My first reef tank

[Reef Swimmer]

Picking up tank either Friday or Saturday and want to know where to start with pumps, power heads circulation pumps protein skimmer and refugium as well as a wet dry filter. :shades:

[SABOB]

If you are going to do Reef,go with Sump rather than Wet Dry


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[Reef Swimmer]

Well a sump with mechanical filtration socks.

[BBQHILLBILLY]

refugium. socks is a topic for a discussion for sure. I dont like them because they catch pods, starfish, all the nice inverts. that need to go to the refugium.

[Reef Swimmer]

installed light but still no water or lr

[350gt]

ahh the beginning....

Good luck to you... take it slow.

[Reef Swimmer]

Finally got water and about 2 lbs of live rock. Picked up a 2 bulb t5 setup from Neil and got chato and some other plant in my fugium.

[Reef Swimmer]

Got my first fish, a lawn mower blenny. He's smaller than an inch long so it will be cool to watch him grow.

[footballdude2k3]

Do you have more than 2 lbs of rock in there yet?

[Reef Swimmer]

Nope

[Big_Pun]

might want to get more rock. do you have a light on cheato?

[Reef Swimmer]

My cheato is in my display until Saterday cause my return took a nose dive. Ill be getting a sicce 10 from hillbilly bbq if I can get ahold of him.

[Big_Pun]

what size tank is this?

[350gt]

Sicce 10 on a 90??....

A bit much IMO... I only use a sicce 4 on my 110, and I feel like its too much...

[Scutterborn]

Chris, I believe its a 90 that he had been posting about before.

David, I don't want you to take this the wrong way but, here I go...

Take the Blenny back and finish setting up the tank. Your not doing it any favors. Sailfin Blennies do best in a mature (8-12 months minimum) tank with plenty of live rock and filamentous hair algae. A staple of its diet. I foresee bad things in store for your little buddy. I think that the excitement of this hobby may be testing your patience. RESIST!!!

There are other fish that you may be able to add now that do not require as nearly a special diet. I don't know what your water parameters are. I dont knowa lot of things about your specific setup. I do know that when all is said and done, you will need more rock. Dry or live, doesn't matter. dry will eventually become colonized with the nitrifying bacteria needed to allow these wonderful aquariums to exist in the capacity that they do.

The best advice i can offer is to research, research and then research some more. I research every fish before i add it.

-Ben-

[Reef Swimmer]

I'm going to put a valve on it to slow down the flow.

[Big_Pun]

I'm going to put a valve on it to slow down the flow.

that pump is 5 times over what you need and by cutting it back it will stress the pump and cause excess heat.
you want low flow throw a sump with a refugium. your flow in the tank comes from powerheads, you cant kill two birds with one stone and put a big return pump.

[Reef Swimmer]

Yeah that's what I was wondering about. I was told I could put a valve on it. I was looking at a sicce 3.5 or a 4.

[350gt]

3.5 would be great IMO... Maybe even smaller...

Yes you can put a valve, but what's the point? You wasting extra wattage on power your never going to use... And like Chris said about the heat.....

sicce pumps are great.

bens advice was great too, take it slow. I know it's hard but will be worth it in the long run. Almost everyone on here will admit that

[BBQHILLBILLY]

sicce 10 too much for 90

I like your idea, get a hammerhead pump and run everything, but your gonna have a lot of movement

[350gt]

Hammerhead in a 90??.....

You will have a snow globe of a tank...

[Reef Swimmer]

I think anything smaller than a sicce 3.5 would be too small. A 5 is too big.

[Big_Pun]

my 150 has 2x sicce2 perfect flow. i have dual internal over flows so two returns.

[Reef Swimmer]

How high is your tank. Cause mine is 4 ft off the ground. It was running on a rio 1700 I just want a tad bit more flow.

[footballdude2k3]

If you want more flow, the return pump is not the place to get it, add a powerhead or get a more powerful one.

[Big_Pun]

If you want more flow, the return pump is not the place to get it, add a powerhead or get a more powerful one.

exactly! im running 5 foot of head pressure and one 90 elbow at top

[allan]

I've got six foot head for my tank, I'm running a sicce 4.


My tank is 210 gallons.

Most everyone here has given you excellent advice... Even yours. A sicce 3.5 is a good choice, although 3 would probably be better if my experience with these pumps are on target.

One thing, you need more rock, bro. I started with five pounds. Watched it for hours. Added 20 here, 10 there... Didn't add any fish until I was real close to what I felt I needed.


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[Reef Swimmer]

Yeah I know I rush it a lil. But I've got life in my tank without putting anything but the lr. How it got there I got no clue. I counted 11 small tube worms and I got 2 small snails in there as well. So I told someone what I had in my tank and they said I could add 1 fish.

[Reefnub]

Install a DC pump and you can adjust it to what you need.


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[hobogato]

lots of great advice here. i agree, smaller return pump and in tank pump for increased circulation. you definitely need to increase the amount of liverock before getting any more livestock.

[allan]

Yeah I know I rush it a lil. But I've got life in my tank without putting anything but the lr. How it got there I got no clue. I counted 11 small tube worms and I got 2 small snails in there as well. So I told someone what I had in my tank and they said I could add 1 fish.

Harrison Ford said it best. "It's an island! If you didn't bring it, it isn't here!"

Those snails and worms are hitchhikers from the rock that you put into the tank. Good stuff... But stuff that was put there when the rock was introduced to the environment.


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[Reef Swimmer]

I have a sicce voyager 2 for circulation.

[Reef Swimmer]

Fish died,tank looks like hell and I don't know what I'm doing. I've got algae on everything I got some kind of purple looking stuff growing on a piece of lr, I got the same purple stuff growing on my sand. The algae I got is brown and stringy. I don't know what to do anymore other than just let it run and leave it.

[footballdude2k3]

with the tank being that new, the brown stuff is prolly diatoms, the purple is actually great, that is coraline and it means the parameters are where they are supposed to be to support that growth, but you need more rock buddy, that was bound to happen with only 2 lbs or rock. ask questions, go slow, we are all here to help.

[BBQHILLBILLY]

Its going to be ok and The tank will heal. Make sure your using ro/di water. Spend some money , get a test kit, and monitor your nitrates and phosphates. youll be happy you did.

[Zack]

May be cyano if it's in the sand. Not terrible but it goes away with time.

Like Shane said, just get some tests and use ro water and you'll be fine.

[Scutterborn]

That sucks. Sorry to hear about the Blenny. Let your tank go a little longer and make sure you test your parameters. Once the tank is fully cycled, you'll find the need to test less.

It does get easier...


- Ben -

[350gt]

Yup purple on the rock and sand is more than likely cyano....

Sorry to hear about the Blenny though....

[Reef Swimmer]

I've been using rodi water and have been testing my water. The purple algae is not solid it moves with the current. Tank a has been running about a month and lr has been in the tank for two weeks. I'm going broke on this tank.

[BBQHILLBILLY]

What were the test results on the water or sw? did you do any research on sw tanks before you started the project? the algae is feeding on something, try to find out .
remove that and algae should be gone hopefully. Think of this as a hobby and most hobby costs a little money. you have to go slowly and fish are the last thing you want in the tank.
I setup a cube with no fish and watch the coral sparkle. No extra costs. So do the research and try to learn off the others. and patience go slow, dont be in a rush
Part of the fun of the hobby is trying to find why your tank is doing what its doing . . .

[Zack]

Theres a lot that goes into cyano, Rodi isn't magic, it just helps by eliminating variables in what could ve causing it.

If it flows its cyano. Coralline is calcerous.

You spend a lot more in the beginning and once your ecosystem establishes, you'll find much more enjoyment in the hobby.

[ducati996]

I've been using rodi water and have been testing my water. The purple algae is not solid it moves with the current. Tank a has been running about a month and lr has been in the tank for two weeks. I'm going broke on this tank. Takes some serious coin starting up but like they said it gets easier more live rock is needed in the tank for sure u get ur return pump plumbed in?

[Reef Swimmer]

I can't remember the results. I didn't do any research cause I didn't know what too look for. I just know that I'm ready to throw in the towel and let someone else have this mess. I've spent more money than I wanted and I'm being told to spend more?? Ik I need more lr, but I also need a better skimmer and better sump and more lights. I'm not someone that makes a huge amount of money. I bust my butt just trying to afford what I got now.

[ducati996]

Ask questions here buddy if ur gonna keep reefing without knowledge then of course your gonna stay frustrated everyone here learns something new everyday

[Zack]

No research won't take you far man, reefing can sometimes feel like a labor of love, but, i tell you this man, nothing beats sitting back and enjoying what you've made when everything comes together

[Reef Swimmer]

No I'm done

[Reef Swimmer]

Please delete this thread.

[Reef Swimmer]

I just don't see how you guys do it. Every tank I see that water is like glass. Clear as a bell, it's beautiful and here I got a nasty looking tank that has more filth than a sewer. I don't know how to fix it and it frustrating the crap outa me.

[Zack]

Maybe this will help you

http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=fiy2b7hq2mE

Read my ten gallon tank blog, my tank used to look like crap

[350gt]

I just don't see how you guys do it. Every tank I see that water is like glass. Clear as a bell, it's beautiful and here I got a nasty looking tank that has more filth than a sewer. I don't know how to fix it and it frustrating the crap outa me.

Time, patience, and $$......

It gets a little cheaper after things are stable.... But things happen in this hobby even to the most seasoned veterans.......

[Reef Swimmer]

Ok I got plenty of questions. Right now I'm trying to get the flow down in my tank. I got a sicce 3.5 two days ago and it's too much for my 90. So I called the store and asked if I could swap it out for a sicce 2. I was told to put a ball valve on it and regulate the flow that way. Now I got valves before and after my sump and gettin the flow right is driving me nuts cause I don't wana hear the water going down the main drain.

[Reefnub]

Only adjust the valve for the pump and leave drain wide open


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[Scutterborn]

Only adjust the valve for the pump and leave drain wide open


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Agreed. Never restrict your drain. Keep in mind that the drains will become coated with a "slime" in time. This will help to reduce the noise significantly. Can you post a pic of the top of your drain? I may be able to recommend something to help silence it.


- Ben -

[Reef Swimmer]

Tried that and I get the water down the drain noise.

[Reef Swimmer]

It's a beam animal overflow with a screw on screen that is about 2in long.

[ducati996]

David a picture will help these ladies and gents better help u out

[Reef Swimmer]

It won't let me up load it. Sprint service where I live is a joke.

[ramsey]

If it's a bean animal overflow, you will need to adjust the valves. I've never used a bean animal but you should have three return lines: one for a full siphon, one for a "trickle" and one emergency drain. You'll want to run the "main" drain full siphon and the "trickle" one with just a bit of water running through it. The emergency drain should not have any water going through it unless the other two clog. Search "beananimal" on youtube and you should find explanations. You'll most likely need to fiddle with the main drain and trickle drain valves to get it just right. From what I've seen, it should be dead silent once you dial it in.

[Scutterborn]

I looked back through your posts and found this

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/07/01/a4apebag.jpg
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/07/01/e2upe2a2.jpg


- Ben -

[ramsey]

Hmm, the beananimal's I've seen have valves on all the drains. I'm not sure it's going to work properly (silent) without them. Here's a picture:

http://www.salt-city.org/gallery/files/9/1/bean_animal_overflow.jpg

From looking at pictures on Google images, you might be ok with just one valve on the "trickle" drain:

http://i.imgur.com/JGeWNqal.jpg

If all else fails, you could just make two of them durso's and be done with it, but it's not going to be as quiet.

I know a couple of people are running beananimals so maybe they can chime in. I'm thinking that you're not getting a full siphon on the main drain since you don't have a valve on the trickle drain.

[Scutterborn]

From what I recall, there is a valve on the main drain. It's supposed to never be allowed to suck air. Crank the valve just until the water level rises to just start to flow into the intermediate drain. The highest drain is an emergency overflow and should never see water until it has to.


- Ben -

[ramsey]

From what I recall, there is a valve on the main drain. It's supposed to never be allowed to suck air. Crank the valve just until the water level rises to just start to flow into the intermediate drain. The highest drain is an emergency overflow and should never see water until it has to.


- Ben -

That sounds right. I may have it backwards. I was going to put valves on each drain when I was looking into it.

[Scutterborn]

This is the only drain system I've ever seen that has a valve on the main. But, with two backup drains, it should be fine.


- Ben -

[ramsey]

This is the only drain system I've ever seen that has a valve on the main. But, with two backup drains, it should be fine.


- Ben -

The herbie overflow does too IIRC. It's basically the same idea, just two drains instead of three.

[Scutterborn]

I think the herbie was created to utilize the 2 hole overflow boxes. It's not as reliable, I think.


- Ben -

[Big_Pun]

the problem is pipe diameter for your drain to sump needs to be 1-1 1/4 at least . the sicce has a flow restrictor built to front of pump just rotate it.

[ramsey]

I think the herbie was created to utilize the 2 hole overflow boxes. It's not as reliable, I think.


- Ben -

Yup, exactly. One runs full siphon and the other trickles and serves as a backup of sorts. I think beananimals are better since you have the one extra drain for emergencies, plus the small tube that breaks the siphon if the water level gets too high. Same principle, don't get any air into the main drain. I've seen them in action on youtube and they're so quiet it's hard to even tell that they're draining.

[Scutterborn]

the problem is pipe diameter for your drain to sump needs to be 1-1 1/4 at least . the sicce has a flow restrictor built to front of pump just rotate it.

1-1 1/4" would drain way faster than that pump will push. 660gph on 1" if I recall.


- Ben -

[ramsey]

Here's a good example:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ufq3VnRCXK8

It's get pretty darn quiet once he puts the trickle line in/closer to the water.

[ramsey]

1-1 1/4" would drain way faster than that pump will push. 660gph on 1" if I recall.


- Ben -

That's a good question, what's happening at each drain when you turn your pump on? Is it just going down one drain or is it going down two drains? What you want is for it to go fully through one drain, then trickle through the second drain. If it's not doing that, then you might need a valve on the "main" drain to dial it back a bit, as Ben mentioned.

It may have something to do with the drain size too as Chris mentioned, it's hard to say without a better explanation and maybe pics.

[ducati996]

I run a beam animaland mine is super quite I only have valves on 2 drains

[Big_Pun]

also if bean animal is goal the 90 degree elbows will slow the flow a lot when on drains. are they all connected into one line in the sump?

[Reef Swimmer]

No the problem is the main drain is 2in and then narrowed to an inch. I got a sicce 3.5 which is too much flow and im trying to slow it down so I put a ball valve on it which made it work harder so I got a t and moved the valve after the t to regulate the amount of water going into the DT. But its not working. My main and secondary both have valves. All the water is going down the main with nothing going down the secondary. I'm trying to slow it down further but the pump runs out of water. My cheato is tumbling which I don't want and I hear drain noise which I don't want. It's driving me nuts.

[Big_Pun]

ok im going from what i saw in pic. i see two 90 degree elbows in over flow box open side facing up . i say drop the whole bean animal idea for now turn the 90 so they face down and see how that works open all valves open. you get slurp sound from drains but if you close the valves on them a lil at a time you may be able to quiet them. the sicce should be able to run full throttle or just slow it a lil with valve

[Reef Swimmer]

K here is the problem. I got a sicce 3.5 which is too much for my tank and water world told me to put a valve on it well it made the pump work harder so I was told to put a t on it and run a line to the front of the sump move the valve off the main line and put it on the the over flow line to regulate the the amount of water going to the DT and not over work the pump by holding it back. Well it's not working. I'm getting too much water from the overflow line and not enough to the DT. I'm also try into slow the flow going through the sump do my cheato ain't flipping over and over. I'm also not getting enough water to the DT with out the pump sucking air. I'm trying to close the main drain so water goes down the main and down the secondary.

[Big_Pun]

ok you see the problem your shutting down the main drain, again restricting flow. i see your trying to raise the level of water in over flow but thats the wrong idea. like i said turn 90's down so everything can drain together.

[BBQHILLBILLY]

Its like doing a calculus problem without learning algebra or precalculus. whats not working? the valve controls the flow. Chaeto doesnt have to flip. Just light it on the side. And a flex tube can direct the sw flow to the chaeto. Your trying to do too much too fast. go slow. patience.
I have one tank with a power filter and powerhead with LEDs. I just do sw changes. make it simple and work from that.

[Big_Pun]

Its like doing a calculus problem without learning algebra or precalculus. whats not working? the valve controls the flow. Chaeto doesnt have to flip. Just light it on the side. And a flex tube can direct the sw flow to the chaeto. Your trying to do too much too fast. go slow. patience.
I have one tank with a power filter and powerhead with LEDs. I just do sw changes. make it simple and work from that.

his fuge is not his biggest worries, once he fixes his drain probs the rest will follow.

[350gt]

Where abouts do you live reef swimmer?

Maybe one of us can drop by to help.... It's easier than it sounds but reading all these comments is scaring me too.... Lol

[Big_Pun]

Where abouts do you live reef swimmer?

Maybe one of us can drop by to help.... It's easier than it sounds but reading all these comments is scaring me too.... Lol

even better!

[ramsey]

I think someone going to out to help him would be a good idea. Drain methods can be confusing, especially a beananimal when you first start. You'll get it, David, I have faith in you!

[jason081180]

PM sent with contact info. New Braunfels is just up the street from me. I'm at about I-35 and 1604. i would love to come help sort somethings out. for the love of the hobby and so your not so overwhelmed. we can take this one thing at a time and you will have a beautiful tank before you know it.

[jason081180]

here is a few pics from my old 90 gal tank. no filter- no sump- very basic cheap skimmer - 1 Koralia 1400gph - Good Live rock and cleanup crew.
It doesn't take much or have to cost a lot to have a nice tank. Just education and time. like someone else said Fish are the last thing you want right now.
2115821159211602116121162

[ducati996]

Nice tank jason

[Reef Swimmer]

New braunfels TX

[ramsey]

Nice tank, very natural looking. I dig it.

[Reef Swimmer]

Yeah I'm ready to get this thing sorted out and running smoothly and figure out what this stuff is on my sand.

[350gt]

****, if you were closer I would drop by...

Anyone else in that area?

[Reef Swimmer]

Jason is coming by when I get off work. Hopefully we can figure this mess out.

[350gt]

Cool.... Hopefully it works out.

[jason081180]

check out a RO system like this one. http://www.amazon.com/Portable-Reverse-Osmosis-System-GPD/dp/B000KLSIJE

here is a good Refractometer http://www.petsolutions.com/C/Pond-Water-Testers/I/Refractometer.aspx
or a basic Hydrometer http://www.petsolutions.com/C/Aquarium-Hydrometers/I/Hydrometer-W-Temperature-Indicator.aspx
just depends how much you want to spend.

[Reef Swimmer]

Thanks josh. Hate to say this but I got to sell my tank. Found out tonight my ac is failing and it's going to cost me 1500 to 2500 to fix it.

[Big_Pun]

Thanks josh. Hate to say this but I got to sell my tank. Found out tonight my ac is failing and it's going to cost me 1500 to 2500 to fix it.

failing how?

[Reef Swimmer]

Coil is froze up and clogged and I got a leak in the attic. Not to mention the system is 12 years old.

[Big_Pun]

Coil is froze up and clogged and I got a leak in the attic. Not to mention the system is 12 years old.

was this a quote from a reputable service company. sounds like your getting taken for a ride. my dad and i do hvac on side and this sounds a lil funny. did they actually show the leak? usually use a sniffer and it just beebs also oil residue is a usually tell tell of a leak if big. but if your freezing up sounds like small leak and may be able to refill and make it through summer or your filters wherent replaced regularly and coil is very dirty blocking proper air flow. there are other factors but those are off top of my head

[Reef Swimmer]

No the leak is in the attic and the coil is dirty. To clean the coil and fan will cost 450 to replace unit with a 4 year old unit will cost 1500 for unit and 500 for labor.

[Reef Swimmer]

Finally got my tank setup and running right. Thanks to josh for helping with that. Now I just need to get the rest of my lr, let it cycle and get rid of the cyno that is on my sand bed. I just hope I got coral in it as well as fish by sep/nov so I can show it off to my family when they come for Christmas.

[350gt]

Sorry wrong thread :/

[Reef Swimmer]

Ok now I need to know how to get rid of cyno. I got a bad case of it and its spreading. Almost all of my sand bed is coevered. I'd up load a pic but sprint service where I live sucks.

[Zack]

I've used Fritz sludge remove to get rid of it on my gf's tank. It took about 3 weeks but it's all gone.

[jason081180]

Like i said when i was over there "chemiclean (http://www.petsolutions.com/C/Aquarium-Algae-Chemical/I/Chemi-Clean.aspx)" works wonders. It will be gone in a few days. but unless you fix the problem of a massive water change, get your live rock, and clean your sand it will just come back. Don't do a water change yet because the problem is in your sand.

what you need to do for now is turn off your lights and leave it. i would even turn off your sump and empty it just leave the power head in your tank going. there are only 2 hermit crabs in there anyway. they don't need light or much flow. your powerhead is more than enough. treating the cyno now will be a waist of time and money. once you get your rock we will take care of everything.

we will:
Drain most of your water 50% or so water change
wash your used sand
and add your rock then you will have a nice tank.

when your ready we will need 2 big brute trash cans. (i know there are people on here that lend them out so ask)
and 60 gal or so of new RO water. (if you don't have your own ro unit by then see if you can borrow that too or many trips to Polly's)
Also Salt (a lot of disagreement on brand here so ill just say i only use Kent Reef Salt (http://www.petsolutions.com/C/Aquarium-Salt-Mixes/I/Kent-Marine-Reef-Salt.aspx) (always had good results and $53. for a 200 gal bucket is good))
you will need your own Hydrometer or Refractometer also before we begin.
it would be great to get a couple handfuls of someone else's sand to add to your tank not the guy your getting the rock from. you want some diversity. the longer its been in there tank the better. (this will seed your tank will all kinds of greatness) maybe someone on here can come help us that day and bring the sand fresh from their tank.

get everything you need before you worry about taking care of your tank almost nothing alive in there anyway.

[ducati996]

Basically he is telling u to start completely over

[jason081180]

well you cant start a 90 gal saltwater tank with someone else's used rotting sand and 2lbs of live rock.

[ducati996]

If he would have cleaned it again like he was instructed he would have been fine but ur right

[Reef Swimmer]

Ok I got my salt picked out. I know where I can get an rodi unit I just need to ask or I can go up the street and get RO water for a 1 for 5 gallons. Not sure where I can get a refractometer not going to have the money for one. Anyone gr some sand I can seed my tank with.

[Zack]

Just buy a unit. It's a large initial cost but for me, it pays for itself in about half a year. This is with 15 gallons/week.

A lot of people sell used refractometers for 25 bucks, just buy a floating one in the meantime.

[Big_Pun]

Ok I got my salt picked out. I know where I can get an rodi unit I just need to ask or I can go up the street and get RO water for a 1 for 5 gallons. Not sure where I can get a refractometer not going to have the money for one. Anyone gr some sand I can seed my tank with.

how much rock do you have now. i would just go to a good lfs and buy live rock and get your beneficial bacteria from that.

[Reef Swimmer]

The lr I'm getting has been cycled. I got a floating refractometer.

[Zack]

The lr I'm getting has been cycled. I got a floating refractometer.

How much of it do you have though?

[ramsey]

The lr I'm getting has been cycled. I got a floating refractometer.

I think you mean a floating hydrometer. I've never used one, so let us know how it goes.

[Reef Swimmer]

I got 2 lbs now and I'm getting 60 lbs next Friday.

[Zack]

The 60lbs will be a big boost. This small an amount with the problems you have won't be able to colonize your dead rock fast enough.

[Reef Swimmer]

The rock I'm getting is still in water and it won't be out of it for a while.

[Reef Swimmer]

Is getting a 200g bucket of red sea coral pro worth the money or will 175 be enough to start a 90g with?

[Reef Swimmer]

Can I get some help for this Saturday. I'm adding my live rock and doing a major change to my tank. I'd like to borrow a few containers so I can make some rodi water.

[Zack]

What RO unit did you settle on? I just picked up an air water and ice and couldn't be happier with it.

[Reef Swimmer]

I haven't gotten an rodi unit yet. But there is a place up the road from my house that sells filtered water for 50c a gallon. I just need something to put 45g of water in.

[Zack]

I believe walmart sells Ro for like a quarter a gallon.

[Big_Pun]

is there a reason why you need to change half your water? i would suggest leaving tank to settle even after adding live rock. your having issues cause you keep making big changes and essential starting tank over. nothing in this hobby happens fast except bad things.

[Reef Swimmer]

Well I was told that we (meaning the guy that came to my house to help me adjust my flow) were going to drain half my tank, wash my sand and put my lr in my tank, put my sand back in my tank and fill my tank backup to let it cycle. I was told rinse my sand before I put it in my tank but I didn't so I got a lot of ditrus and other stuff in my tank that I don't want like cyno. But of that's the wrong thing to do I won't do it. I got lots of questions and not many answers, or put another way I got a lot of different answers and ways to cycle my tank. Some say 6 months to cycle a tank some say there is not set time period. I do know I want a dsb deeper than 2 inches at least. Starting to second guess how many power heads I'm going to need and which side to put them on. Like everyone says you ask 1000 people the same question you get 1000 different answers which is very confusing. All I know is I want a beautiful tank. Something I will be proud of and worked hard to get. But I'm learning to be patient and that the tank I want will come but I got to go through a lot of dung to get it. I've wanted to quit many times your can ask Neil. But I always stick it out and keep going. So in saying this I want everybody's opinion on what I should do and ill go from there. Now would somebody shut up that blasted train!! ��On a closing note we bed o have a newbie corner, have people that have been in this hobby for 3 yrs or more moderate is and help the new commers get started and answer any questions they have so they don't feel pulled in 20 different directions. Let them know that it will get ugly before it gets better. But that's just my idea.

[Big_Pun]

ahh ok well heres what i would do. the sand is all ready in the tank so leave it in. get good gravel vac like a python and use the attachment that hooks to sink or water hose(you will need a kit with long enough hose) if not a choice use any geavel vac and take out ditrius that way. with this method you take out junk and some water and do small water changes. now if you think its a lot of junk in sand that vacuuming wouldnt get out then go with original plan.

most newbies post on here first before setting up and they always get the same speech "take it slow and it gets ugly before it gets better"

[Big_Pun]

http://aquariumsupplies.marinedepot.com/search?w=RO%20Buddie&modaf=null

[ramsey]

Yeah, I'd recommend either a restart and clean your sand really well, or what Chris said. I'd avoid a DSB in your display tank. Read up on them, it's generally not recommended in your display. 1" or 1.5" is what I'd go for.

[Reef Swimmer]

Think ill do a 3in bed I want to have a mandarin at some point as well as a watchman and pistol combo.

[ramsey]

Think ill do a 3in bed I want to have a mandarin at some point as well as a watchman and pistol combo.

None of those need a 3" sand bed. I've had two different pistol/watchmen pair, a scooter blenny and a mandarin. But hey, if you want more problems and need to learn the hard way, so be it! :) In all seriousness, you might be alright with 3" but that sounds like just enough to cause problems and not enough for a DSB. Maybe someone with DSB experience can chime in.

[FireWater]

You don't need a full 3" bed. You're asking for problems. You can do an area for the goby/shrimp pair. They will build a burrow for themselves. Have you read up on the type of substrate they prefer?

[BBQHILLBILLY]

think of your sand bed as a sponge. do some research with phosphates and dsb.

[Reef Swimmer]

Ok I think I'm going with a 2 in sb.

[jason081180]

sounds good. make your first tank as simple as possible for now you can always change it up once you get a stable environment

[Reef Swimmer]

Is it a good rule of thumb to place the power head on the opposite side of the tank that the return is on ie the return is on the right side and the overflow box is on the left do input the power head on the left side lower than the overflow box.

[ramsey]

It depends on your rock work and coral placement IMO. You want to create a random flow pattern if possible and limit the amount of dead spots.

[Reef Swimmer]

Anyone know how to acid dip rock??

[Reef Swimmer]

Ok not going to dip the rock it looks good but I have a situation. Tomorrow morning I'm supposed to be draining half my tank to get rid of some nast water and to take my sand out of my tank and rinse it out. My concern is that the tank will be half full of water and the ditrus will stay in the water that's left in the tank when I take the sand out. Would it be better to just stir the sand and put a filter pad in the sump to catch all the ditrus or better to drain the tank and take the sand out to rinse it.

[ducati996]

My suggestion would be to drain it completly and start over with the clean rinsed sand iys gonna take a long time to get that sand filtered with the pads

[Flyride95]

I agree. Full clean out and rinse.

[Big_Pun]

i think you should just take it all out and buy new sand and start over. that easy!

ive many many tank moves working at a lfs. i wont take a job unless they agree to but new sand

[StevenSeas]

i think you should just take it all out and buy new sand and start over. that easy!

ive many many tank moves working at a lfs. i wont take a job unless they agree to but new sand

Honestly this is what I would recommend too.... There is just too much risk and not enough reward in it in my opinion. I mean just think of how much you have had to worry about the sand already... you dont even have a fish in there yet. What happens in 3 months if you have a ton of hair algae and skyhigh phosphates, you will be second guessing "did I clean all that sand well enough, etc".

That being said there is no reason why you cant remove the sand, add the rock and then start the tank and add sand later. There is no reason you cant start cycling your dead rock w/o sand, its much easier to siphon off any junk that falls of anyways. Anyways just my 2 cents on this.

[ducati996]

Honestly this is what I would recommend too.... There is just too much risk and not enough reward in it in my opinion. I mean just think of how much you have had to worry about the sand already... you dont even have a fish in there yet. What happens in 3 months if you have a ton of hair algae and skyhigh phosphates, you will be second guessing "did I clean all that sand well enough, etc".

That being said there is no reason why you cant remove the sand, add the rock and then start the tank and add sand later. There is no reason you cant start cycling your dead rock w/o sand, its much easier to siphon off any junk that falls of anyways. Anyways just my 2 cents on this.

I wouldn't cycle without sand tried that before with sending my tank into a cycle again when the sand was adding I think its a bad move from experience and sand canbe cleaned properly with no problem just my 2 cents " not saying cut corners but it can be done"

[Reef Swimmer]

Well new sand is in new live rock and new dead rock. I've put in 16oz of fritz 9, 3/4 of a bottle of macro bacter 7 and 2/3 of a bottle of prime. Tank was clear when I got home from Ace's BBQ. Now to wait for the cycle to begin. I might move some of the rock around but the main structer is staying the same. Now to sit and wait and not rush anything.

[Reef Swimmer]

im trying to do this with my rock and what i got is a big pile from one end to the other. the rock is 3 long pieces and and bunch of small ones

[Reef Swimmer]

Humm still no diatom bloom, but Im growing some bright green stuff on a piece of lr i got from pollys, my hermits are doing great and water has cleared up for the most part anyway.

[jason081180]

keep up on your testing to monitor your cycle.

[ducati996]

Diatoms don't happen in 2 days brother be patient its gonna happen quit rushing it!

[Reef Swimmer]

do i need to be testing and running my skimmer?

[ducati996]

:thumbs_down:

[Reef Swimmer]

ok so no testing or running my skimmer and I take it i dont do a water change till my tank is done cycling?

[Reef Swimmer]

21407 Here's how it looks so far. Lighting is a dual t5 setup with blue LEDs sicce voyager 2, sicce 3.5 return and a no name skimmer. Temp is 76 to 79

[jason081180]

looks good. I like the way you rearranged the rock. how is your cycle coming alone? Test results?

[Reef Swimmer]

Rock is turning brown is that normal or is something else happening. I'm also picking up 4 yellow tail damsels this weekend so the bacteria I've been dosing has something to keep it alive. Also found out that the water I've been getting for top off has a Tds of 221. That's worse than my tap and I got about 8 to 9 gallons of it.

[BBQHILLBILLY]

4 damsels, not good, you will eventually have 1, why use bad water?

[Reef Swimmer]

I didn't know it had a Tds of 221.

[Zack]

Yeah that's high, don't use damsels, they are very agressive and will claim your whole tank as territory. And there a pain to get out once you got them in the tank.

[BBQHILLBILLY]

I didn't know it had a Tds of 221.do you have a portable tds meter? those are neat. test drinking water, everything.

[Zack]

Brown rocks is diatoms. All normal.

[Reef Swimmer]

I don't have one (Tds meter) josh did. I don't want damsels but its been what I've been told to use instead of the clowns I want to get in August or I might just get some plain clowns for now till I get the ones I way in August.

[BBQHILLBILLY]

get the 1 nice damsel that you like, hopefully nice. My first tank was a 55 and I had 1 blue damsel that went to one side and the other blue damsel went to the other side. only one survived the battle.
I still have that blue damsel too. great fish for me.

[ramsey]

I have to agree about the damsels. They can be really aggressive and they'll most likely not like a clownfish added after them since clownfish are in the damsel family. If you're dead set on getting one, the yellow tail or blue damsels are the most peaceful IME.

[Reef Swimmer]

I'd rather have clowns

[ramsey]

Then I'd just add clowns. If your tank is fully cycled, it should be fine. Clowns are hardy fish and good for beginners. If you're just having a diatom bloom, I'd hold out until you get some algae though. The bacteria should be fine for a while. If you're really worried about it, just add a little bit of fish food from time to time.

[ramsey]

Also, what does your ammonia and nitrate look like?

[Big_Pun]

i think damsels are fine in that size tank, as long as you dont mind catching them, (2 would be fine)which may cause you to remove some rock to make it easier. what if he wants some "glamour" clowns, risking a 100 dollar fish is a risky choice.

[Reef Swimmer]

True I know it's risky. But I may just get 2 regular clowns like a black osilarus or just two yellow damsels.

[Zack]

Why not just add a small CUC to eat the diatoms?

[Reef Swimmer]

Cuc??

[Zack]

Clean up crew. Like a few hermits and snails

[Reef Swimmer]

Ah ok I got two hermits.

[Reef Swimmer]

I know I need more.

[ducati996]

Almost there

[ramsey]

That's why I recommended waiting until you have some algae. Once you do, add some CUC and let them go to town for a little while. After that, start thinking about fish. $100 is a lot to risk since you're starting out. It's a lot to risk if you don't have any redundancy in your tank. For example, what happens if your power goes out for 8+ hours? Personally, since you're new and learning, I'd start with good ole ocellaris clowns. They're not expensive, they're nice to look at, and they're hardy. You could also look at chromis too. They're cheap and hardy but aren't as mean as true damsels. Here's some good choices that are peaceful and easy:

http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/aquarium-fish-supplies.cfm?c=15+1926&s=ts&r=22+28+32&start=1&page_num=1&count=19&sar=1

[allan]

I'm glad you brought up the chromis.

Dude, from my IFP, don't put anything in there that you're already planning on pulling out later. Catching fish in a tank is a real PITA.


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[Reef Swimmer]

Ifp??

[allan]

Individual Fighting Position.

Foxhole

Point of view

From where I am, what I can see of the perimeter.


Dude, grab a chromis or two. They're cute little fish that will provide what you're looking for and you can leave them in there regardless of what you get down the line.

Wait till you're sure your stuff is tight. Get another fish, a tang or rabbit fish or something that won't break the bank. Let it ride for a week or two. Make sure everything is copacetic.

If you want designer clowns, wait till you're ready for them. Don't get run of the mill clowns just to have a fish in there.

My rule of thumb.... Don't put anything in there that you won't want in there a year down the road.


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[Reef Swimmer]

What would adding bio spira do to my tank??