SPS polyp extension?

[TAXMAN]

Ok. For as long as I have had reef tanks I've had this issue. On my sps corals the polyps have great extension for a week or 2 and then the polyps only come out enough to see thier color. Even my toadstoll leather does this. It actually gets the polyps out but it doesnt get that little flowering on the tips. But everything grows and looks fine in color. What could be doing this?

Now ask for all the parameters which I will be testing later and dont have right now.

But Ca is 420 and Alk is around 7.0 which I'm working on getting it back up. Salintity is 1.025 Each time I test for Ammonia, Nitrate and Nitrites they are zero.

10 Gallon water change per week.

My Oceanic skimmer doesnt produce anything at all, so I want a new skimmer. Ace, want to build me a fuge and skimmer? I only have 4 fish so the load is small. I feed once daily for the fish. Feed Phyto and Zooplankton rarely. Use coral vite and coral excel about once a week. Most corals are frags and I only have a few small colonies. So that load is pretty small right now too.

Tank is a 110 reef ready oceanic with about 200+ lbs live rock, been running a few months now, and time has never made a difference on any of my tanks.

Lights are 2-250w MH with 20k's and a 660 VHO with 2-10K's. All are new bulbs. MH on about 12hrs a day and I reduced the VHO to 6 hrs a day to see if that helps.

Temp ranges from 76-80 with light cycles.

Circulation right now is the return pump which may be about 1200 gph. I'll get that info too. And a Hydro #4 with another #4 on the way with a Seio controller for them to run on.

So, any ideas? Anyone want to stop by that lives close and check it out for me? There might be some $$ in it for you. ;)

[TAXMAN]

Well I have the #4 flowing pretty much dead aim and a couple of acros and they wont extend. The one acro and a green slimer looked great and then started pulling back. I have it really at more of a glancing blow so I dont blast them too hard. But I know the couple of acros should have plenty of flow to them right now. I've seen lots of great looking tanks and corals that have less flow for sure.

[TAXMAN]

Yea, thats why I did the glancing blow on them for now. I ordered another #4 today and the seio controller so it will help with the random flow pattern. I'll then do more if needed for sure. I always wanted a nice polyp extended flowing tank.

[JimD]

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=15094f6d8d2dbab1eb12100393dfc12c& threadid=1092648

Heres a good thread that discusses the topic of polyp extention, especialy "smcnaly's" entry. Ive mentioned before that super polyp extention is not always a good thing, It was met with resistance and disbeliefe due to inexperience and lack of research.

[blueboy]

interesting link to the article about PE(or lack thereof) and a possible relationship with dwarf angels.

[TAXMAN]

Cool. I have a dwarf rusty angel and never see him nip at anything at all. So I might be getting rid of it to see what happens. I like the polyps extended a little at least. I think they look better that way.

[hobogato]

you might catch the angel and put it in the sump for a week or two to make sure before you get rid of him.

[TAXMAN]

I doubt I could get him out of the sump. It's a wet dry thats hard to get in to. But good idea.

[Enigma13]

I have definitely seen a decrease in the PE of certain SPS in my tank since adding a flame angel, though I have never seen him nip any coral. Other SPS in my tank is having normal PE, so there could be other factors involved.

[JimD]

Some acros only fully extend their polyps at night when the lights are off, check the ones in question then.

[TAXMAN]

None of the SPS I have open at all. I actually have a few loosing some color as well. I have one that still has good color at the bottom of the coral that in it's own shade. All the polyps that get light are now white. Should be green. Also a green slimer that is now more of a pale green or greenish yellow. I am thinking it's a light issue of some kind.

[JimD]

Could be a light issue, whats your lighting? Any parameter issues lately?

[TAXMAN]

Lights are 2-250w MH with 20k's and a 660 VHO with 2-10K's. All are new bulbs. MH on about 12hrs a day and I reduced the VHO to 6 hrs a day to see if that helps.

No issues.

[JimD]

I guess my next question is, what kind of corals are you having problems with? Also, you say 'as long as youve had reef tanks, Ive had this issue', There has to be something going on, can you post a good pic of a coral in question? Certain species of acros have very little or no polyp extention, ie: Turaki, Echinata, Loripe, etc. bur if youre having issues with things like Millepora or Prostrata, you have something going on.

[TAXMAN]

Even the Milli's dont extend any longer. So I know somethings wrong. I need someone to come by and get this tank right with me learning at the same time. I use RO/DI water that test at 0 on my tds meter. I'll try to get pictures up soon. I know that might help.

Anyone want to help? :)

[TAXMAN]

photos, I couldnt get them small enough to put them on here. So heres the links. I'm also testing everything today and a water change after. Hope this helps. I also noticed that right when the MH turned on I had a little polyp extension. But that goes away after a while I guess. I never get to see it in the am.

milli today
http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d121/LMRACER20/redmillisuperman.jpg

Slimer today
http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d121/LMRACER20/slimer5-26.jpg

tri-color today
http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d121/LMRACER20/tri-color.jpg

4-6-2007
http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d121/LMRACER20/4-6-2007.jpg

today
http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d121/LMRACER20/5-26-2007.jpg

[werp]

Did you figure out what the problem was?

[TAXMAN]

Not yet. The coral in the last 2 photos is now dieng off on the bottom. Need to get it figured out though.

[Bill S]

If you use photobucket, use the last of the 3 "links" they provide you, and it will imbed the photo.

How old are your lights?

[TAXMAN]

all bulbs were new. Now about 2 months old.

[Bill S]

Hmm. About the time you started having problems? What kind are they? I see from the first post they are 20Ks. That might be the problem, what did you have before that?

Also, I'd do a complete test on your system - what kind of hydrometer are you using and are you sure it's accurate. If you're nitrates are zero - what kit are you using for testing. I use Salifert, and it allows for very low level testing. If your nitrates are 0.00, then you aren't producing any waste... When someone tells me that their nitrates are zero, it tends to make me wonder. Another thought is that they might be starving? If your skimmer isn't producing, & you're feeding only rarely? BTW, mine are always over 10 - I try and keep them 15 or under.

[hobogato]

If your nitrates are 0.00, then you aren't producing any waste... When someone tells me that their nitrates are zero, it tends to make me wonder. Another thought is that they might be starving? If your skimmer isn't producing, & you're feeding only rarely?

that is kinda what i was thinking also bill, if you look at those pics, those rocks are spotless - looks too clean to me. maybe up your feeding slowly and see what happens.

[TAXMAN]

I use Salifert kits. Also the skimmer doesnt produce anything at all for the last few weeks. I'll start feeding the corals more. The rocks are pretty clean due to this is a fairly new tank. It's just now starting to get corraline growing on the glass. The rock was mostly llive rock when it was set up with the rest being base rock. Most of which was swapped over from my other tanks. The bubls are as listed on the first post. Color seems to be coming back a little but that green coral is sluffing off and dieing on the bottom and inside areas.

I'm going to do another water test tonight and see what everything is.

[hobogato]

three things come to mind when a coral is dying at the base:

1. high phosphates
2. low alkalinity
3. AEFW (lets hope this isnt the case)

[TAXMAN]

It's only the one coral. Looks like low light areas but I dont know.

[TAXMAN]

Ok. The tests are complete

Salinity 1.025 with Refractometer.
Water temp 78 on digital , 80 on mechanical.

These are Salifert tests.
Ca 370
Alk 6.0 DKH
Ammonia 0
Nitrite 0
Mg 1350
Iodine-Iodate 0 Clear

Red Sea tests
Phosphate 0
Nitrite 0-2.5 Was in between 2 colors.

[hobogato]

that is pretty low on the alkalinity - i usually keep mine around 10 to 12 dKh. calcium could come up a bit too.

[TAXMAN]

HAvent dosed ca in a few days so it is low. I keep it about 420. Will get the Alk up. Been using the home made brew but I might change to the B-Ionic again. Hopefully I'll have a Calc reactor tonight for it. New Top off and Aquacontroller real soon. I'm going to be like a pro reefer. :) Hopefully I can have the pro reefer tank too.

[DSAfanatic]

Hey, did you ever get any better polyps extension? I did a search for PE and found this post. Let me know what you found out. I'm having similar issues.