Resolution of recent issues

[hobogato]

Recent turmoil and growing pains within our organization have disrupted our community and cast a shadow over the mission and operation of our organization. Some of this turmoil was handled inappropriately because of inadequate guidelines for member conduct and board member action. We, the Board of Directors, who are here to serve this organization, apologize for these issues and have taken steps to ensure that they do not occur again.

Our organization is growing rapidly and with that growth comes change. These changes will improve the website and focus of MAAST so we can concentrate on reaching our goals and moving forward. One of the exciting directions includes more guest speakers who are innovators and experts in the marine hobby as well as the scientific community. Another goal in the near future of MAAST is to secure a bid for MACNA. We have many other goals and community outreach programs in the planning stages as well.

In order to accomplish these goals and continue to improve our organization, we will need the help of all the membership. We as a community need to rally around our enthusiasm for our hobby and the marine ecosystem. With this cooperation, we can build on the great foundation of this organization laid down by its founders and take it to new levels even they never thought possible.

Respectfully,

MAAST Board of Directors



These changes can be veiwed in the amendment section of the bylaws here (http://www.maast.org/forums/showthread.php?t=20509)

[kaiser]

This BOD is out of control and only uses this club to further his own agenda.

Nowhere in the by-Laws does it state that this club has been created to bring MACNA to town. Yet that is all this club seems to hinge on and that's why the BOD wants more people to sign up to have more money for the BID, or should I call it "SEED MONEY", for MACNA, which runs in thousands.


The BOD says it's not us vs them, yet their action clearly show otherwise with the recent changes to the by-laws without letting the charter membership vote on it. There are 12 people there that can and will change the rules to fit their agenda without having to answer to anybody. I for one won't stand for it.

I've had enough please delete my user account.

[Kristy]

I was just thinking what reasonable and responsible changes those were to the by-laws. I almost didn't comment on it because I failed to see how it would be very controversial, but then thought that it's better to go ahead and express your support than to stay silent.

Thanks for all the time and energy I am sure it took to draft those into place, as well as the day to day management of this organization.

[RayAllen]

I was just thinking what reasonable and responsible changes those were to the by-laws. I almost didn't comment on it because I failed to see how it would be very controversial, but then thought that it's better to go ahead and express your support than to stay silent.

Thanks for all the time and energy I am sure it took to draft those into place, as well as the day to day management of this organization.

Ditto

[LoneStar]

I've had enough please delete my user account.

nice not knowing ya.... bye bye

[villjr]

nice not knowing ya.... bye bye

Come on, there's no need for that type of response. That is what starts arguments and turns threads into shouting matches.

[hobogato]

This BOD is out of control and only uses this club to further his own agenda.

if this is meant to be a comment about me personally, i'm sorry you feel that way, but although i agree with them, these policies were not written by me. they were even written to include suggestions made by you about not giving one person the power to close a thread alone.

[BIGBIRD123]

The success of MAAST is my agenda, too.

[Richard]

This BOD is out of control and only uses this club to further his own agenda.

Nowhere in the by-Laws does it state that this club has been created to bring MACNA to town. Yet that is all this club seems to hinge on and that's why the BOD wants more people to sign up to have more money for the BID, or should I call it "SEED MONEY", for MACNA, which runs in thousands.


The BOD says it's not us vs them, yet their action clearly show otherwise with the recent changes to the by-laws without letting the charter membership vote on it. There are 12 people there that can and will change the rules to fit their agenda without having to answer to anybody. I for one won't stand for it.

I've had enough please delete my user account.


I thought your previous complaints/questioning about certain threads being closed, etc. were not out of line. Not because of some malicious intent by the BOD but because the rules didn't seem clear. Now they are trying to address those issues (raised primarily by you) and your ripping them for that too. :confused::confused::confused::confused:

[bigmoe21]

What is kaisers problem? that dude needs to chill..wouldnt the MACNA thing benefit EVERYBODY whether everyone voted or not? theres no need to get all bent out of shape for nothing...not everything is a personal attack against you..im sure the board tries to only IMPROVE this group..not shoot it and the people who support it down like kaiser is trying to

[captexas]

Wow, the first thread to announce new rules about banning people for publicly criticizing others or the BOD could result with someone being banned. Of course he asked to have his account deleted so no one had to pull the trigger on that one. :whew:

[bigmoe21]

itd be sweet, sweet irony..right?

[kaiser]

If you want to bring MACNA here, fine bring it to a vote, let EVERYBODY decide on that. Disclose any and all information on it to include exactly how much money it is going to take and where that money is going to be coming from.
Changes to the By-Laws should be put up to a vote by the paying membership. The BOD are to write them up explain them and put them for a simple yes or no vote. The things that got changed so far only help the BOD to choke out those that don't agree with them.
Case and point.
I receive a threatening PM from a Board Member, now under the new rules I am not allowed to post them, instead I am supposed to bring it to another member of the BOD attention. So what if the BOD sticks together and where does that leave the issue at hand?
As it stands the BOD has limitless powers and that I have a real problem with.

[Richard]

What exactly is your problem with the new bylaws? Why don't you go copy them and then edit them to be the bylaws according to you. Seriously, I would like to see how you would change them.

[captexas]

itd be sweet, sweet irony..right?

I don't see how banning members would be "sweet" in any way. It's really sad that we can no longer openly discuss issues/grievances in a civilized fashion. We don't need more rules on ways to ban people, we need rules and means that allow for better communication and openness by all sides. In the end, if a person gets banned, it should be for they way they presented their arguments, not simply because they chose to argue with you. Hopefully the new rules will be enforced in that manner.

[bigmoe21]

well cap...this guy is relentlessly hurting the group by bringing down the people put in charge to keep it functioning..i know you have a lot of history with the group but PROGRESS is the keyword my good man..those that try to hinder progress only prolong it because whether or not you like it changes occur and they occur for the improvement of the majority..theres just no pleasing everybody never has been and never will.

[captexas]

LOL, I'm running now! :ph34r: Not taking sides at this point.

[RayAllen]

We pay $25 for a yearly membership. Roughly $2.08 a month. How does that pay for $1000's of dollars of anything. Meetings with food, popular guest speakers, prizes..... Now thats where the $$ goes. That all benfits us. Id say 99.9% of us want MACNA here in SA. That is a huge deal that we can all benefit from.

[captexas]

well cap...this guy is relentlessly hurting the group by bringing down the people put in charge to keep it functioning..i know you have a lot of history with the group but PROGRESS is the keyword my good man..those that try to hinder progress only prolong it because whether or not you like it changes occur and they occur for the improvement of the majority..theres just no pleasing everybody never has been and never will.

I understand progress and change, I work for a mega corporation and get it handed to me everyday! LOL I also understand this is a new BOD and that even though there may be a trip up here and there, that overall they are working to make MAAST better. I also understand the need to stop aggressive situations/people, I just hope the new rules to stop that aren't used stop public discussion by those that chose to remain civil about it. That was my point in my comment.

[hobogato]

I understand progress and change, I work for a mega corporation and get it handed to me everyday! LOL I also understand this is a new BOD and that even though there may be a trip up here and there, that overall they are working to make MAAST better. I also understand the need to stop aggressive situations/people, I just hope the new rules to stop that aren't used stop public discussion by those that chose to remain civil about it. That was my point in my comment.

these amendments were made with exactly your concerns in mind. we are not trying to take away the right to free speech here, we just wanted to clarify the rules on things that seemed to be in question.

[bigmoe21]

haha i understand..im not saying i want there to be a totalitarian bod put in charge im just saying..sometimes people just dont change or dont want change...sometimes you just gotta go with the flow..not that maast is a mega corp. but would anything get done if those in charge worried about the one or two people that wouldnt like the decisions they made?..whats important is trying to always do whats best for the GROUP

I understand progress and change, I work for a mega corporation and get it handed to me everyday! LOL I also understand this is a new BOD and that even though there may be a trip up here and there, that overall they are working to make MAAST better. I also understand the need to stop aggressive situations/people, I just hope the new rules to stop that aren't used stop public discussion by those that chose to remain civil about it. That was my point in my comment.

[bigmoe21]

yeah but he automatically assumes because everyone didnt get to vote..the bod has an evil agenda to do what they please and whats best for them..thats where he is acting irrational

[captexas]

these amendments were made with exactly your concerns in mind. we are not trying to take away the right to free speech here, we just wanted to clarify the rules on things that seemed to be in question.

Thanks Ace. I know you and the other BOD have our club's best interests in mind overall. We've had a few stumbles in the past 2 months, but I know if we all stay level headed it will all work out.

Hey, anyone notice it's Friday? And it's after 5pm? Let's have some fun and enjoy our hobby. Have a great weekend everyone!

[cpreefguy]

Ya'll are missing the point, Kaiser is upset because the members werent included in the bod's ammendments to the by-laws, at least thats the way I read it.

"the recent changes to the by-laws without letting the charter membership vote on it. There are 12 people there that can and will change the rules to fit their agenda without having to answer to anybody. I for one won't stand for it. "

<<< From the By Laws:
Article IX – Amendments
Section 1. Amendments
Paragraph 1: These by-laws may be amended by a seventy-five percent vote of the Board of Directors.
Paragraph 2: Amendments to these by-laws shall take effect immediately and the membership shall be notified.

[erebus]

Ok I've stayed quiet throughout the whole situation, since I'm a new BOD. I volunteered to help the club in anyway possible. Now that I see the backend, it amazes me how much work the BOD do to make this club the best it can be. I had no idea! I will leave it at that. If anyone wants to pm and ask me anything, please do.

[captexas]

<<< From the By Laws:
Article IX – Amendments
Section 1. Amendments
Paragraph 1: These by-laws may be amended by a seventy-five percent vote of the Board of Directors.
Paragraph 2: Amendments to these by-laws shall take effect immediately and the membership shall be notified.


That quoted section is in the new post by Mike (Texreefer), not in the original section posted in 2007 in that By-laws thread. Those rules are in the "Amendment" section so they were not in the original by-laws. I'm not into the conspiracy idea here or anything like that right now, but I can see someone seriously questioning a sudden new rule granting the BOD the ability to freely create rules however they want without the charter members having a say so. Again, not into any conspiracy stuff, but I think it is somewhat questionable if that rule was just now placed into the books.

[BIGBIRD123]

The quoted section is the last part of the old by-laws. The reason he put those in his post was a preamble to the new amendments, thus to show where they were added. That quote is the last part of the original 2007 by-laws. In order to show what we did, we had to show where it came from.

Chris,
I promise you this...we will never take our position for granted nor will we try and pull a fast one. Everything we do for the majority. We have no "hidden agenda".What we want to do is put Maast on the lips of ALL in the reefing society. Please feel free to give us any suggestions that you have and we will take them in account as we do others. We do have some openings on a few committees.

Thank you for your input...

Steve

[captexas]

Steve -
Understood. I wasn't implying any hidden agenda or anything, just suggesting how someone could have read more into it as it seemed Kaiser may have done with one of his arguments. I believe in some conspiracies around the world, but not here on MAAST. Thanks to you and the others for working through this.

[BIGBIRD123]

Chris,
Agreed and I wasn't implicating you but their were others that considered us to have one. This is why we came forward with ALL of this to get it simplified and decisive. I can only hope that everyone can see the passion the this BOD has for MAAST. I (We) really do appreciate your input. Any chances you helping on a committee?

Thanks,
Steve

[SABOB]

Today I paid for a membership after lurking for a few years.All the recent "issues" reminded me of my family.I didn't always agree with my parents but was allowed to discuss situations if done with respect for all involved.If discussions got out of hand,my Dad ( Army Officer ) would stop all involved until everyone cooled down.Nothing positive comes from negative comments.Or as my Mom would say " If you don't have anything nice to say,don't say anything at all."

[captexas]

Chris,
Any chances you helping on a committee?

When does the MAAST Debate Team start? LOL :bigsmile: :shades:

[MKCindy]

The bottom line, we don't elect the president of the USA by popular vote. We hope our elected officials vote as promised. Just like our BOD represent the best interest of the majority.

I don't want to tie up monthly meetings with debates/voting on parliamentary issues, by-laws, or amendments. (been there/done that)

We are not a multi-million dollar corporation, this is not a investment and I'm not sweating where my whopping $25 a year goes.

This is a Club... as in fun, relax, hobby, enjoy. I get more than $25 worth of great info each year. So lets lighten up and look forward to some great meetings.

[BigKGlen]

AMEN Sister!

[brewercm]

If you want to bring MACNA here, fine bring it to a vote, let EVERYBODY decide on that. Disclose any and all information on it to include exactly how much money it is going to take and where that money is going to be coming from.
Changes to the By-Laws should be put up to a vote by the paying membership. The BOD are to write them up explain them and put them for a simple yes or no vote. The things that got changed so far only help the BOD to choke out those that don't agree with them.
Case and point.
I receive a threatening PM from a Board Member, now under the new rules I am not allowed to post them, instead I am supposed to bring it to another member of the BOD attention. So what if the BOD sticks together and where does that leave the issue at hand?
As it stands the BOD has limitless powers and that I have a real problem with.

I'm glad this has been civil and thanks all for the input. I did want to respond to this and I may be the only person on the BOD that does know Kaiser at a personal level.

The problem with having the members all vote on this is it'll never get done if we left it that way. Whenever there is a meeting, event, or anything else there may be a total of five or six people that step up to help out. There was even less at the last large Sea World event if I remember correctly. There is no hidden agenda and bringing MACNA would only be good for everyone in the club. If a few don't see it that way then when will be the next time you'd get to go to one of these without having to pay the other expensies envolved with the travel. If we do by chance get it here we will need major help from many members to make it happen. There is no way twelve members of the BOD will be able to pull this all together with the work that would be involved.

Thanks again for keeping this discussion civil and any input is always appreciated, well mostly.:wink_smile:

[beareef19]

I vote Chris for CAPTAIN of the DEBATE TEAM ............................. LMAO

Barry

[tomanero]

On another topic since this seems to be where everyones attention is:
Will tomorrows' meeting be on regardless of the weather?

and if the meeting is on what type of cheese should I bring? (since we seem to already have more than enough whine)

LIGHTEN UPPPPP

[Texreefer]

That quoted section is in the new post by Mike (Texreefer), not in the original section posted in 2007 in that By-laws thread. Those rules are in the "Amendment" section so they were not in the original by-laws. I'm not into the conspiracy idea here or anything like that right now, but I can see someone seriously questioning a sudden new rule granting the BOD the ability to freely create rules however they want without the charter members having a say so. Again, not into any conspiracy stuff, but I think it is somewhat questionable if that rule was just now placed into the books.

Cap, It sounds here like you are "seriously Questioning" my character, since my name was used. Are you Implying that I added an ammendments section with rules that would allow us to add ammendments? This is not a sudden new rule.. I can assure your I read, along with the other BOD members, the entire set of bylaws to make sure we were following the rules. The Ammendments section was indeed already there. This is the first time the BOD has used that right to ACTUALLY add any ammendments. And it was done so because of the very questions YOU and others raised.. IT is sad the the board has to constantly defend themselves for volunteering to help the members of this club.
the ammendments do not say that we will silence open discussion,, read them again,,, they make the rules clear about PERSONAL attacks and Inciting Imflamitory remarks..

I am going to Nominate you CHRIS, as a Moderator and let the Charter members vote to have you come aboard as a moderator,,and when they approve it will you be up to the challenge or will you let us do the job that we VOLUNTEERED to do?

I value your opinion but it seems like your hastened remarks are misplaced!


one last thing about My post in the by laws, and you may remember this,, there is a character limit when you post, which is why there are several entries for the bylaws, I moved the ammendments section to its own page so it would all fit!,,,, there is no conspriacy!

[greenmako]

I have been trying to find the original copy of the by laws and I finally found it

By Laws (http://www.maast.org/images/documents/by_laws.htm)

[captexas]

Mike -
If you choose to read the other posts in this thread instead of just coming to the first one with your name in it and getting overly excited and jumping to conclusions, you will see that Steve already clarified the issue and that on several occassions I stated wasn't implying anything. Seriously, you and some of the others need to lighten up. If you read all of my posts, you see that I have even tried to mellow things out at times. I don't understand why you feel so threatened and have to lash out. I'm not the one who started the tyrade after Ace started this thread. That was Kaiser. Oops, I mentioned someone's name, hopefully they don't take that as a personal attack like you did.

Again, as I stated I don't know how many times now, no implications, no conspiracy theories, and no questioning anyone's character. If you want to make me a moderator, go ahead, but under the new rules I would have to send you a warning right now! LOL :bigsmile:

Is it the weather or what that's got us all cranky lately? I can't wait for spring/summer!

[greenmako]

I declare Vitrual Spring
http://emiliewood.com/photos/june2005/7-june-05-flower.jpg

now everyone go smell the virtual flower

[MissT]

Is it scratch and sniff? I tried but didn't smell anything...:confused:

[Sherri]

Is it scratch and sniff? I tried but didn't smell anything...:confused:

And that's a good thing....:wink_smile:

[Sherri]

Depends on what you scratched..

Think we were thinking the same....:lauging:

[MissT]

LOL... breaking the tension: priceless :bigsmile:

[captexas]

now everyone go smell the virtual flower


Now does anyone know how to remove scratch marks from an LCD monitor?

:D:bighug:

[MissT]

LOL I think someone on here has a brother's uncle's cousin's dog's former owner that knows EXACTLY how to fix it

[tony]

i am interested in said flower, please post an asking price and are you willing to part it out?

[MissT]

He might meet you halfway, and never show up... I wonder if he has any vicious for sale; someone recommended it and I haven't been able to find any:what_smile:

[Richard]

So it looks like you granted Kaisers request. I notice erikharrison's user account appears the same as kaiser's does. Did he ask to be removed also over this stuff?

[tony]

So it looks like you granted Kaisers request. I notice erikharrison's user account appears the same as kaiser's does. Did he ask to be removed also over this stuff?


sad enough, yes he did

[envy]

misti does the shark ever catch the smiley face or does he at least reach land:D

[MissT]

you have to watch and see

[cpreefguy]

misti does the shark ever catch the smiley face or does he at least reach land:D
Actually neither. Apparently the shark was attracted to the color yellow, and became interested in this person during the chase:
http://www.fishingfury.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/07/shark-kayak.jpg

[MissT]

inset description: the understatement of the century

[envy]

you have to watch and see

haven't slept in 3 days waiting to see what happens:hypnotyized:

[txstateunivreefer]

Ok this is for everyone that frequents MAAST.

I started in the world of marine aquaria about halfway through college and when I started, I did not know anything about or of MAAST, it is a great organization of knowledgeable individuals who enjoy the hobby and enjoy spreading their knowledge and experience with others. I started out with a 29 gallon tank with the worst economy equipment that I got ripped off on from a store in San Marcos (if you live there you know where I am talking about) then I found out about MAAST when I did it immediately started to pay off. Everyone on the site then and NOW was/are there to help others and to learn new things.
Recently I have noticed a change. I have only been a charter member for a year and before that, I was a web member. I do not know why a conflict has started between web and charter members. To the web members all I can say is that even though I have moved 200 miles away and will most likely never make it to another meeting, I will keep paying my dues. Why because the 25 bucks I give a year I owe big time because without MAAST I would have been hundreds of dollars in the hole through lost livestock and dishonest or unknowledgeable salespeople. On top of that, I even got a member discount. I will be honest and say that a lot of the time I shopped at aquadome before they were a sponsor; however, I did so because of their competitiveness with other retailers. MAAST is a great community, one that I am sure that you have gotten something for you do not have to pay dues it is up to you but I feel as though it is rewarding especially since I got to go to the zoo for a private party for free. And I do want to apologize about something which is that I am sorry that folks are pushy about the dues issue, I don’t know why you feel you don’t want to pay it that is your personal reason however keep in mind why most of us are here in the first place, and think the people are here to help you and maybe by asking you to join they are simply trying to help.

Charter Members- there are some things that we must do to keep this club running, first of all keep all of the good information coming I know that in the future I will need some more of it from someone. I know that some of us are and are not happy with the BOD and after reading through the bylaws I see one thing that is lacking which I will address.
In the bylaws in Article V, section 7 Which is the termination of a membership to the board there is only one way out and I propose another which is a two-thirds vote from all members in good standing to remove a member from the board. This only removes them from the board this will take care of some of the concerns listed above of the BOD’s sticking together.
Now BOD’s I have met some to all of you at some time at a meeting or I have seen you, I have also received advice that has saved my butt several times, this suggestion I have for the by laws is neither a threat nor a proposal for any of you to step down. In my opinion you are all doing a great job, as for improvements I can say that as a suggestion Steve (BigBird123) as the president, we need your leadership, not to say that you are not doing a good job, or that you are a bad person, but this thread should have been started by you, not Ace. I believe that major changes such as this should be your announcement that way as they say it “The Buck Stops Here”. With the suggestion to the by laws none of you should feel threatened by it whatsoever look at Aces poll when he was under fire I think majority spoke then and they will again if needed. I am thankful for the work you do and if I didn’t move I would have been gunning for your position because I believe in the mission of this club, and I am proud to be a member and to make fish store workers mad when I tell them about the site and that it would be crazy to put fish in the tank that they are buying that day.

As for MANCA, I think that if we could get a bid it would be an amazing event for MAAST, the publicity would really help the hobby locally and would allow MAAST to grow exponentially. How you ask (for those who are skeptical) when a trade show or event comes to town, I would expect some folks out of curiosity to join in and since they live here and get into the addictive hobby, they will join and MAAST will grow. The final thing I have to say is absolutely do not take this club for granted, I live in Bay City now with my tank, the nearest store or reef club is 100 mi away. I miss the meetings, I miss the friends, please try to recognize the common goal we all have, and instead of tearing things down let us try to fix it and make things better. Please follow my example and provide positive constructive criticism and RESPECTFUL suggestions.

Respectfully,
Chris Rugaard

[Texreefer]

.

In the bylaws in Article V, section 7 Which is the termination of a membership to the board there is only one way out and I propose another which is a two-thirds vote from all members in good standing to remove a member from the board. This only removes them from the board this will take care of some of the concerns listed above of the BOD’s sticking together.

Respectfully,
Chris Rugaard

Chris thank you for your suggestions,,concerning what you have said above,, we have addressed this issue.. the following is from Article IX, Section 2 paragraph 2..

"b. The same process will be followed if a board member is the one in question. The board will review the issues at hand and (using the Board Rules of Conduct)
Will determine if any wrongdoing has occurred. If in fact the rules of conduct have not been followed, the board member will be given a public vote of charter members as to dismissal or reinstatement to the board. The vote will remain open for 1 week and A simple majority decides."

[txstateunivreefer]

Whoops Missed that part lots of legal stuff to read through, sorry about that part i retract that suggestion