MH and LED....OMG!

[Texreefer]

Thought that would get your attention... Just thought I would keep this dying discussion going because it is so fun to mess with Chris. here is a bit of history for those that were not around during the days of the dinosaurs ( when MH was popular) :shades:. I ran MH over my tanks until I finally upgraded to SUN..
I started with this
http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o258/itili/beforealgae.jpg
To this
http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o258/itili/DSC01076.jpg
then this

to this
http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o258/itili/DSC01321.jpg
to this
http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o258/itili/DSC02125.jpg

http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o258/itili/DSC02121.jpg

This was a span of just over 2 years with MH and T5 suppliment. The colonies were very large before I had a tank crash and lost most of it.
Point is I got great growth and loved my MH but now have a single Vega. I have an Efflo that has grown to over 8" across, and a valida that started as a 2" frag with 5 branches and now has over 30+ branches and Almost 5" talland has an insane purple color. I'm getting the same color and growth rates with my LEDs and couldn't be happier.

[allan]

But Chris said MH were the end all of lighting. He's ran MH since march of this year. :)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[sdunn90fowlr]

Beautiful tank!

[350gt]

All those pics are sick......

[Big_Pun]

very nice mike! how many mh where you running on that tank?

[koa25]

That is a gorgeous tank.

[Texreefer]

2- 250's w/2 - 24" reflectors
very nice mike! how many mh where you running on that tank?

This is what my LEDs have done in only a few months
From this
http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o258/itili/015-4.jpg
To this
http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o258/itili/IMG_2188.jpg

[BBQHILLBILLY]

very nice pics:bigsmile:

[Tempset]

That's a dramatic improvement.

[mkengr45]

Well, this should stir up a nice **** storm. I'll grab some pie and watch the debate begin....

[reefreak]

Sick tanks man!

[Big_Pun]

so how many Vegas to cover your old tank,? I know they recommended on the older fixture at one per foot, a bit over kill but spread was very narrow.

[Scutterborn]

Well, this should stir up a nice **** storm. I'll grab some pie and watch the debate begin....

Grab a slice for me while your at it, Randy. We could both enjoy this one!


-Ben-

[FireWater]

The Sols cover 2' x 2' at 13" above water level. The Vegas will cover the same at a lower height. Difference is 40 & 70 degree lenses vs 80 degree on the Vega.

So, with Mike's old tank being 3' front to back would cause the problem. I could see 3 Vegas staggered with proper coral placement.

[350gt]

I have 3 sols over a 60", 12" awl and I get good par and no spot lighting.....


I plan to lower my Vegas to about 8" and maybe get a 4th......

[alton]

I agree led does very well on tanks, when it comes to lighting my 300, I would have to have 6 Vegas or 600 watts of led versus 750 of MH. 150 watts of savings for a $3,000 investment doesn't sound like a great idea?

[FireWater]

I agree led does very well on tanks, when it comes to lighting my 300, I would have to have 6 Vegas or 600 watts of led versus 750 of MH. 150 watts of savings for a $3,000 investment doesn't sound like a great idea?

Buy 6 Sols for $2,400. There, I just saved you $600. ;)

[Big_Pun]

lol this pie is good!

[350gt]

I agree led does very well on tanks, when it comes to lighting my 300, I would have to have 6 Vegas or 600 watts of led versus 750 of MH. 150 watts of savings for a $3,000 investment doesn't sound like a great idea?

You always forget to include your wattage of your supplemental lighting and chiller, if you use them.....

[Texreefer]

You have to think outside the box. I would have put just 3 over the old tank. 2 parallel across front and one parallel centered in back

[Mr Cob]

crud lights, all of them. VHO all the way!

[Big_Pun]

You always forget to include your wattage of your supplemental lighting and chiller, if you use them.....

with supplement I run about 720w and my chiller is Walmart clip on fan... $600 bulbs and fixture and 6 bucks for a fan, or 4 sols hmm .....

[Flyride95]

OK OK OK Which light do coral grow the best with? LED or MH? Dont worry about the heat or saving or colors.

[reefreak]

Mh is proven growth but not the best colors still good led has decent growth but great colors

[Flyride95]

Ok that is what i figured. So why not run MH with a led strip for color?

[allan]

Ask yourself why you're in this hobby. Is it to grow coral or to provide a visually stimulating 'scape that wows your visitors?

I personally like growth, but I prefer that colorful look that LEDs 'seem' to provide. But it seems that the growth is off the charts with led as well as with MH.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[reefreak]

Some people hate the heat of halides and the energy cost which is why I'm switching

[Big_Pun]

if you don't have the skills to run a good tank, it's doesn't matter what light you run!

[allan]

if you don't have the skills to run a good tank, it's doesn't matter what light you run!

Immaterial to the question, what is it that you're after, appearance or growth. Johns tank is a fine example of what is possible. I've seen yours, Chris, john's looks much better due to coloration.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Big_Pun]

you haven't seen mine in a while, I was running 10k mh for faster growth and 2
blue plus for a while . for last 4-6 months with 14k better ballast and more t5's so it looks diff, colors are better now. I get compliments on color from everyone who comes by to get stuff.

[allan]

Come on, Chris. This is getting embarrassing. I was just over at your house. Just a month or so again.

Okay, you've been fishing, so here it is. Your tank looks awesome.

Now that we've got that out of the way, I've seen some freaking out-freaking-standing tanks under LEDs. That's one of the reasons I want to go that route.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Mr Cob]

I also don't think anyone can argue the fact that you don't have to replace bulbs on LED!!! I CANNOT stand replacing bulbs on everything else. If I had the money all my tanks would go LED. I think it's safe to say, good LED has proven itself already in both color and growth and being a cost saver in the long run.

LED solves all of the many problems with one solution... LED. Kind of hard to argue against LED anymore... I mean you can't even argue price either because you don't have to replace bulbs or pay the electric.

[Scutterborn]

Mmmm! This is some good pie....


-Ben-

[Big_Pun]

Come on, Chris. This is getting embarrassing. I was just over at your house. Just a month or so again.

Okay, you've been fishing, so here it is. Your tank looks awesome.

Now that we've got that out of the way, I've seen some freaking out-freaking-standing tanks under LEDs. That's one of the reasons I want to go that route.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I don't want your pity, or your confirmation to know if my tank is "nice" it's been more than a month, it was before MACNA

@rob
my biggest thing is price on them. idon't think they are price effective even with light bulb and energy, if you have a tank over 4 feet your screwed for upfront price, when a less expensive way is still out there .led still loose power as soon as you start using, all the info on life expectancy isn't based if you ran them at 100% cause the life goes down running em hard.

[SinisterLou]

3 ecoray 60d led modules=186 watts
2 mag 5 return pumps=90 watts
2 mj 600 reactor pumps=16 watts
1 k evo 1400 circulation pump=6watts
1 150 watt heater=150 watts
1 bubble magus skimmer=8 watts
This a total of 456 watts when everything is running on my tank give or take a few. I get amazing growth and color from my led lights. My whole tank runs less than some light set ups. When you know how to reef it should be about personal preference. I personally think of it has having a green tank(eco-friendly).

[Big_Pun]

a lot of people see LEDs as a quick fix to coral problems and algae. just because you buy them doesn't mean your brown sps is going to color up. learn some fundamentals, test your levels, learn a lil in water chemistry for a reef. no light is the fix all!

[Ms_Big_Pun]

I'm going to say something since the tank is in my house and I've looked at hr numbers when it comes to my Cps bill and to run our entire system it only costs about $22 more. In the summer, yes it's a little warmer but I crank the ac up during hot days regardless of the tank or not and the tank gets to about 81.

[350gt]

Good point chris

[350gt]

LEDs may not be price effective in some eyes......

But **** they look cool...... Who cares about price when they look so cool and have a ton of features as opposed to just turning on and off...?

[Mr Cob]

a lot of people see LEDs as a quick fix to coral problems and algae. just because you buy them doesn't mean your brown sps is going to color up. learn some fundamentals, test your levels, learn a lil in water chemistry for a reef. no light is the fix all!

This really doesn't justify anything... we all know selecting MH, T5 or LED has nothing to do with algae problems or coral problems.

If MH doesn't cost more for you in the long run and you can get the same color spectrum with your MH and T5 bulbs and growth then more power to you.

Personally I'm tired of replacing bulbs and if I can get the same growth with LED and a better color spectrum with less effort then I'm switching. I've been a loyal MH'r but the waters have been tested and they are proven now.

Did add up all your bulbs Chris...MH and T5 and how often you have to replace them? What a pain dude.



Sent from my HTC VIVID using Tapatalk

[allan]

Lol, Chris , Chris , Chris. Dude lighten up broski, we are all in the same boat although most don't care that much. :)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[ElChicano]

I didnt have pie.. but I did enjoy a big piece of new york style cheese cake..

The only grudge the MH Lovers seem to have with LEDs is the price. Considering that LEDs are new, we all know everthing that is new is usually priced high. With that being said. Im sure prices will drop. Just as they do with everything else. I remember a few years ago when I bought my first flat screen, I paid close to $2,500 for a Plasma!!! Today, Nobody wants a plasma. You can pick the same TV up for about 600 bucks. But who wants a plasma. When today you can get a smart T.V with wifi, 3d and all the other cool things they do. Once the price drops on LEDs, which it will. I belive everyone will be on board even the MH lovers. Besides the price I dont understand why you wouldnt want to go with LEDs. Its obvious from the pictures in this post that they work, and they work well. I am also a tech geek, like tony said I want more than just on and off.

[mkengr45]

I knew this was going to be entertaining! Since I just recently setup my new tank, I've taken a bunch of pictures and hopefully I will have some color/growth progress shots down the road. I sorta think that proper water chemistry and parameter stability have a bigger impact on growth than lighting sources. Not saying that lighting isn't important, just saying that there several other factors that come in to play when looking for growth and coloration.

Curious of how many people only dose and measure the basic calc and alk? How many dose/measure magnesium, potassium, iodine, etc....

Randy

[Texreefer]

I will admit that i pretty much don't measure anything.. but i dose only Mag, cal, alk...I know i'm doing it right when my corals look good...Dislcaimer.... you should always test what you dose...

[Texreefer]

I propose a contest.... serveral frags of the same coral some grown exclusively under LED and some grown exclusivley under MH.. predetermined amount of time.. say 6 months.... who will win with color, growth, Etc... may be very interesting

[Mr Cob]

I propose a contest.... serveral frags of the same coral some grown exclusively under LED and some grown exclusivley under MH.. predetermined amount of time.. say 6 months.... who will win with color, growth, Etc... may be very interesting

we kind of have this contest already with the MAAST growth contest.. but we just need people to post their lights. Perhaps gear the next contest to what you mentioned

[Texreefer]

I propose a contest.... serveral frags of the same coral some grown exclusively under LED and some grown exclusivley under MH.. predetermined amount of time.. say 6 months.... who will win with color, growth, Etc... may be very interesting

[mkengr45]

This could still be skewed based on different water chemistry between the two tanks being compared. Different salts, flow, dosing, feeding, routine maintenance etc....it's really going to be difficult to get a 100% accurate experiment.

Randy

[Mr Cob]

agree with Randy... what's to really figure out anyways? LED has been out for years and we know they grow coral just the same as MH. Just look around.

[FireWater]

I say who cares. What works for me might not work for others.
I like my LEDs and I liked my t5 set up before that.

As for water chemistry, Chris is correct. He and I take different approaches there as well. That will be the next argument.

Point is, lots of different lights work, different equipment works, and different husbandry skills work too. Now with that said I firmly believe led is the best route a person can go and my way of keeping tanks is best and everyone else's is wrong. Lol j/k

[Texreefer]

you guys are right.. my skills alone would make that an unfair contest!:bigsmile:

[koa25]

you guys are right.. my skills alone would make that an unfair contest!:bigsmile:
A modest man, who has much to be modest about

[rrasco]

LED doesn't have to be expensive BTW.

[Big_Pun]

LED doesn't have to be expensive BTW.

but if I wear to go led I would want all the bells and whistles. I want it to automatically ramp up and down, control colors through one screen or touch screen. my halides all ready turn on and off, more control would be nice.

[Mr Cob]

lol

Chris... you will be LED probably before me.

[rrasco]

but if I wear to go led I would want all the bells and whistles. I want it to automatically ramp up and down, control colors through one screen or touch screen. my halides all ready turn on and off, more control would be nice.

I'm working on this. It will take some more R&D to get it right, but I have some plans in the works for cheap controllable systems.

Oops...meant to quote your post not edit it.

[350gt]

lol

Chris... you will be LED probably before me.

+2

I give him with in a year, 2 at the most....

[ElChicano]

but if I wear to go led I would want all the bells and whistles. I want it to automatically ramp up and down, control colors through one screen or touch screen. my halides all ready turn on and off, more control would be nice.

Vitrea a italian company already did this . They came out with it two years ago at macna. It would be nice to see more companies go in this direction. http://reefbuilders.com/2010/06/17/vitrea-touchscreen-controller-orbital-led-light-detailed-video/

[Big_Pun]

lol

Chris... you will be LED probably before me.

I have gone led, I'm the one that talked Emily into buying that fixture. it was $350(100 off) has 6 controllable intervals per channel to ramp up and down. it's multi color and has UV emitters. but for a tank like my 150g it's going to cost a grip to get the power I want.

[Mr Cob]

Lol, you are funny dude!

Sent from my HTC VIVID using Tapatalk

[alton]

You always forget to include your wattage of your supplemental lighting and chiller, if you use them.....

No chiller, I do use 6 x 6w stunner strips so I can enjoy my tank starting at 9 am. When the MH's come on the stunners are washed out. And 2 x 5 watt fans for cooling. If you go by the pf MH is actually 825 watts

[alton]

Man I guess I should of stayed home instead of going deer hunting to participate in this one. You guys hit Chris so hard his last post was about his led fixture

[Big_Pun]

Man I guess I should of stayed home instead of going deer hunting to participate in this one. You guys hit Chris so hard his last post was about his led fixture

lmao.... I think they are cute on lil tanks lol

[kkiel02]

Well I am at about 680 watts for my 375g system. 500w from the two halides and 180w(5x36) from my t5 setup. I run a similar setup to what Mikie and Kristy run. Two outside halides and t5 in the middle. Although I will be dropping down my wattage even more pretty soon. :)

[Big_Pun]

Well I am at about 680 watts for my 375g system. 500w from the two halides and 180w(5x36) from my t5 setup. I run a similar setup to what Mikie and Kristy run. Two outside halides and t5 in the middle. Although I will be dropping down my wattage even more pretty soon. :)

what kind of coral are you doing now and plan to do after you switch over!

[FireWater]

Define "lil tank".
I don't consider my tank a little tank.

[Big_Pun]

Define "lil tank".
I don't consider my tank a little tank.

just my personal opinion on cost I've said it's less upfront on a mh system and really not a big diff in savings for a led system for me to light my tank the way i like. , you didn't go out and buy 3 Vegas right off the back......

I don't want to have to worry about where to place coral, I like being able to place them from the sand to top of rocks. I know it can be done with LEDs but buying that many Vegas or Radions, or maxspec, vertex would break the bank. I would rather buy a good skimmer first and some other gear .

[FireWater]

Nope. I bought two Sols and they have been more than enough to light my 2' x 4' tank.

[BBQHILLBILLY]

Im using diy 108 3watt LEDs over 6x2 footprint. Its dimmable with 6 drivers. Im really happy with the coverage. Thats 324 WATTS at peak time.
mornings and evenings whites go off and I run 162 watts. I could probably, with better LED placement, cut the power in half and with less LEDs.
None of the LEDs are running at max power. LED is not expensive.
I remember when I had 2 NEW retro HQI 250WATT DE bulbs and each had a single ballast. I would get 2 of them for about $250.
I could not afford the high expensive MHs. They worked just as good as the expensive ones.
Same thing comparing T5s fixtures expensive compared to diy retros with ballasts cost was low.
My expense for the LEDs was less than 1 vega. and I get complete tank coverage.
For those that cant afford a vega but want LED this is the way to go.

[alton]

Funny thing is some of you change led lights faster than I change my radium lamps? Lol, please don't stop investing in the new technology, I may one day join you

[Big_Pun]

Funny thing is some of you change led lights faster than I change my radium lamps? Lol, please don't stop investing in the new technology, I may one day join you

I agree!!

[350gt]

Lol I am planning to change already...

[350gt]

Look what happened to the dinosaurs when they didn't evolve!

[mkengr45]

I'm sitting here with both options....I have 3 AI Sols, and 6 economic panorama pros on the tank. BUT, in the closet I have the ballast, reflectors, and 3 brand new radium bulbs just waiting to be used in case I get the urge. I'd sure miss the sunrise/sunset ramping, the clouds, the lightning, and the thunderstorms thrown out by my Profilux controller, but I'm not going to let anybody on the friggin Internet tell me what is best for my tank without trying it for myself. Sitting here with both options, finger on the button, we will see what direction is best.

Randy

[BBQHILLBILLY]

Whats wrong with AI sol? lmk The LED will grow your coral. Are you not getting coverage? This is where I think diy is better. I can put LEDs anywhere.
The AI sol is allready a proven winner.

[mkengr45]

Whats wrong with AI sol? lmk The LED will grow your coral. Are you not getting coverage? This is where I think diy is better. I can put LEDs anywhere.
The AI sol is allready a proven winner.
Uuuh nothing! AI sol is just fine so far. Coverage is easily tweaked by lenses and controllers. I just came back into this reef game at a time where there is a lot of debate between MH and LED. I don't give a crap about cost, but am willing to pay a premium for things like tunability and optimization. I'll keep quite and not "show my hand" until the time is right....I do enjoy the back and forth debate between both sides.

I will never knock anyone's equipment or system or choices. A bunch of People have it out for "fluffy" aka "BigPun" because he is a MH lover. To be honest, I love MH too and probably have more reefing experience than a bunch of folks on here. i know most of the old timers, and they know i mean no disrespect. They have treated me great for a long time, but at is point in time I'm looking to try the latest greatest gadgetry to see if I can get the same MH effects with the benefits experienced by LED users. Ideally, I'd love to have an LED system that was identical to a couple of 250w metal halides. This probably ain't possible. Anyone want to get into a detailed debate about this stuff, just send me a pm and I'd gladly give you my address and phone number and you can come over for barbeque and drinks. FWIW I got a bunch of engineering degrees that ain't worth a hill of beans, but I can talk some technical stuff if that's what your in to.

Randy

[BBQHILLBILLY]

Its all good. I agree with you. I like my retro MH too that I had on my 180RR. I like technical stuff too. I think the LED is moving through the tank hobby faster than most are expecting.
Didnt mean to ruffle a feather. My bad. Not my intention. I was worried about LED coverage so I put 36 LEDs on a 20 inch heatsink. lol A little overkill but it works like a 250MH.
correction : 36 3watt LEDS with 60 degree lense. I think Im real close just need a par meter.

[Big_Pun]

lol Randy your my boy! we need to get the Friday ritual going again beer, reef, and crown!!

[mkengr45]

Shane, buddy you ain't ruffling my feathers bro. I wish someone would tell me definitively what the best decision was. I am not the guy to give this call. I do have expertise in DOE "design of Experiment" for my job, but I doubt I could get funding to support what we would need to see. More fun though, how about we pick a date to come to my house to enjoy barbeque and staggering amounts of whiskey to have a friendly chat about it. I'm pretty sure the MH Guru Chris can attest to my grilling and barbequing skills to accommodate this kind of gathering.

Love you all

Randy

[BBQHILLBILLY]

I have sundays off . lmk I like good food. Wait you were the one with the sps that was stacked on the racks. lol
Your a good bs 'er. lol You stacking sps with LEDs. Thats your hand and you play MH. Thats probably what Chris does too.:bigsmile:

[Flyride95]

Honestly I read every post put on here so I really appreciate everyone's input.

[mkengr45]

I been filling frag racks full since most folks on here were having day dreams about gold fish in bowls....you really think I wasn't learning new stuff since my departure? I'm wired different than most.

[clownfishgems]

Uuuh nothing! AI sol is just fine so far. Coverage is easily tweaked by lenses and controllers. I just came back into this reef game at a time where there is a lot of debate between MH and LED. I don't give a crap about cost, but am willing to pay a premium for things like tunability and optimization. I'll keep quite and not "show my hand" until the time is right....I do enjoy the back and forth debate between both sides.

I will never knock anyone's equipment or system or choices. A bunch of People have it out for "fluffy" aka "BigPun" because he is a MH lover. To be honest, I love MH too and probably have more reefing experience than a bunch of folks on here. i know most of the old timers, and they know i mean no disrespect. They have treated me great for a long time, but at is point in time I'm looking to try the latest greatest gadgetry to see if I can get the same MH effects with the benefits experienced by LED users. Ideally, I'd love to have an LED system that was identical to a couple of 250w metal halides. This probably ain't possible. Anyone want to get into a detailed debate about this stuff, just send me a pm and I'd gladly give you my address and phone number and you can come over for barbeque and drinks. FWIW I got a bunch of engineering degrees that ain't worth a hill of beans, but I can talk some technical stuff if that's what your in to.

Randygotta admit that back in the day when randy had his cube setup in alamo heights it was freaking amazing with mh setup, he had bad*** colonys and frags galore , you remember randy...the back of tank and even the sides were full of coralline algea,, man i miss those old setups you had dude! to me it's personal opinion , i ran metal halides before in my old setups and they worked great , just hated the heat and jump in electric bill cause im an all dayer lights on from 10am to 11pm.. now i use led's and i dont see myself going back to mh .. colors look way better , shimmer is amazing and growth is decent with my froggies and zoa's .. personal opinion , use what you like and forget what everyone else says!!!:bigsmile:

[rrasco]

I'm down to talk technical. Where's the BBQ? If you want, I'll show you how that works too. :D

[mkengr45]

I'm down to talk technical. Where's the BBQ? If you want, I'll show you how that works too. :D
Anyone that's been over here can attest that I know what I'm doing when it comes barbeque. You don't get as fat as I am without knowing how to barbeque. I'd welcome any tech talk....

[ElChicano]

A get together would be sweet. With the knowledge everyone on here has. We should build MAAST led systems and get rich. Lol. I dont have much knowledge how they work. But I did work on M1A1 tanks in the marine corps. So if we need to add any kind of firing system count me in.

Sent from my LG-LS970 using Tapatalk 2

[Big_Pun]

Anyone that's been over here can attest that I know what I'm doing when it comes barbeque. You don't get as fat as I am without knowing how to barbeque. I'd welcome any tech talk....

randy is as good if not better with the BBQ as he is with a reef tank. we are not talking about grilling but perfectly smoked tender meat. almost gets me as excited as mh lighting!

[Flyride95]

almost gets me as excited as mh lighting!
Lmao

[rrasco]

As a Texan, the proof is in the pud...err, the brisket. :D I've been saying we need to do these monthly MAAST BBQs....

[allan]

Count me in for meat and reef, and whisky too?

I hope you all don't think I was giving Chris a hard time, but I do enjoy poking him. He gives as good as he gets, and I'm just funning with him.

I will say this, I had a 10 48" T5 bulb set up in my tank... Until I had to change bulbs. $30 for a complete change every 9-12 months? No way. Loved the colors though.

When I moved to metal halide, one bulb every 12 months @ $129, much better. And I loved the shimmer. I didn't care for the supplemental lighting to bring out the colors though.

Now that I'm running four lamps in the new tank I'm back to $400 a year in bulb replacement. That doesn't please me.

LEDs seem to be able to give the best of each of the two methods I've already experienced. Coloration, shimmer, reduced heat in the room, and not having to replace bulbs every year will be huge.

I like growth to a point. I don't like frags in my tank, but I could do with a little less of the trimming associated with excessive growth (is there such a term in the hobby? Lol).


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[alton]

Why couldn't MAAST sponsor a meeting where we could have some one build a DYI led light? It just seems natural with all the excitement that LEDs have brought to our hobby. We have had them in the past on foam backings from texreefer, and Ace doing another on acrylics.

[Big_Pun]

Allan you can only come if you bring actual test results from one week snap shot of your tank for the technical talk.......lol

yes I do give it just as good as I take it lol

[reefreak]

Why couldn't MAAST sponsor a meeting where we could have some one build a DYI led light? It just seems natural with all the excitement that LEDs have brought to our hobby. We have had them in the past on foam backings from texreefer, and Ace doing another on acrylics.
This would seem really cool.

[350gt]

Pffft........ Why make when you can stop in at elegant and pick up some fine lights such as these!!

17493

Thanks again Louis....


I kid, seeing someone build a led fixture would be neat. The last one tuan made was pretty sick looking....

[reefreak]

You did not tony!

[350gt]

;)

[reefreak]

Did you just say ill take the rest of your Vegas lol

[Big_Pun]

Did you just say ill take the rest of your Vegas lol

one more left!

[350gt]

I almost scooped it up too......



I will wait though, if I need it... I will go back.

[Ms_Big_Pun]

Mmmmmm BBQ at Randy's .... Mmmm. I'm going to start having to learn how to make pumpkin pie once the holidays are over

[350gt]

pumkin roll is way better..... ever tried it?

[350gt]

Randy needs to try my bambi rolls.......

[Louis]

mmmmm pumpkin rolls!

You're welcome! Let me know what you think of them, Tony!

[Big_Pun]

tony I don't wanna see any fancy videos of your Vegas on my phone. almost had seizure, show off

[350gt]

This video? ;)


http://vimeo.com/m/54199753

[BBQHILLBILLY]

no video :-( its gone

[mkengr45]

Tony,

I try that link and get

"Sorry, the video at this URL has either been deleted or never existed in the first place."

[Scutterborn]

That's pimp...


- Ben -

[BBQHILLBILLY]

waaaas pimp; I dont see nada

[350gt]

YA IDK whats going on..... trying you tube... vimeo is acting up...

[SinisterLou]

Well I saw these in person today, and I don't know how I didn't get a seizure. Still got a headache thanks Tony.

[350gt]

http://youtu.be/aygWP-bF5xo

[350gt]

if my corals don't grow, atleast my fish will have a great time dancing!!!!

[Big_Pun]

worked on my iphone

[BBQHILLBILLY]

That is sweeet. :bigsmile:

[Flyride95]

Why couldn't MAAST sponsor a meeting where we could have some one build a DYI led light? It just seems natural with all the excitement that LEDs have brought to our hobby. We have had them in the past on foam backings from texreefer, and Ace doing another on acrylics.

I would love to go to this! Heck I would even go out and buy a kit to follow along with next month.

[FireWater]

Let me see what I can do about the meeting in the future.

Tony, sweet lights right? I ain't got a clue how to post vids or I would have beat you to it. My neighbors thought I opened a club when I got mine Tuesday.

[350gt]

Lol

[rrasco]

I always get the 'I feel like I'm in a club' comment at my house too, but I guess it's just the blues. Mine don't dance.

What is that mode called? Is it just a demo mode? I certainly can't see that being useful over a tank.

[350gt]

Yes just the demo mode..... Not useful at all or like Chris said "show off"... Lol

[Big_Pun]

I always get the 'I feel like I'm in a club' comment at my house too, but I guess it's just the blues. Mine don't dance.

What is that mode called? Is it just a demo mode? I certainly can't see that being useful over a tank.

it's called "disco disco"

[350gt]

Lol no it's not...


You have to hit the "disco dance" mode.....

[rrasco]

http://blogs.houstonpress.com/rocks/disco_stu2.gif

[rrasco]

On the old AIs, how many channels were controllabe?

I want to take one of these apart, see how they are wired.

[350gt]

On the super blues all 3 channels are controllable...

The whites 2 channels are I believe..

[350gt]

They are wired so simple it seems.....

Everything is modular for easy replacement or upgrading....

[rrasco]

There really is not a lot to these things period. Modularity takes some forethought. I'd just like to see how they do it, so I get some better ideas for my fixtures. I'm thinking of building a clone.

[350gt]

Would be neat...

Could add which ever LEDs you like.......

[350gt]

I would offer one of my sols to be dissected when they come down but they won't be mine for long....

But just removing the cover to replace the lens exposes what little internally they have...

[rrasco]

How hard is that to do? Any chance you could take a few pics?

[350gt]

Very simple, just remove the cover that hold the lenses and the pucks are right under that.......

I am waiting on some rails for my vega's or else I would be ripping down my sols already...

[Scutterborn]

I am waiting on some rails for my vega's or else I would be ripping down my sols already...

:)


- Ben -

[mkengr45]

It's four Allen bolts to remove the cover...this exposes the lenses and pucks. Then two little screws to remove a piece of circuit board to get to the pins for each puck. Each puck is just screwed to the heat sink with three Philips head screws. They are super simple......

[rrasco]

I don't have one to take apart...

[Big_Pun]

I don't have one to take apart...

search reefbuilders articles they always take apart new fixtures. I know they have a vega break down

[koa25]

drag the conversation back over here

[Big_Pun]

its been said in here

[koa25]

well keep it in here if it is going to continue

[Big_Pun]

well keep it in here if it is going to continue


oh

[rrasco]

Where am I missing LED convo?!?!

I did find that article Chris, thanks. Now I know at least how they put them together. I still want to get a closer look and see how they control 20 channels without independent drivers.

[Gseclipse02]

just for you chris .... i think two months before i sold it

http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j11/gseclipse02/180g%20tank/tank.png

[Big_Pun]

just for you chris .... i think two months before i sold it

http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j11/gseclipse02/180g%20tank/tank.png

too many easy corals for my taste ;)

[350gt]

still nice and colorful though......




And tank of the month at one point..........

[Big_Pun]

still nice and colorful though......




And tank of the month at one point..........

oh yea tank of the month on Maast.... don't remember a actual vote?

[350gt]

lol....... all I know is since I been on here.... tanks of the year or months, whatever it use to be were always nice to look at...

[Paul28]

What do you guys think about the Kessil A350W thinking of maybe go led from MH/t5 ?

[Big_Pun]

What do you guys think about the Kessil A350W thinking of maybe go led from MH/t5 ?

where did you come from lol, haven't seen you since I was stangchris lol.

[350gt]

What do you guys think about the Kessil A350W thinking of maybe go led from MH/t5 ?

Heard and read good things. Never seen them in person to give a honest opinion.


but this video looks promising..

http://youtu.be/2oZ6CsgkQhA

[kkiel02]

Yeah Paul! Have you been lurking? I want to see an updated tank shot.

Now to your question- I have also heard pretty good things from them as well but most every led I have seen is the stunner strips, ai or radion so I dont have any first hand exerience.

[FireWater]

I looked hard at the kessil LEDs. If I were to use them I decided it would be over a smaller cube. The lacked several features I wanted.

[Paul28]

Ive been around tank is still running think its been 7 years running now ill see if i can get some shots of it i lost my big Sebae Anemone last year but i do have my flame bubbles i now have 4 of them thay keep spliting havent put mutch money into the tank tho for the last 2 years since my back surgery fail

[Big_Pun]

Ive been around tank is still running think its been 7 years running now ill see if i can get some shots of it i lost my big Sebae Anemone last year but i do have my flame bubbles i now have 4 of them thay keep spliting havent put mutch money into the tank tho for the last 2 years since my back surgery fail


good to see you around. as for leds ive havent seen any body like the cannon type lights other than small cubes and things like that, plus no control makes them pointless if your going led. doesnt mean you can run a bunch and get same results as your mh with less heat and electricity. up to you and what you want to spend

[Paul28]

im trying to find a good led set up for my 120g 60inch tank thinking maybe 2 or 3 Kessil A350 or 2, EcoTech Marine Radion XR30w (Gen 2) so many ups and downs in led not shur yet but been doing alot of looking i need to go led now tho money is tight and 1000+ watts on my tank is getting pricey and my dinning room i can tell the defrence in heat in summer

[Big_Pun]

im trying to find a good led set up for my 120g 60inch tank thinking maybe 2 or 3 Kessil A350 or 2, EcoTech Marine Radion XR30w (Gen 2) so many ups and downs in led not shur yet but been doing alot of looking i need to go led now tho money is tight and 1000+ watts on my tank is getting pricey and my dinning room i can tell the defrence in heat in summer

radion are nice ive been looking at the pros, price isnt set yet but i dont think it will be 950. but 3-4 radions should be good on your tank.

[Paul28]

Marine Depot has Radion gen2 for 649.00 each ive been so close to get 2 of them and see but maybe keep my T5 and run 2 of the A350 at 399.00 each just get rid of the MH and keep the T5 for actics im just sick of the heat and fans i half to run all the time and my parol officer (wife) is always b$tching its to loud :)

[350gt]

Heat and bills rising with MH??????.....



According to Chris this is all lies.....

[350gt]

Hey I run 2 t5s with my ai sols and been pleased...


I was going to mention earlier that the auto dimming on higher end fixtures is pointless sometimes, unless you are there sitting to watch it..... Don't get me wrong, it is cool but I don't really need it...

running 2 t5s with the kessils would be a great idea.... And no heat, no need for fans....


with my sols and 2 t5s I get little to no heat at all!...... My tank temp is stable day and night from 77.6-78.0...

[350gt]

And I have a 60" tank with 3 sols and 2 t5s sitting 12" high off the water...

[Big_Pun]

found this funnt article on kessil seem to be ok.i know you just want something thats proven to work so either one is cool just comes down to how much control you want and features

http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/lofiversion/index.php/t300672-250.html

[Big_Pun]

Heat and bills rising with MH??????.....



According to Chris this is all lies.....

im trying to be civil and not bash today but no!!!! i think paul has a canopy i do not i have a clip on fan and my tank is at 79 so my situation is different. i also dont run 1000 watts of light just 720

[350gt]

Lol

[Paul28]

i could cook eggs in my hood with 2 Mogul and 1 HQI on 2 Icecap and 1 Hamilton with old school 660 icecap 4 t5s actic wow realy icecap i love there ballist now you cant get them

[Big_Pun]

the icap t5 ballast is made by coralvue now

[350gt]

Cooking eggs with metal halides.... Lol

[alton]

i could cook eggs in my hood with 2 Mogul and 1 HQI on 2 Icecap and 1 Hamilton with old school 660 icecap 4 t5s actic wow realy icecap i love there ballist now you cant get them

You are using more lighting watts than I am on my 300? It's all about reflectors, I love my Lumen Brights, plus they do a great job dissapating the heat. Oh yea I thought I would get lucky and win the lottery last night so I could get 6 of the new Vegas, but it did not happen! One of these days I am going to have to buy a ticket.

[Big_Pun]

You are using more lighting watts than I am on my 300? It's all about reflectors, I love my Lumen Brights, plus they do a great job dissapating the heat. Oh yea I thought I would get lucky and win the lottery last night so I could get 6 of the new Vegas, but it did not happen! One of these days I am going to have to buy a ticket.


lol very true about reflectors. keven was selling some lumen brights and ballast, would be cheaper than leds and you know they work would be 2x250, less wattage than your running now

[Reefnub]

+2 On the vegas Alton, you win and buy us all vegas

[Paul28]

yep reflectors are nice i run the mini Lumen Bright Reflectors and the HQI is a reefstar reflector and ever t5 bulb has a refrector

[Paul28]

sorry there Lumenarc Mini Reflectors

[Paul28]

o look at this found this post from 2008 when i got t5s actinics in the hood from my Powercompacs http://www.maast.org/showthread.php?43380-Got-My-New-Lights-!!!

[Big_Pun]

omg Paul that's a lot of wattage for 5 feet and in a canopy!!

[Paul28]

yep and i love the brightness its been on there since umm 2005 maybe or 2006 cant rember bulbs are all XM changed everyear thats 1 reson i want leds dont have to change as often

[ErikH]

omg Paul that's a lot of wattage for 5 feet and in a canopy!!

Hah, I had the same setup on a 75! It worked well, stuff grew like crazy!

[ErikH]

yep and i love the brightness its been on there since umm 2005 maybe or 2006 cant rember bulbs are all XM changed everyear thats 1 reson i want leds dont have to change as often

It's good to see you back here, it's been a minute!

[Paul28]

yeh its been awile going half to serf the forums more often i need to join maast again and talk salt again its been awile :)

[SinisterLou]

Glad youre back Paul, Ive heard your name tossed around a bit on this forum.

[350gt]

Finally saw Chris and Emily's tank.....


horrible!

[Big_Pun]

Finally saw Chris and Emily's tank.....


horrible!

:sick:

[350gt]

Jk...... It was nice...

A tad too much sps for my liking but I'm sure it isn't easy keeping them all happy... Which they all seemed to be..

A led strip would be all I would add..... No need for a upgraded fixture.

[350gt]

I should of said knowledge instead of liking......

[Big_Pun]

I should of said knowledge instead of liking......


yea i really dont have that much other coral slowly moving to all sps, except trash palys and FD palys(bastards). now you see why swapping lights is very hard thing to do, im risking a lot

[350gt]

It is....


and I've posted before that if I had a tank full of sps I wouldn't be quick to swap to led.... It's too risky.. I hated losing just one cap.....

[350gt]

But I like color, lots of it......


your tank had some..... Even pointing out a few sick pieces to Emily that caught my eye...

but I think I will chase more of a mixed reef.... For the colors offered.


wish I could have seen it with the MH on.....

but Emily said that the neighborhood would lose power if she turned them on too early.. :)


jk, add a led strip.... A good one! You will like what it does when just the t5s are on...

[Big_Pun]

im thinking of doing a ricordia area, and some other bright lps like bubble coral and yellow torches. and some scolys. i just gotta stop buying gadgets! but as you saw sps can be colorful

[350gt]

Wonder what ever happened to the Ai flair led strip....

would be neat if they ever did make it.... A powerful strip with controller like the sols or Vega's

[Ms_Big_Pun]

wish I could have seen it with the MH on.....

but Emily said that the neighborhood would lose power if she turned them on too early.. :)


jk, add a led strip.... A good one! You will like what it does when just the t5s are on...


Yeah, I wanted everyone in the neighbourhood to get a chance to shower and get ready for the work day ahead. I can't be too selfish.

[Big_Pun]

enjoying the view

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/12/12/01/asunaged.jpg

[FireWater]

Geez. I can feel the heat all the way over here.

[Big_Pun]

that's the just envy! that's just t5 on...

[Big_Pun]

also I have no shame or excuses... that's my tank I frag it still have big colonies, gets algae now and then but I'm not scared to show it !

[Big_Pun]

see I like LEDs...

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/12/12/01/hu7e2eva.jpg

[Ms_Big_Pun]

Ahhh, my little tank:):):)




and my LED light

[alton]

Wimp! Why did you cave in? We had them whooped! Turn in your MH Man card. And besides that's Emily's tank.

[alton]

It does look nice Emily

[Ms_Big_Pun]

Technically, it is my tank, not Chris's....with my choice to put the LED;) lol. I did debate the choice of LED the entire time I was at MACNA. I finally caved in Sunday before we left.

[Big_Pun]

Wimp! Why did you cave in? We had them whooped! Turn in your MH Man card. And besides that's Emily's tank.

I like her zoa tank with LEDs, we all know my 150 is a diff story.

[Big_Pun]

Tony's tank looks good! can't wait to see how it's looks with Vegas

[FireWater]

I need to make it over there to see Tony's tank one of these days. I mean it has to be a killer tank since he's running LEDs.

[Big_Pun]

I need to make it over there to see Tony's tank one of these days. I mean it has to be a killer tank since he's running LEDs.

have to toss a jab in!!

[allan]

I went over to see emily today, to pick up a frag. Did you all know that this is Emily's tank?

17776

Looks a lot like the one that Chris has been calling his own.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Big_Pun]

it's our "love" tank

[Scutterborn]

Looks a lot like the one that Chris has been calling his own.



Bwhahahaha!!!!



- Ben -

[350gt]

Tony's tank looks good! can't wait to see how it's looks with Vegas



Thanks man..... It could be better...
It wasn't too long ago I finally figured out what was munching my zoas and I'm sure my acans and a few other nice pieces I have had over the 2 years its been up...

I can't wait to see what it will look like this time next year....

[350gt]

Upgrading pumps and skimmer are all in store this year...

so it should be fun...

Then maybe tank upgrade in the future..

[FireWater]

How long till your Vegas are up and running tony? I picked up my 2nd one today and will order the ext rails tomorrow. Hopefully before next weekend I will be running all Vega.

[350gt]

As soon as my rails are in, I will starting brainstorming...

[rrasco]

What was eating your zoas tony?

[Big_Pun]

What was eating your zoas tony?

think it was a velvet damsel

[350gt]

Yup a damsel of all things....

[rrasco]

Oh. I think I have huge amphipods munching on mine. I had to move them all to a frag tank because as I removed a colony that was getting destroyed, they amphipods systematically moved onto another colony. One at a time I watched them migrate to a new food source.

[FireWater]

It's been my experience that the large water roach crossed with a shrimp looking amphipods don't actually eat the zoas and palys. They get after the detritus and algae at the bases, but that causes the zoas/palys to close up. I usually dip removable frags in a cleaner and blow off the colonies that can't be removed. My wrasses go nuts when I do this, it's like they pulled up at a free all you can eat buffet.

[350gt]

Set up a camera and find the culprit...


im glad i did and it wasn't one of my tangs like everyone was suggesting.

[rrasco]

It's been my experience that the large water roach crossed with a shrimp looking amphipods don't actually eat the zoas and palys. They get after the detritus and algae at the bases, but that causes the zoas/palys to close up. I usually dip removable frags in a cleaner and blow off the colonies that can't be removed. My wrasses go nuts when I do this, it's like they pulled up at a free all you can eat buffet.

There has been a lot of discussion about this over the last year on RC. While many have suggested they are doing as you said, while others contend they have literally watched these buggers tear the skirts off of zoas.

The blue cornflowers I got from Sherita had 2 heads when I got it at the last swap. Two new heads are growing. At the time, my radioactive dragoneyes were the target for these pods. As soon as I removed those, the next day, my cornflowers had a head that refused to open. I moved them about 2 weeks ago, and that head still has not opened. After I moved those, it was my blue tubbs. Then it was my rastas. I think it's more than eating detritus. I pulled most of them as soon I confirmed it was pods (at least in my little mind) and I think they were able to shake them. Having said that, a big piece of LR was moved to the frag tank too, so the pods, in theory, should be in the frag tank as well.

Sorry for the thread derail.

[FireWater]

The list Is always big of possible culprits.

[FireWater]

Man, this thread got derailed a long time ago. LoL

I have read and been back and forth like you said. I guess without actually seeing on chomp down its hard to say. Good luck with it. What fish you have? I have noticed a sharp decline in amphipods and other prods with my wrasses.

[350gt]

Probably using MH which is why he can't grow zoas like Chris!!!...


Back on subject! Lol

[FireWater]

Hahhaha! That's funny right there.

Like I said it got derailed a long time ago. 1 page of Mike's nice corals and 22 pages of Chris trying to justify his MH.

[rrasco]

False perc, kole tang, flame angel, green mandarin, flasher wrasse, sailfin blenny, royal gramma.

I added the flasher and cleaner wrasse for the pods. Mandarin is nice and fat, but wasn't managing them. Cleaner went missing, I'm thinking because he was eating sodium bicarbonate precipitate (which I now dose into the sump).

[FireWater]

Nice, you have a cleaner that was thinking it was "bath salts"
keep,us updated if you find out if the amphipods are actually chomping down.

[rrasco]

I'm too nervous to put them back into the DT anytime soon. I may just end up working to get my 40B setup as a softie/LPS tank. Never figured out why my acans got mad either (happened when I started GFO) Took that off, never bounced back, so I moved them too. They're happy now too.

So...I have zoas and acans in a frag tank that cost me all of nothing to setup, happy as can be, and I have no idea why they are not happy in my big, nice, sophisticated, and very expensive DT. Reefing!

[FireWater]

That's a pain in the rear. I have some nice zoas in my 120 that are doin well and some that I have had for three years up and died in the new tank.

[rrasco]

I don't get it. It drives me crazy.

[Big_Pun]

I don't get it. It drives me crazy.

yea me too, it's not my fault all coral do well under mh ....... bazinga

[350gt]

:)

So do all them $$$ saved each month on electricity...

[Big_Pun]

:)

So do all them $$$ saved each month on electricity...

we should make a list of all the things running on out tanks and see how much we are really pumping out.

[FireWater]

Electricity or the latest greatest Chris gotta have it? Lol

[Big_Pun]

Electricity or the latest greatest Chris gotta have it? Lol

so far I've stayed away from latest greatest of LEDs so far your on fixture number 3 led wise...."just keep swimming, just keep swimming"

[FireWater]

Actually it's numbers 3 and 4 on this tank and only because I upgraded. If you wouldn't spend all your money on additives, reactors, and snake juice you could have some sweet lights too.

[Big_Pun]

Actually it's numbers 3 and 4 on this tank and only because I upgraded. If you wouldn't spend all your money on additives, reactors, and snake juice you could have some sweet lights too.

same snake juice that you ask about how it's working? it's working great by the way! these days I just dose kalk and trace and potassium, the life of a tank full of colonies. so I gotta keep them happy and growing with all that power they receive from mh.

[FireWater]

I only asked if it was working to make sure you didn't kill the frags I was waiting. I can't wait to get my half of that order so I can show how well they color up under decent lighting.

[Big_Pun]

I only asked if it was working to make sure you didn't kill the frags I was waiting. I can't wait to get my half of that order so I can show how well they color up under decent lighting.

colored up and stunted growth, nice.

[FireWater]

Can't same the same about you.

[Big_Pun]

Can't same the same about you.

LEDs got your tongue, fat fingers fail you!!

[FireWater]

Ok. You got me. It's the auto correct on iPhone. It is so easy to make you get all flustered that I was sleep posting. I will pay better attention next time.

[SinisterLou]

You two are so funny, I think you all would be a great pres. and vice pres combo

[350gt]

Lol....

[Big_Pun]

You two are so funny, I think you all would be a great pres. and vice pres combo

yes we would!!

[Scutterborn]

You two are so funny, I think you all would be a great pres. and vice pres combo

Then they would simply argue semantics back and forth and nothing would get done!

:)


-Ben-

[rrasco]

yea me too, it's not my fault all coral do well under mh ....... bazinga

Yeah...except, they're still under LEDs. A whopping 25W.

[Reefnub]

So when are we gonna see some pic of the new Vegas up and running with coral shots with sols and vega befor and after swop out color difference.

[350gt]

Sorry man I promise a bunch when I set it all up...

[FireWater]

Soon. I ordered the new rails today so they will be in this coming week. Should have the Vegas up and running for the weekend.

[Reefnub]

Nice, I want to see the changes and if they look good I would like to send my sols in to be upgraded for $250 each. Everything grows great under the sols but want more color. If you could also tell percentages that your starting off with on the Vegas or if your starting out with what you ran your sols. Thanks guys

[350gt]

I will more than likely hang mine a 1" or 2 lower and keep percentages the same, but slowly work in the red and green... I will take one of my t5s out(coral plus) and keep just one true actinic on until I'm happy with color..

thought about keeping the 2 t5s still going and running 2 true actinics...

[350gt]

This is what's got me thinking on keeping the true actinics....

The vega

17814

The ati true actinics

17815

[350gt]

Don't think it's needed but its worked great along with my sols..... Why not?

[Texreefer]

Then they would simply argue semantics back and forth and nothing would get done!

:)


-Ben-
Isn't that what happens in washington right now anyway:wink_smile:

[Big_Pun]

all these vegas floating around and all in boxes!

[alton]

Last month I changed my third Radium lamp out at 20 months that I got from GC Reef, Shelly still worked there. It had decreased about 6% in PAR and foot candles from when it was new. So has anybody on here had the same LED light fixtures for more than 20 months? And how much has it dropped in that amount of time or did you ramp it up a little each month? What I am being told in my industry LEDS drop 3% each year?

[Big_Pun]

yea i read that also, that if driven at 100% they start loose "power".