9hPHXk75olX9C5c oA

[Mr Cob]

Nice and dark eggs, looks like the male fertilized them all! So many eggs :)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iypcInJs8C4&feature=share&list=UUNIvoK9hPH Xk75olX9C5coA

[Zack]

How big would you say that female is?

[Mr Cob]

How big would you say that female is?

She big dude, that's why she be called "big mama".

I just measured her with a ruler and without taking her out of the water she is definitely 3.5" but I'm guessing 3.75-4". Not sure she can get much bigger.

[Zack]

Man that's awesome.. can't wait to get my pair together manana. Should be exciting

[Mr Cob]

Man that's awesome.. can't wait to get my pair together manana. Should be exciting

Your female is of breeder size too dude. :)

[Zack]

I know! If they do lay, your welcome to drive up and get the eggs... I won't be ready for that for a few weeks.

[Mr Cob]

Preparing to pull Big Mama's pot tonight. The eggs were silver lastnight so I'm hoping they hatch tonight. I know there's a risk in them not hatching tonight since I don't know what I'm doing and if so they may be away from the male too long. But we shall see.

I decided not to rear in my black buckets in favor of this glass tank that I blacked out. I was going to paint it but not sure I will stick with this solution or not.

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8397/8669676866_ec69f5cbaa_z.jpg


http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8380/8669675398_9065114162_z.jpg


http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8391/8668570259_34edc8d3d0_z.jpg


added a little window...
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8402/8669708072_9b3103f40c_z.jpg


and a non bright light that can easily be stretched out to start and then slowly bring closer to fish as they acclimate to light...
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8388/8668610183_0f8c278abf_z.jpg

[leliataylor]

That is interesting that the fry hatch in darkness. With my seahorses only the H.comes deliver in total darkness, all the rest deliver at first light. I am sure there is a survival strategy in the timing on the births. I did recently read a research paper about H. kuda that found fry born and raised in dark blue or green tanks exhibited a accelerated growth rate over any other color tank. I am not sure this is the case with clowns, however they also found a increase in feeding behavior with a green or blue tank. I have been researching chromatophores and there are so many similarities, what applies to one genera may prove true for another. I really need to read more on clown repro.

[Mr Cob]

Very interesting info. Thanks for sharing. I'm very curious now, how that works for clowns. I'm really just going with what others have already discovered and implementing in my own way.


Just moved one bucket of rotifers into the garage to provide climate control. Would like to bring in the other but don't have a place for it.

Will post a pic in a bit.

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[Mr Cob]

Alright, so got the rearing station going. I have room for 2 more identical tanks on top in order to pull up to 3 nests at a time. I'll go at this capacity until I decide to do more and invest more into this project. For now, would just like to see how things workout.


http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8386/8670130726_b9f95bdba8_z.jpg




Brought a rotifer bucket in doors to provide climate control.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8401/8669020101_caf24abcf3_z.jpg




top down into the larvae tank
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8110/8670125812_88f3075e37_z.jpg

[texascwby430]

Good Luck Rob!

I want to be the first adopting parent of your new Black beauty's, let me know when the are weened....lol

[OrionN]

Did they hatched. I am really interested in how it turn out for you.

[Mr Cob]

Thx!

I just finished setting the larvae tank up...a few minutes after pulling the pot and adding air bubble agitation I saw a baby swimming around. Closed the tank up and it is completely darkened now.

Just hoping they all hatch tonight.

I added green water and rotifers, some chaeto, some rubble...and a heater.

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[Mr Cob]

Here's a vid right after I finished setting this fry tank up and pulling the pot.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wqTk4CRUXzg&feature=share&list=UUNIvoK9hPH Xk75olX9C5coA

I decided to take the live rock rubble out after the fact to prevent any type of bacterial infection.

[ducati996]

so how many so far?

[allan]

Lol, it's finally happening, huh rob?


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[OrionN]

Remove the rubble will not make any different since the water is not sterile and you have added it in there. I use fast growing algae to help with ammonia. I have 350+ clowns in a 60ish gallon of water and good feeding and so fare have no ammonia problem. I got at lease 1 large bristle worm in the tank and a bunch of small one. At pods were all over the place. I bet I can add a mandarin in there and he will do just fine. I did change about 80% of the water every 2 weeks or so.
Please let us know in AM how they did over night. Often I loose significant number of fry in that first night.

[Mr Cob]

Lol, it's finally happening, huh rob?


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Yes, finally lol. Never had ti have so much patience lol. Kind of feel like I'm just getting started now and still have a lot to figure out!


so how many so far?

Have not checked yet. From what I have read the clownfish babies have a yolk sack that will provide nourishment for up to 12 hours.


Minh.... Do you use live rock/ rubble? And what type of macro do you use?

Thx!



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[ducati996]

Cmon u gotta peek in there in to add rotifers lol

[Mr Cob]

Cmon u gotta peek in there in to add rotifers lol

Well I was sleeping lol. Just looked and only have one baby. The rest have not hatched. : (



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[ducati996]

That's not good

[Mr Cob]

That's not good

Yeah, but I saw a baby so one step closer lol

That one little baby gives me hope. Just needed to see one egg hatch...that's enough to keep me motivated and make some tweaks to get this down. It's when I don't see progress that things get frustrating. The first 6 months were the hardest though... When I wasn't even seeing eggs. I almost called it quits a couple of times. I'm not one to typically have so much patience so this entire project has been a real test for me.

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[Mr Cob]

Need to hit up the LFS today and pick up supplies. More air pumps...I did not like that while the two rigid airline tubes were being used in the pot for the eggs that the rest of the tank was stagnant.

Want to pick up a quick read ammonia reader...the one month readers. The larvae tank smelled this morning and I'm sure it's due to the greenwater and rotifers. I probably put too much greenwater in.

Need to get my other bucket of rotifers indoors too.

Need to be more diligent with rotifer water changes, I think their water quality is poor.



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[OrionN]

You got to use tank water. Water chemistry, temp and pH cannot change or they won't hatch well.
I tape card board to get complete darkness.
I don't add Macro Algae (several species of caulerpa) until I have to feed dry food. Use LR to house brissle worm and to attach the caulerpa to. Brisstle worms are very good at eatting food drop to the bottom of the tank. I don't really feed the nursery tank with green phyto (I used dead frozen phytoplanton). If I have live phytoplankton, I would add it into the tank. I only add enough rotifer to keep the fry feed for about 12 hrs or so. I was told that too high rotifer density tend to cause decreased in O2 and cause flare gills.

[OrionN]

I see if I can post some picture later on this evening

[OrionN]

Did you seave the rotifer out? You cannot add the rotifer water into the hatch tank. They are very high in nutrients and possible some ammonia. I use a 50 micron seave to filter the rotifers out and only add rotifer to the tank, Do not add the water that was in the rotifer tank into the nursery tank.

[Mr Cob]

Minh, I also use frozen phyto. I don't culture phytoplankton. If I had to I probably would not even be doing this.

I also use tank water in the nursery tank/larvae tank. PH, temp all of that were the exact same. BUT, I think I put in too much phytoplankton/greenwater...more than the rotifers could exhaust...fouling the water. Maybe not. But the water smelled. Could also be because the water was stagnant in so many areas.

The eggs that had constant aeration looked awesome this morning and still do look great and may hatch tonight. Every nest from this pair has hatched over two nights..so we will see tonight. The areas of the nest that did not have constant aeration (you can see this clearly in the video) looked cloudy this morning and are probably toast.

Moving forward, I want to make sure I balance the phytoplankton to rotifers and have aeration over the entire nest as well as the rest of the tank while the slow aeration is in the pot.

I will also hold off on macro and live rock in the larvae tank as you suggested Minh.

[Mr Cob]

Did you seave the rotifer out? You cannot add the rotifer water into the hatch tank. They are very high in nutrients and possible some ammonia. I use a 50 micron seave to filter the rotifers out and only add rotifer to the tank, Do not add the water that was in the rotifer tank into the nursery tank.

Yes. But I also noticed that my rotifer density is way less than the desired 15 rotis per ML, which they are normally at in my cultures. Which is why I think I added way too much phytoplankton. I think my rotifers are not dense right now because of the temp swings of the garage recently...which should be corrected by bringing the cultures indoors.

[Mr Cob]

I see Minh, you don't add any phyto to the larvae tank and only feed enough rotifers for fry to eat but do not feed the rotifers. I was concerned that the rotifers would die and pollute the water...but looks like I polluted the water anyways with too much phytoplankton.

Thanks for your help.

[leliataylor]

I see Minh, you don't add any phyto to the larvae tank and only feed enough rotifers for fry to eat but do not feed the rotifers. I was concerned that the rotifers would die and pollute the water...but looks like I polluted the water anyways with too much phytoplankton.

Thanks for your help.

I also do not add any phyto to my larval tanks and only feed enough for my fry to consume in about a 2 hour period. Any uneaten food is siphoned off and the process starts over again in a couple more hours. This way I can keep them fed on enriched food and reduce the risk of bacterial contamination. The fry tanks are cleaned twice daily, cleaning the sides and bottom of the tanks and doing a 20% water change with each cleaning. All the water is run through a 50 micron filter pad, a UV, a skimmer that is rated for 160 gallons and the W/D filters are rated for 110 gallon tanks. All on two 15 gallon tubes per bank of tanks.

[Mr Cob]

That is serious right there. Thanks for sharing.

I mentioned earlier after setting up the fry tank that; "it feels like I'm just getting started"... And with the list of things I have to do, things to buy and set up still as well as learn and figure out, that statement couldn't be any further from the truth. AND to think I'm already about 6 months into this. Lol.

If anyone is considering breeding clownfish... Don't ever let anyone tell you breeding clownfish is easy. It's not. But it is fun. I think. o_O

Still have one baby swimming around. Hoping for the rest to hatch tonight, well the good ones anyways. A quarter of the eggs are cloudy but the ones that have constant aeration look awesome. I have 3 rigid airline tubes going with a slow 1 bubble per second moving them around.

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[OrionN]

Rob,
If you have just 3 bubbles per second, IMO, you got way too little air that aerate the eggs. I got one of the cheaper air stone to give coarse bubbles and got it going enough to cause circulation in my 5 g nursery tank. I have no problem with that much air/tank circulation. I have never try to hatch the eggs with so little flow but have no problem with the flow I have. I see if I can take a video or picture and will post it in a few minutes

[Mr Cob]

Thx Minh, I will post a vid too. The bubbles shake mist of the nest...not tiny micro bubbles from an airstone...big bubbles from a rigid airline tube.

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[OrionN]

This is the amount of air I use for the hatch. I have not change it or change water since the hatch about 9 days ago. The 'Fry all just finish with meta and all eat Otohime A at this point. I need to add algae and soem live rock tomorrow when I got some time.

20233

[Mr Cob]

Minh, do I need to keep the nest in darkness 24-7? I was thinking darkness really is just for the sides of the tank so the babies don't bang into their reflection in the glass? And of course so they think it's night time and hatch.

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[OrionN]

You just need to keep it in complete darkness for 3 hrs for the hatch.

I have tried to keep the light on after that and start to feed them right away, or just keep the light off until AM. Either way, there seem to be about 20% death rate that first night. All my eggs hatch within the 3 hrs period when the tank is in complete darkness.

I was told the keep the side cover for the first 7 days or so. I am not sure why, but have not try to do it without cover the side.

[Mr Cob]

Thank you Minh. I just increased the air, got the same feedback on another forum and my wife said the same as you. Seems everyone knew but me lol.

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[ducati996]

Good luck rob all lessons learned on this clutch next one will be even better

[Mr Cob]

Thanks dude. I will update in the morning. The one that hatched is still swimming around :)

Still have eggs that I haven't given up hope on yet. They still have silver eyes.

[ducati996]

Yeah hopefully the increased agitation will induce hatching I've heard people having problems with 2 day hatching

[leliataylor]

Hang in there, hopefully some of them will hatch soon and you have already learned so much. It will get easier as time goes on. If they were easy to raise you would be able to buy them at the LFS for the price of a guppy.

[OrionN]

Good luck. A fresh pair of eyes helps. You will get it down. Once you do, you will run out of room to raise fish.

[Mr Cob]

Thanks for the encouraging words.

Eggs still look the same, not sure what my next move is.

[OrionN]

Forget about how the eggs look next time. Next time don't move the eggs until 7 days. You can look, keep date and keep observation. Try to provide complete dardkness and plenty of water movement next time. I am sure it will be a great hatch next time.
I think darkness water movent and maturity of the eggs are keys. Next time you got all three well in hand and it will be great. I think the eggs are goner. If you take them out of the water, you will see all of them are covered with fuzz halo that killed them. At least that is what happen to my eggs

[Mr Cob]

Thanks for the info and help Minh. :) I'm looking forward to the next nest! Much learned this go around.

I was also thinking about cutting back on the mysis. I read that too much can make eggs difficult to hatch and I have been feeding frozen mysis every other day...but it is also in the Rod's food I feed. So maybe I just don't feed it soley since it's already in the RODs.

[leliataylor]

Hi Rob, IMHO I would not change the adults diet until you have verified it is a problem (others with more knowledge of clown rearing may chime in). Too many changes and it becomes impossible to rule out the causes of hatching failures. Reduce your phyto, improve your aeration and follow Minh's advice on waiting 7 days to pull the pot. If the next round of eggs don't hatch consider then consider altering the diet of the adults. There is always a lot of trial and error before you find the right combination for raising larval fish that works for you. As it was put to me several years ago, "get one piece of the puzzle wrong and you will loose, the key is getting all the puzzle pieces aligned correctly". At that time I didn't realize how darn many puzzle pieces there were.

Best of luck with your next nest and I will be following your progress. I do love clowns.

Best regards,

[Mr Cob]

Thanks for the advice.

I'm thinking though, that if I wait until day 7 I will miss the hatch..the one baby I do have hatched on day 6. Also, all of the other 3 nests hatched on day 6 and 7.

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[leliataylor]

We have found higher water temps accelerates hatching/ delivery. Even a 1' temp change can mean the difference in seahorse delivery buy 1-2 days.

[OrionN]

You can put a little night light on all night on the 6th day so that they won't get the darkness they needed to hatch. I never try this but it seem like a reasonable solution to this problem. My spawn hatch like clock work at 7 days at 83 degree. I guess I would not know if 1 or 2 hatch on the 6th day. If you miss some of the babies, likely it is a small number.

[Mr Cob]

Good point Minh. And my results line up with that. 1 baby came on day 6 and 6 babies on day 7. Maybe if I leave nest with pops until day 7 like you suggested I will have much better results as well as not feeding phyto to fry tank.

It isn't much to brag about but I have 7 little babies right now. : )

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[OrionN]

Even just a few babies, it is rewarding to see them grow

[Mr Cob]

Even just a few babies, it is rewarding to see them grow

You should see my wife and I, staring at clownfish fry lol. We watched another 8 hatch tonight!

So looks like we are up to 15 babies. : ). Three day hatch...that's a little crazy lol

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[ducati996]

Wow what did u have paired with her?

[OrionN]

15 is a great start.

Make sure your black paper is thick enough to block out all the light. I just cut cardboard and overlap them at the edge. I also cut a sheet of acrylic with a slot cut out for air and heater line in. On top of this I throw a thick dark bath tile. and clam the tile around the airline and heater line. Complete darkness. Re-evaluate your black paper tank cover. Maybe the crack let in some light or even black, the paper is too thin to block out all the light.

Good luck with the babies :)

[Mr Cob]

Thanks Minh, the black that I use is actually pond liner so no light is getting in. I can't wait for the next nest!

So...I had a rotifer culture crash. I have ordered more rotifers and paid for priority overnight so hopefully they get here in time. In the interim I have a very very low count of tiny rotifers and I purchased some frozen dead rotifers. Just hoping to keep them alive until I have rotifers in full swing again.

I also picked up a Seachem amonia alert strip and Seachem Prime. Hopefully I can keep the amonia in check since I added frozen rotifers. I know they probably won't eat the frozen rotifers but I have to try and I have managed to keep the dead food from settling on the bottom of the tank and I promise it looks like they are eating. Very active little fish. I can almost see them hunting. I think. I don't have much to compare to since this is my first rearing.

Top down right after adding frozen rotifers

http://youtu.be/J7bsKL-LVnM


Side view from my little cut out window (I close the window when I'm not viewing them)

http://youtu.be/KQMVkvEMtSQ

[OrionN]

If you want to drive to Corpus. I got about 5 gallon of rotifer culture that I am not using. You can have them all. I am not raising any more fry and my youngest is about 12 days and is eating Oto A. For only 15 babies, and crashed rotifer culture, you can just keep the water green and the rotifer will reproduce and feed the fish. You have to be diligent in keeping the water change and keep the tank water aerate well.
Let me know if you want to and have time to pick up my rotifer culture

[leliataylor]

Rob, if I was still raising rots I would be heading your way with a couple of gallons of live prey. Have you put out a SOS for live rots on MAAST? Most larval fish still retain some of their yolk sac for 24 hours which may sustain them. Watch your water parameters and use the Prime to block ammonia and nitrites. Your test kits will be useless in assessing what your water parameters really are. If you can get some Fritz Turbo Start 900 it will help in maintaining your water parameters if you have some biomedia in the tank. I sincerely doubt they will take the dead rots.

[OrionN]

There got to be somebody in SA with live rotifer. With just 15 babies, you don't need much but got to have some. Call me if needed. Good luck

[Mr Cob]

Thanks for all the help both of you. I'm so appreciative. If you ever need anything just let me know.

I did put a call out on MAAST earlier today but the pickings are slim to none. I do have baby rotifers from the culture restarting and just a few so I will do as you say Minh and add phyto and hope they keep going.



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[Mr Cob]

It is very nice to post a positive update on these little guys. I still have 15 fry :) as seen in the pic. But even better news is my wife just fed them and sent me a message that she counted 30!!!

I pray those rotifers I ordered get here soon!

I did a small water change lastnight since I'm feeding frozen rotifers. The water change was part new saltwater and part tank water from the tank they came from with the parents. I will do the same again tonight. I'm thinking my rotifer stash should be pumping again by tomorrow but in case it isn't I have live rotifers that will be here tomorrow.

Speaking life into these little dudes every chance I get.

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8125/8680629225_56fc7a50e6.jpg

[Mr Cob]

You can see 30 in this pic. The water is cloudy due to phytoplankton, so the ones that are not near the surface look like blurs.

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8385/8680860939_8cec969d1f_b.jpg

[hobogato]

that is great rob, hopefully your rotifers will get here soon.

[Mr Cob]

Thanks Ace, I love these little guys. lol We had 4 kids before, now we have 34!

[Scutterborn]

Man, if I had rotis, I'd be headed over now. Glad to hear you've got some real troopers in there! Prayers for y'all.


- Ben -

[texascwby430]

Rob,

I am so happy for you, can't wait to see your updates. I still want to be one of the first forever homes your little guys find....:wink_smile:

[OrionN]

Looking good. Keep us update

[Mr Cob]

Thanks for the comments everyone... babies are doing great and we finally have rotis! We purchased some from Live Aquaria. Was affordable and quick shipping. Normally I go through Reed Mariculture. My wife has been doing a great job keeping these fish alive during the day. :)

[Mr Cob]

Big Mama just laid a nice fat nest tonight. This is her 5th nest.

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[OrionN]

Did all 30 make it through the first few days?
Good job. BTW, don't try to collect too many babies. I am having a lot of problem with 500+. I wish I stop at about 200-300.

[Mr Cob]

Hey Minh, I count 3 left. I don't think the rotifers got here in time.

What sort of problems with that many babies Minh? Ammonia?


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[OrionN]

I am very sorry for the loss of the babies. Three is great. Keep them well.
I just don't have room for that many. Pretty soon I have to sleep in my dog house and I don't have a dog.
Imagine you have to raise 500 fish long enough to sale.
I think I can handle 100 easy once I have my fish room. 10 ten gal system all plumbed together and have about 10 fish in each. IMO that is the ideal way to raise them and get perfect babies. I have room to use 20 g tanks, then I increase my fish to 200 each time. I will raise them until they are old enough for sale before I start on a new group.

Using algae and change water frequently, I have no problem with ammonia in a 60 g tank with 350 babies. I have another group of almost 300 that is about reach 1/2 inch. I got babies coming our of my ears.

[Mr Cob]

Lol, that's awesome Minh. Thanks for some perspective.

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[leliataylor]

Hi Minh, that is one of the problems with raising larval fish. Once you perfect your skills you end up with so many fry and juveniles it becomes a daunting task to keep up with them and still maintain your adults. Fish do not understand birth control. Try to raise too many and you are doomed to failure.

[OrionN]

You just got to know or estimate how many fish you can take well care for and best stop short of that.

[Mr Cob]

Couple new broodstock pairs in the house..both the females are huge, about the same size as Big Mama the wild caught Onyx.


Platinum (Maine Blizzard, Sea and Reef lineage) X ORA Midnight
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7328/8719283746_033e9f30b3_c.jpg


Misbar Half Onyx (Sea and Reef lineage) X Black Ice (Sea and Reef Lineage)
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7324/8718169855_3302a37d3e_c.jpg

[Zack]

jiosnjfdsjnofjvnovjnvnnjvnfvnjnjj ZOMGZOMGZOMG

"Platinum (Maine Blizzard, Sea and Reef lineage) X ORA Midnight"

BEST PAIR EVER..

[Mr Cob]

lol, Yeah, I'm pretty stoked about that pair! The female is HUGE, hard to tell in pic because the pot is like 10" lol, I ran out of smaller pots and need to go pick some up. Can't wait for the midnight's face to turn ALL BLACK!

[Zack]

How much does a smaller ORA midnight go for?

[Mr Cob]

How much does a smaller ORA midnight go for?

I can never find them!

[OrionN]

GC Reef have two ORA midnight clowns for sale. I can't remember the price but it was not too expensive. I check the next time I am in there and let you guys know.

[Mr Cob]

GC Reef have two ORA midnight clowns for sale. I can't remember the price but it was not too expensive. I check the next time I am in there and let you guys know.

Awesome! My first pair of designer clownfish came from GC Reef, pair of onyx from their first clutch which was also from your pair Minh! I have been stuck on clowns ever since, and have always enjoyed purchasing from GC Reef, no other shop that I can think of compares in overall experience of both visiting and purchasing.

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[OrionN]

Theya re "Domino Clown" All black except a small white patch over the gills on both side, 125 each or the pair for 225.

[Mr Cob]

Theya re "Domino Clown" All black except a small white patch over the gills on both side, 125 each or the pair for 225.

Still very nice. I'm assuming ORA?

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[OrionN]

They are ORA

[Mr Cob]

Big mama is laying nest 6. I have about 10 fry left from nest 5. I'm getting a little better at this lol. My big issue has been rotifers, have 2 million arriving tomorrow : )

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[Scutterborn]

Big mama is laying nest 6. I have about 10 fry left from nest 5. I'm getting a little better at this lol. My big issue has been rotifers, have 2 million arriving tomorrow : )

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Make sure you count them to make sure they didn't short you!

:)


- Ben -

[Mr Cob]

Haha, I thought the same thing when I bought my first mil of rotifers... 1million, 2 million...who's to say...lol

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[OrionN]

So how are things? New babies?

[Mr Cob]

Hey Minh! Got a pull to make in a couple of days.


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[leliataylor]

I actually called Reed about something else and advised them I was 257 short on the 2 mil they sent me. It was intended as a joke, however they actually offered to send me more free of charge. Needless to say I advised them it was joke and there was no need to send me more. LOL

[Mr Cob]

Hahaha! I was wanting to do that too. Lol! That's awesome!

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[Mr Cob]

I pulled big mamas nest tonight and the eggs are hatching right now.

I made a rookie mistake though and kind of forgot about them... I was supposed to pull lastnight and my wife even pointed out the silver eyes to me and I just got caught up doing other things.

As a result most of the eggs hatched lastnight.. got about a hundred though, hoping they all hatch. :)

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[Mr Cob]

Some vids of onyx picasso fry 9 (rotifers are in full force now)

Before feeding: (view in HD for better quality)

http://youtu.be/3ZtC-ziXy1k

After feeding rotifers:

http://youtu.be/dnDsuYV1WMc

[OrionN]

It looks like you got a few fry and a few rotifers :shades:. I am glad that they hatched well for you. Keep us update.

[hobogato]

isn't this the most rewarding and fun thing you have ever done regarding reefkeeping? i am looking forward to raising some more myself and in my classroom next year.

[Mr Cob]

It looks like you got a few fry and a few rotifers :shades:. I am glad that they hatched well for you. Keep us update.

Yup! I feel like we got over that hill... and have a lot of hope now. I was starting to get a little discouraged to be honest.. but so Awesome seeing all the little fish swimming around hunting down rotifers.



isn't this the most rewarding and fun thing you have ever done regarding reefkeeping? i am looking forward to raising some more myself and in my classroom next year.

For sure Ace. Really, nothing has compared to this experience. I'm hooked and cannot wait to get our first clutch through metamorphosis which is this weekend I believe. Kind of funny saying "we" now. It has always been "I", but my wife has really joined in on this little adventure and is a huge help. She feeds them throughout the day and is so gentle with them and caring for each little fishie. Lol.

Thx for the comments guys.




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[hobogato]

it takes a village rob :) yeah, christy was the daytime shift when i was raising them at home - it really would be a difficult thing without help (not saying it was easy even with help)

[OrionN]

They are a lot of fun. I had the same problem. Did not have enough rotifers the first time and lost a lot of the babies. Once you got it running you will get too many babies.
I just started to get income from my first babies. So far just barely enough to cover the investment into these little guys.

[Mr Cob]

For real, I knew this was going to be a lot of time and money but I had no idea just how much time and money...lol!!!!!



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[leliataylor]

I am curious. At what age do you transition them to larger prey and what is your food source? Are you going to us pods or transition them them directly to NHBBS?

[Mr Cob]

I am curious. At what age do you transition them to larger prey and what is your food source? Are you going to us pods or transition them them directly to NHBBS?

I'm doing fry/larvae first tank on live rotis without sponge filter until after metamorphosis. After day 20 I will transition to otohime dry first food and a couple days later moving to new tanks with sponge filters and transition to otohime only.

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[Mr Cob]

Updates on the onyx x onyx picasso pair

-nest 6 is 8 days old and shld be starting metamorphosis (about 60 babies). I feed a very dense population of live rotifers twice daily and dose .5 ml of rotigrow once daily. I water changed about 20% of tank water from their parent's tank on day 3, 5 and then daily. Once they are on dry food I will water change with new saltwater. I also use prime to keep ammonia down.

-nest 7 was laid on the 23rd (yesterday evening)

Rotifers: 2 x 5 gallon buckets doing great and fed 2.5ml of rotigrow daily. Very dense cultures.


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[OrionN]

I feed with rotifer for 3 weeks or so but start about 1 week I add otohime A1 Just a little at first until I see them all eating. Even with this I continue to feed rotifer. I have a fairly dense growth of Macroalgale in the fry tank. I also add a few LR with multiple bristle worms in the fry tank. They eat any extra food the clown babies do not eat. The algae keep nitrate down to non detectable level.