****ed off acans. Suggestions? (FOUND the JERK!!!)

[mkengr45]

I have an area in my tank that has several acan colonies (~60 head colonies). They have been doing fine for a long time, then all of a sudden a few weeks ago they all retracted and pulled in all the flesh like tissue. This is on 4 colonies. Since I know the first question will be parameters here they are...
Ph 8.3 (RKE probe)
Alk 9.5. (Hanna meter)
Calc 450 (salifert)
Mag 1400 (salifert)
Phos .02 (Hanna meter)
Temp 77-79

These are decent size 4-5" chunks and I hate to see them in this condition. At night they plump up and let out feeder tentacles but in the day they look like crap. Lighting is a mix of 20k Radium 250, 180w of mixed LED. Also have a scoly that has some tissue recession. I dipped with Coral Revive (stuff smells like Pinesol), and have seen no improvement. System is mostly sps and all other corals look perfect with great polyp extension and growth. I run 36w UV, Bubble Magus nac7 skimmer, twin BRS dosers, etc......typical decent stuff. What am I missing? All LPS are on the sand bed....what are your thoughts?

Randy

[BSJF]

What fish do you have?

[Teeb]

Revive and move them to a shaded area. Any angels in your tank? Last time I lost acans like that, it was a coral beauty.

[mkengr45]

Melanaurus wrasse, yellow coris wrasse, two clowns, two hippo tangs. They are in a low light area of the tank. Anything else?

[Teeb]

Try another revive dip, don't do it more than once every few days, but that stuff has worked wonders on LPS before.

Are they opening up when you feed? Have you tried hand feeding?

[mkengr45]

In the morning they are plump and have all tentacles out, so then I drench them in rods coral food, Reef roids, and a Coral Frenzy mixture. They eat it up, but then mid day they look shriveled up again. These are killer pieces I got from Austin Aqua Farms....they looked great for a long time, now they are all ticked off. Been in the same location the whole time...

What the heck?

Randy

[350gt]

How is the new frag doing randy? Did you place it next to one of the colonies to see if it did the same?

[allan]

Get rid of your hippos.

I had a yellow tang and a blue hippo. Between the two they enjoyed acan, scoly, and brain. I forget which enjoyed what. I think the acans were nipped by the yellow and the scoly and brain was the hippo..., I forget which.

My acans looked exactly the way you described until I pulled them out. I do remember catching that hippo taking big Allan bites out of the scoly.

[mkengr45]

How is the new frag doing randy? Did you place it next to one of the colonies to see if it did the same?
I've got it on a frag rack up high and it is doing just fine....it's all the ones on the sand bed that look not so great.

[mkengr45]

Get rid of your hippos.

I had a yellow tang and a blue hippo. Between the two they enjoyed acan, scoly, and brain. I forget which enjoyed what. I think the acans were nipped by the yellow and the scoly and brain was the hippo..., I forget which.

My acans looked exactly the way you described until I pulled them out. I do remember catching that hippo taking big Allan bites out of the scoly.
I haven't noticed any fish messing with them, but I may be missing that event. It's weird that this started all of a sudden. Allan, did your hippos do this from the start or did they discover the taste of acans over time?

[350gt]

Maybe more light?

I doubt it but you did have them off to the corner with the MH bulb placed in the front center..

Ever moved them to the center for a day or 2 and see if that helped?

[Teeb]

Try removing the tangs. It sounds like what mine did and it was the angel nipping at them. I never saw him do it, but as soon as he was removed, they came back. Never heard of a tang messing with them, but the symptoms sound similar.

[mkengr45]

Try removing the tangs. It sounds like what mine did and it was the angel nipping at them. I never saw him do it, but as soon as he was removed, they came back. Never heard of a tang messing with them, but the symptoms sound similar.
Dam I don't want to deal with catching those things...

[mkengr45]

Maybe more light?

I doubt it but you did have them off to the corner with the MH bulb placed in the front center..

Ever moved them to the center for a day or 2 and see if that helped?
I'll give that a shot....it's easy enough to try out.

[350gt]

My acans liked alot of light..

Hopefully that's all it is.....

[Sherita]

I'm betting its one or both of the tangs.

I've had an acan/frogspawn eating kole tang, and a gorg/sps eating yellow tang.

They can think this stuff up on their own, or they can learn it (ask Ace about that one).

[350gt]

Suddenly tangs are not reef safe or "with caution"... Lol I hope it ain't so.

[profntbtr]

actually a number of tang species are known to pick on the lps until they expel their zooxanthellae, which the tangs consume with gusto. i believe it was mostly the zebrasoma genus, but other tangs have been known to do the same. let me see if i can find the article, or even better, just google "tang pick on lps"

[Mr Cob]

Everything you stated leads to the Tangs. I had a purple tang do that before. He was my fave fish for a couple of years then one day out of the blue I started losing acans...all of my rainbows! He didn't mess with the cheap ones. No joke. Took me a while to figure out what was going on...I sat in front of the tank for a couple of hours... a few feet from it and caught him in the act.

Ace just went through this last week. I have heard others have the same problems over the last couple of years. It's not common but can happen.

Only other possiblity is sometimes when LPS colonies release waste they shrivel up and you'll see this brown nasty stuff come out...it's almost always at mid light cycle or towards the end of it. Does this seem possible? I have even seen them close for a day or two after seeing waste release. Talking acans only here. Just a thought.

[mkengr45]

Nah they are not taking a dump. I will watch today and see if any tangs are the culprit. Next move will be more light. Got to figure this out

[mkengr45]

It's gonna be a real bummer if it turns out to be the tangs....they are fat and healthy, but the value of these acan colonies is far greater.

[allan]

Get a fish catcher, get rid of the tangs.

Or get rid of the acans.

Mine developed a taste, I had the hippo near three years. I think it's one of the main reasons Karin doesn't care for them.

[Sherita]

What Allan said right up there ^^^^^^^

Out of all the tangs I have had, exactly ONE has turned out not to eat corals. And he remains under suspicion.

The last tang in my 72g took chunks out of my brain coral. This is Not Allowed. He doesn't live here anymore. Everything says tangs are reef safe, my experience (and a lot of others) says the exact opposite. I'm betting if you pull the tangs, your acans will show you some love again.

[Mr Cob]

Nah they are not taking a dump.

lol

[allan]

If you want to trouble shoot the problem you can either remove the tangs for a few days or build a cage around the acans.

Give er a few days and then see what happens.

I'm telling you, the only thing that scares me more than a zombi is a tang eating my brain.

[350gt]

I kid sherita......

That would really bite if it is the tangs......

Randy..... Best bet is to sit there and watch for a few hours....

Or you could set a motion camera in front of the acan and it will record when motion is detected.....

Imo beats sitting in front of a tank for hours, then you can set up the camera to watch your house when your finished...

[Mr Cob]

If you want to trouble shoot the problem you can either remove the tangs for a few days or build a cage around the acans.


When I went through this I had to do the same. I went through this with the acans and then a few weeks later I had a cleaner wrasse munching on my clams. Here's the cage I built them because I couldn't catch the wrasse:

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4027/4466712994_10c7a23328.jpg

Later, I got a trap from Ace and used the small clam as bait. Put the clam in the trap and the wrasse went for it in no time. lol

[Scutterborn]

Dude, I only wish I had that much time to sit and watch my tank!!


- Ben -

[Mr Cob]

don't we all sit in front of the tank for hours anyways...what the heck do you have a reef tank for? I mean.. I don't have time to sit in front of the tank for hours either but somehow I'm always in front of it.

[350gt]

don't we all sit in front of the tank for hours anyways...what the heck do you have a reef tank for? I mean.. I don't have time to sit in front of the tank for hours either but somehow I'm always in front of it.


were usually busy tinkering with it, picking something up or feeding.... I want to move my tank to a room that I am mostly in but if I do that, I want something CUSTOM.... was thinking in wall butting up to my dinner table.....:)

[Scutterborn]

I'd gain 300lbs if my tank were next to my dinner table...


- Ben -

[350gt]

lol.... I dont need to gain anymore weight believe me... But it would be a great area for me and my family, cause its usually the center of the house when guest come over. Plus its on tile, wife hate when water spills on out hard wood floors...

[Mr Cob]

lol Ben!

The last two houses we were in had hardwood floors and I was so nervous to see what the floor was going to look like when we moved the tank. I had floods on both systems...144g and a 120g...to my surprise the floors looked great, perfect. A good quality hardwood floor can withstand the test of time and reef tank malfunction lol. k sorry for off topic posts.

[mkengr45]

Just saw my melanaurus wrasse picking at the acan. Now should I move it and hope the fish doesn't screw with it in another location, or try and remove the fish? If you have seen my tank you know that catching with a net is out of the question...

[mkengr45]

Here are some pics of the tank, the last one shows the acan with the jerk wrasse going in for a nip

http://i1025.photobucket.com/albums/y315/spanky4888/2ee4ea12.jpg
http://i1025.photobucket.com/albums/y315/spanky4888/35e23486.jpg
http://i1025.photobucket.com/albums/y315/spanky4888/5f6e0cae.jpg

[BSJF]

He may be eating pests from it.

If you really need to catch him, if you can watch where he goes to sleep at night, you might be able to grab him while he sleeps (in the sand), but he probably isn't eating the coral, just disturbing it.

[350gt]

yup, there might be something on the acans that he is trying to get at........


did you dip them?

[350gt]

oh and pics do not do your tank any justice..... its awesome in person and the 1st tank I seen that made me wonder WTH im doing with LEDS.....lol I know your running some but Im sure that 1 250 watt MH is its sweet spot.

[mkengr45]

oh and pics do not do your tank any justice..... its awesome in person and the 1st tank I seen that made me wonder WTH im doing with LEDS.....lol I know your running some but Im sure that 1 250 watt MH is its sweet spot.
Thanks for the kind words. Yeah, I dipped them a few days ago using Coral Revive. I'll give them another dip and try a new location.

[350gt]

are all the acans upset? I dont remember looking at the others.......

[mkengr45]

Mostly just the big red one. It's polyps are usually huge and very fleshy, about the size of a quarter...now it's all sucked in.

[Mr Cob]

beautiful tank

[Teeb]

I have a trap if you want to try it. Trade you for a yellow tang?

[Mr Cob]

if a fish is eating your acans then you will see some torn flesh...from the pics they just look receeded...?

[mkengr45]

Thanks for the compliment Mr. Cob. I do not see any torn flesh or really any irritated/torn areas, it's just very retracted. It's been about two weeks like this. I still spot feed it in the mornings when it is all big and fat with tentacles out. I may see if my frag rack can hold it and put it up there for a few days and see if it goes back to normal. At least it still eats like a pig....

[BSJF]

Dipping as Teeb suggested also helps it heal. I use lugols on mine.

[mkengr45]

I just moved it to an awkward spot in the tank, sort of hidden behind a huge orange cap. This may work well for the coral but it will suck for me because I can't really see the Acan very well. We'll see how it goes, if after a few days he fish is still being a jerk I'll catch him with a fishing hook and line...

[mkengr45]

I've got these ridiculous small hooks......just for special occasions like this idiot fish.
http://i1025.photobucket.com/albums/y315/spanky4888/ad814067.jpg
http://i1025.photobucket.com/albums/y315/spanky4888/07722af7.jpg

[350gt]

I have a couple of traps here....

Pm JT if u need to borrow them cause there his, but I'm sure he would be okay with it...

[350gt]

You sure thats not just a regular hook with Allan's hand holding it?

[mkengr45]

You sure thats not just a regular hook with Allan's hand holding it?
Lol...I would love to see Allan trying to put the string through the hole on these hooks....it's very difficult.

[350gt]

Hahaha......

[Scutterborn]

You sure thats not just a regular hook with Allan's hand holding it?

Lmbo!! If it were Allan's hand, you wouldn't even see the hook.


- Ben -

[350gt]

Haha..... Your probably right...

[Milly]

Hahahahahaha that's awesome!!!!