Tank Overflowed !

[Jim]

I just started a 135 gallon salwater tank with a sump system. Everything was working fine until the water level in the sump dropped and the tank overflowed. I had no choice but to shut it down for now and bailed some water out of the tank to get it back to normal level. What caused this ?

[allan]

The overflow couldn't keep up with the return line gph?

Loss of a siphon in the overflow?

Kind of need a little more information on your system. I've had this happen a couple if times, and it's usually something that we are responsible for.


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[Jim]

What kind of information do you need ? It is a 135 gallon tank with a sump pump and in-sump skimmer. Everything was working fine. I did shut off the pump to move the return line to another location on the tank to fit the glaas top. When I turned the pump back on, is when I started having problems with tank overflow.

[Scutterborn]

So is the tank drilled or are you running an overflow box? Need to know what you using to transfer water from the tank to the sump as well as what pump are you running from the sump to the tank


-Ben-

[Jim]

It is a drilled tank with an inside overflow box.The only label on the pump says "Little Giant Pump" from Oklahoma City with the serial number. Does not specify the rating. I bought it used with everything else from a local fish shop. Like I said , everything was working fine until I unplugged it to move the return line. Then the problems started happening with water level dropping in the sump and tank overflow.

[Jim]

It is a drilled tank with an inside overflow box.The only label on the pump says "Little Giant Pump" from Oklahoma City with the serial number. Does not specify the rating. I bought it used with everything else from a local fish shop. Like I said , everything was working fine until I unplugged it to move the return line. Then the problems started happening with water level dropping in the sump and tank overflow. I read it could be air in the lines but not sure.

[Scutterborn]

That is odd. I'd check for an obstruction in the drain line. It's got to be the problem area.


-Ben-

[allan]

Yep. Is any water at all traveling to the sump?


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[Big_Pun]

can you post a pic of your plumbing under the tank. would like to see the plumbing from drain to sump and return area as well as sump.

[johnsutter71]

Another thing to consider is adding check valves in your plumbing. I have one of these on my return and never had any issues.
http://www.amazon.com/Swing-Check-Valve-inch-FPT/dp/B001EU5YH4/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1371521293&sr=8-1&keywords=Swing+Check+Valve+-+3%2F4+inch+FPT+x+3%2F4+inch+FPT

[ramsey]

Another thing to consider is adding check valves in your plumbing. I have one of these on my return and never had any issues.
http://www.amazon.com/Swing-Check-Valve-inch-FPT/dp/B001EU5YH4/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1371521293&sr=8-1&keywords=Swing+Check+Valve+-+3%2F4+inch+FPT+x+3%2F4+inch+FPT

If you do this, make sure they're all plastic. A lot of check valves have a metal spring in them and will fail in SW after a while.

[Jim]

Yes water travels down to the sump very freely. I don't think there is any obstructions. I just set up this tank and everything was running fine for a couple of days until I added rock and turned off the pump to move the return line to another location so I could install the glass top. When I turned the pump back on, is when the overflow happened and the sump ran dry. I'm beginning to to think the pump is too large, it's pumping faster than it can drain down the sump causing the overflow. I'll install a ball valve and see if that cures it. Thanks....

[Jim]

Ok thanks for the tip on the plastic valve. I'll remember that. :-)

[Jim]

Hopefully I've figured out the problem.

[Bill S]

Personally, I like a sump that can't overflow the tank. Consider putting baffles in it to make the return pump compartment "smaller", so it can only dump enough that the tank won't overflow. Your drains, over time, will get smaller and smaller. Plus, it's easy for a single snail to clog one of them, and then you have another overflow.

[malofish]

A snail has been the culprit many a times in my systems. A lot of times you don't even nocice their in the pipe till they fall out....that's when yiu have that " ahhhhhhhhh" moment. Pull the stand pipe and see if there is something in there.

[Scutterborn]

Personally, I like a sump that can't overflow the tank. Consider putting baffles in it to make the return pump compartment "smaller", so it can only dump enough that the tank won't overflow. Your drains, over time, will get smaller and smaller. Plus, it's easy for a single snail to clog one of them, and then you have another overflow.

Exactly why I designed my sump and drains the way I did. I run (2) 2" drains and don't keep turbo snails.


-Ben-

[jrsatx20]

I just set up this tank and everything was running fine for a couple of days until I added rock and turned off the pump to move the return line to another location so I could install the glass top. When I turned the pump back on, is when the overflow happened and the sump ran dry. I'm beginning to to think the pump is too large, it's pumping faster than it can drain down the sump causing the overflow.

pics will help us out a bunch. ur return area on the sump must be pretty large to be able to dump that much water into the display and cause overflow.
if it was running fine then the pump is not to big.

[Big_Pun]

pics will help us out a bunch. ur return area on the sump must be pretty large to be able to dump that much water into the display and cause overflow.
if it was running fine then the pump is not to big.

guess it wasnt an emergency

[Jim]

Yes I'm going to add a ball valve. Thanks to all who have helped me out with your input.

[Jim]

I called the place I got the pump from and they assured me the pump is not too big for what I'm running, but I have doubts. They will sell anything to make a buck. I'm going to add a ball valve and possibly a "T" manifold. One side on the return and the other to the sump with a ball valve to control the flow into it. Thanks to all for your input.

[allan]

I'm thinking that if your pump worked well before, and that certainly hasn't changed, then it's most definitely not the pump.

I've run into problems when my pipes were convoluted rather than streamlined... It would work but I had to start the flow slow, then build it up to where I needed it. Turning it on full blast would overload the tank's ability to return the water to the sump.

It's been a few days, do you have livestock in the tank?


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[ducati996]

I'm thinking that if your pump worked well before, and that certainly hasn't changed, then it's most definitely not the pump.

I've run into problems when my pipes were convoluted rather than streamlined... It would work but I had to start the flow slow, then build it up to where I needed it. Turning it on full blast would overload the tank's ability to return the water to the sump.

It's been a few days, do you have livestock in the tank?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalkhis pump is definitely to big I checked his setup he has one drain line plumbed with 1/2" pipe this was sold to him as a running unit its back drilled with what started as a beam animal overflow system but stopped after drilling one hole "lol" on top of that his overflow box is only 4"x6"x4" I'm not calling any names but the LFS who sold him this tank should be blacklisted lol I'm pretty sure without calling names we all know who that is!

[allan]

So he needs a smaller pump, right?

How is he running the tank now?


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[Big_Pun]

thats why i asked for pics, i figured the drain lines where too small. dang so its hard plumbed ?

[ducati996]

So he needs a smaller pump, right?

How is he running the tank now?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalkhe isn't running it now no livestock is in the tank his overflow dosent match or come relatively close to being able to handle that little giant pump this was a system put together from various tanks and sold as it will run just fine*that pump just needs to be slowed down

[OrionN]

This is a very simple problem. Need picture of the over flow. If it work fine before, and not now then either the overflow is block now or the pump is choke off some before. If the OP did not intentional choke up the pump before than it is unlikely that the flow rate of the pump increase now.

Bottom line it that the OP need to chedk his over flow and his pump. More likely it is the overflow that got block off some how. I would check both before go out and buy another pump that he does not need. To keep a reef tank, one must be able to trouble shoot simple problem like this. If he cannot solve this problem, then his reef career is not going tp be too long.

[ducati996]

This is a very simple problem. Need picture of the over flow. If it work fine before, and not now then either the overflow is block now or the pump is choke off some before. If the OP did not intentional choke up the pump before than it is unlikely that the flow rate of the pump increase now.

Bottom line it that the OP need to chedk his over flow and his pump. More likely it is the overflow that got block off some how. I would check both before go out and buy another pump that he does not need. To keep a reef tank, one must be able to trouble shoot simple problem like this. If he cannot solve this problem, then his reef career is not going tp be too long.
I agree minh

[hobogato]

this is a bad idea. you should never try to control flow thru the sump by restricting the drain of the tank.


..add a ball valve..to the sump with a ball valve to control the flow into it. Thanks to all for your input.

[ducati996]

.

[hobogato]

he said he was going to put in two - one on the return and one going to the sump to control the amount going in. if he meant a ball valve in front of the return pump to control the feed to the pump, that is not a good idea either. you should never control a pump by starving it, only by reducing the output.

[ducati996]

That's what he is going to do reduce the output sorry for all the confusion he is new to sumps lol

[ducati996]

I should have taking pictures so u could see what he is dealing with

[OrionN]

......I had no choice but to shut it down for now and bailed some water out of the tank to get it back to normal level.....
If the pump was too much, shut it off the water should drain to the sump. Because the OP need to bailed some water to get the tank level to normal, it is the over flow that is the problem.

[Jim]

I am happy to report that I added a ball valve, turned it about half way open and it worked ! No over flow and everything is fine now. Thanks to all for your input and advice. That's what this forum is all about !

[OrionN]

Choke or starve a pump may cause damage to it. You may want to check with the manufacter and see how your pump tolerate this.

[alton]

Choke or starve a pump may cause damage to it. You may want to check with the manufacter and see how your pump tolerate this.

Plus the harder a pump has to work the more energy it uses. Put a "T" with your valve and run the extra back into your sump. Better yet you could use the extra flow to run a GFO reactor or anything else

[Big_Pun]

you should fix the plumbing issue on the drains. by cutting the flow you create excess back pressure and this can cause excess stress on pump even more heat, another option may be to get a smaller pump.

[Jim]

If I run a "T" back to the sump, wouldn't it overflow by the excess water flowing into it along with the overflow ?

[Jim]

Your input makes sense about causing excess stress on the pump by creating excess back pressure. Hmmmmmm...........Neil did you get my text ?

[ducati996]

No I didn't get it jim

[ramsey]

If I run a "T" back to the sump, wouldn't it overflow by the excess water flowing into it along with the overflow ?

It shouldn't, unless it overflows already when you turn your return pump off or if water doesn't flow fast enough through the sump. Worst case scenario, you just T to the same chamber the pump is in. Either way, it should not cause the sump to overflow since you're pumping water from/to the same source.

Splitting it off I think is your best bet. It's not going to strain the pump, and will give you finer control over how much water is going to you display.

[jrsatx20]

shouldnt be hard to take pics. we really cant help without any.

maybe just maybe his drain got an air bubble that chocked up overflow which caused the overflow to back up and not be able to handle the flow.

so many questions could be answered with a simple picture