Curing LR

[ramsey]

I know there's a ton of different methods in this hobby for various things and everyone develops their own methods. However, how do you like to cure live rock? I know the way most people do it is to just drop it I'm SW with a heater and PH and wait until NO3 is all gone. No light, no water changes. Personally, I've never understood why it was done this way. What I like to do is run short light cycles, add bacteria if NO3 is really high and do small water changes. To me, you bought live rock because you want life on your rock. By doing this, I think you better preserve the life. What do you guys do and why?

[Southern Flame]

We cycled our tank with live rock and ran the system till the params were balanced at 0 and water changes to get the nitrate down then started adding beginner fish and corals and now we just keep up with our weekly water changes. The reason we done/do it that way is because that's how I was taught by my dad :-) we ran the system as you would for fish and corals also lights heater and all even set up the fuge when we started the tank

[jrossjr79]

When I cycled my tank, I cycled the LR with it, the way I did was with no water changes, I did keep the lights on for about 2 - 3 hours a day, no rhyme or reason other than for the benefit of the small COC I had in the tank when I bought it. I used a deli shrimp to start off the cycle, seems to work good for me. SO I think it is something I personally will stick to.

[ramsey]

I've always read/heard about the "no water change" thing when curing. What's the rationale behind that? Is it just so your ammonia stays high enough to ensure a cycle? I've heard people say that water changes will make the cycle last longer too, but again, I'm not sure why. If your ammonia is over 2PPM, I don't see why a water change would hurt.

[Southern Flame]

I think it has something to do with the BB growing on its own why you don't water change during the cycle/or making the cycle last longer cause with live rock you will get some die off that creates ammonia and that in turn turns to nitrites then nitrates that's just how I see it tho I could be wrong

[ramsey]

I think it has something to do with the BB growing on its own why you don't water change during the cycle/or making the cycle last longer cause with live rock you will get some die off that creates ammonia and that in turn turns to nitrites then nitrates that's just how I see it tho I could be wrong

No, no, I agree it's a good way to generate the ammonia you need (from the die off), but if it generates a ton of ammonia, I would think you'd be building up too much of a bio filter. That's just my opinion though. I do think it's a sure-fire way to cycle your tank, I'm just wondering if causing a huge ammonia spike kills more critters off the live rock than is needed. For someone starting out, I'd recommend going with the tried and true method of waiting until everything balances out.

[ramsey]

Come on guys! Share you methods and observations! I feel like there's only been three or four people posting on MAAST lately. You guys are my only friends! :(

[stephaniegarcia06]

I've always used lights and small water changes.

For muy grande, I have 150lbs of dry rock coming in. I'm bathing that first in bleach/water, then doing a muriatic acid dip to try to get rid of any leaching phosphates. After that dries, its going into kiddie pools another couple weeks or until there are for sure zero phosphates leaching. From there into the tank with another 50# of live rock and ill do the water changes and light cycles until it water parameters are bueno.

Or at least that's the plan. As always subject to change.

[allan]

A water change is to help dilute the nitrates in your system.

A cycling tank doesn't have any nitrates until its cycled. So, why would you do a water change? Except to practice?


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[stephaniegarcia06]

I always did it to get rid of crud from die off that mechanical filters didn't pick up. Turkey baster to the rock pkus a little suction. Bacteria still have plenty to cycle with. I'm not talking huge changes - more like sucking debris out I guess.

[ramsey]

A water change is to help dilute the nitrates in your system.

A cycling tank doesn't have any nitrates until its cycled. So, why would you do a water change? Except to practice?


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It will also dilute ammonia too, no?

Stephanie, I use the exact same methods as you for live rock and dry rock! I did a big batch of dry rock using the bleach and muriatic acid method. It seemed to work really well but the acid will make a mess. Let me know if you have any questions about it.

[ramsey]

I've always used lights and small water changes.

For muy grande, I have 150lbs of dry rock coming in. I'm bathing that first in bleach/water, then doing a muriatic acid dip to try to get rid of any leaching phosphates. After that dries, its going into kiddie pools another couple weeks or until there are for sure zero phosphates leaching. From there into the tank with another 50# of live rock and ill do the water changes and light cycles until it water parameters are bueno.

Or at least that's the plan. As always subject to change.

Oh yeah, make sure all the bleach has evaporated off the rock before doing the acid bath! Very important since mixing the two will create a highly toxic gas. I soaked the rock a couple of times in tap water, then dried it out in the sun for two weeks, then did the acid part.

[jrossjr79]

Only reason I dont do water changes during cycling is because I to have read that it takes longer to cycle that way. But I have nothing to go on since I have not tried to cycle a tank both ways. I have read success in cycling your tanks doing both methods, plus alot of other ones. Lights no lights, water changes no water changes, chemicals vs shrimp vs nothing, having a COC in or not having any livestock what so ever. I have read both good and bad on each of these, so I really think it comes down to personal preference.

Again, I dont have any real significance for this, since I have only cycled one tank.

[stephaniegarcia06]

It will also dilute ammonia too, no?

Stephanie, I use the exact same methods as you for live rock and dry rock! I did a big batch of dry rock using the bleach and muriatic acid method. It seemed to work really well but the acid will make a mess. Let me know if you have any questions about it.

Will do. Dry rock gets here this week but I won't start the process until next week. We move in three weeks, so it. I forgot to mention that to my other half. Whoops. That said, he knew it was coming/price, just not when it would arrive :bigsmile:

How long after the muriatic acid bath did you let the rock dry? I was figuring the bleach, then 10 days to dry, then the acid, and the same 10 days to dry. I was aiming for three weeks total. Right after that, we move into the new house and the big tank will be there (along with the 75 that's going to stay running until the 185 is done.) Just have to plumb that, and hopefully a couple weeks later order the live rock. I did buy some aquascaping compound from Marco Rocks. I know I could have used a cement mix cheaper, but with the move and everything, it was just easier to buy the big tub from them ready made.

That 55 is still here if you change your mind BTW :) And I'm just down the road from you. New house is even closer.

[allan]

It will also dilute ammonia too, no?

Stephanie, I use the exact same methods as you for live rock and dry rock! I did a big batch of dry rock using the bleach and muriatic acid method. It seemed to work really well but the acid will make a mess. Let me know if you have any questions about it.

Dude, water changes are to dilute nitrates. There aren't, or weren't, a lot of other ways to get after your nitrates. So a water change was necessary to keep it from getting high.

Ammonia is taken care of by the bacterial filtration that your system is building. Your ammonia will be zero when your tank is balanced, so will your nitrites. It's taken care of. But the nitrates aren't so easily reduced. The easiest way is to perform a water change.

Unless you have livestock in the tank and must reduce the ammonia of precycled tank or one that suffered a sizable loss that caused another cycle, there's no reason to do the water change before your tank cycles.

No, as far as siphoning out detritus or other stuff that accumulates at the bottom of the tank, I can understand that.

[ramsey]

Unless you have livestock in the tank and must reduce the ammonia of precycled tank or one that suffered a sizable loss that caused another cycle, there's no reason to do the water change before your tank cycles.


Yes, that's my point, if there are critters still alive on the "live" rock when you get it, wouldn't a high ammonia spike effect them? I get the nitrate export through water change thing. I just wonder about spiking your ammonia to a way higher number than is needed, and that effecting any critters that may be alive on your live rock. I get it will all turn to nitrate in then end and you'll have a cycled tank and the critters will come back, which is why I said it's a tried and true method. ;) I do things the way I do it to try and preserve any and all life on the live rock while still causing a cycle. I was just wondering what other people's method was.

EDIT: I started doing it this way when I noticed a mushroom coral on LR I got years ago. I wanted to keep the mushroom coral alive.

[ramsey]

Will do. Dry rock gets here this week but I won't start the process until next week. We move in three weeks, so it. I forgot to mention that to my other half. Whoops. That said, he knew it was coming/price, just not when it would arrive :bigsmile:

How long after the muriatic acid bath did you let the rock dry? I was figuring the bleach, then 10 days to dry, then the acid, and the same 10 days to dry. I was aiming for three weeks total. Right after that, we move into the new house and the big tank will be there (along with the 75 that's going to stay running until the 185 is done.) Just have to plumb that, and hopefully a couple weeks later order the live rock. I did buy some aquascaping compound from Marco Rocks. I know I could have used a cement mix cheaper, but with the move and everything, it was just easier to buy the big tub from them ready made.

That 55 is still here if you change your mind BTW :) And I'm just down the road from you. New house is even closer.

I would think that's long enough to completely dry out. What I read was "if it smells like bleach, it's not done" which was not very reassuring. I wasn't in any hurry when I dried mine out, so I probably waited a month in between. I don't think it took near that long to dry out, that just happens to be when I got off my lazy butt to do it. :) Sorry I can't be more helpful.

I used the Marco mortar too, worked awesomely. I went to the meeting where Ben (scutterborn) and John (firewater) showed us how to use it. It's fairly easy to do, but there are a few tricks I learned from the meeting which really helped when I did mine:

1. The stuff dries fast! Only make up small batches at a time.
2. You want the consistency of runny oatmeal (not sure that's the best way to explain)
3. Dip the rocks you're going to bond together in the liquid stuff (highly technical term) before mortaring it.
4. Use small rubble to "hide" the mortar. I used crushed coral because it's what I had. You just push it or sprinkle it on the mortar before it dries.
5. IT DRIES REALLY FAST!!

I think that's about it. If you're right up the road from me, just give me a holler if you need any help! NB reefers need to stick together! lol I wish I could take the 50g, I just don't know where it'd go. I'm going to try and clean out my garage a little this weekend so maybe I'll make room for it. I'll let you know!