440g Starphire Custom Dropoff Reef Tank

[fjr_wertheimber]

Okay, so I recently posted about the custom DIY plywood/Starphire reef tank that my better half agreed to let me build, inspired by this tank here:
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/aquarium6.jpg

That inspiration lead to this design here, which I planned to construct out of plywood and Starphire glass:
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/aquarium1.png

Well, anyway, earlier today I was laying out the size of the tank in what will eventually be the fish room, and Wendy (my better half) says, "You know, it just seems like it's missing something. Have you thought about making it longer, or L-shaped?". Yes, folks, I've got the Holy Grail of "fish wives", one who not only puts up with me wanting to go bigger with my tank, but one who actively suggests it!!

So, after playing around with a few different redesigns, I've kind of rejected the L-shaped tank for the way it fit in the room, and decided to instead widen and lengthen the tank, so that now we're looking at the following design:
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/aquariumacrylicsteel4x7-5.png
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/aquariumacrylicsteel4x7-4.png
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/aquariumacrylicsteel4x7-3.png
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/aquariumacrylicsteel4x7overflowcutout3.png
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/aquariumacrylicsteel4x7overflowcutout2.png
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/aquariumacrylicsteel4x7overflowcutout.png

The theme/idea is still a reef drop off, but widened to 48 inches in width, dropped an inch to 35" in height (at the deep portion) to fit through the front door, and lengthened to 7' of tank swimming space. The deeper portion of the drop off is 48"w X 35"h X 36"l, and the shallow portion is 48"w X 17"h X 48"l, for a total volume of about 440 gallons in the main tank. I'm looking to use the large amount of real estate below the tank for a large sump, refugium, frag tank, and a couple of quarantine tanks.

Right now, I'm looking at having the stand and structural portions of the tank made out of 2" squared steel, with 1.5" steel L-angle iron for the portions that the glass will butt up against, sealed with silicone against the steel and sealed on the inside of the glass, as well. I'm looking to use 3/4" low iron glass for all viewable panes, and 3/4" regular glass for all non-viewing portions of the tank. The steel will all be powder coated gloss black, and I'm looking to have a custom stand cover made in a gloss piano black-type finish. I've even thought of going with a metallic black automotive finish for the stand/canopy. I saw one guy here on RC that had his tank done with an automotive white finish and it was BEAUTIFUL.

Suffice to say, Wendy will have final say on 99% of all this, since (as they say) "If mama ain't happy, ain't nobody happy", but so far it sounds like she's pretty happy about the whole thing, and so am I!

Right now for flow I'm planning on using 2x MP60s on the upper portion, and 2x MP40s on the lower portion. I haven't decided on a return pump(s) or a skimmer, so if anyone has any suggestions on ones for a tank of this size, let me know. I've honestly never thought I'd be getting/building/having built a tank this size, so haven't done too much research for equipment for one of this size.

Lighting will be LEDs, a full custom build, designed to mimic sunrise/sunset and the travels of the sun across the sky, casting shadows along the long axis of the tank. I had a decent beginning of a design, but now that Wendy gave me the thumbs up for a larger tank, I've got to go back to the drawing board. I'll post design sketches for the lighting here shortly.

So, with all that being said, anyone have any thoughts, ideas, comments, or suggestions on what I've posted so far? See anything I've missed, or any ways to improve the design so far? Anything I've gotten wrong? Any issues with using a steel frame like I've designed it?

Thanks in advance for all your comments and suggestions, and wish me luck as we begin the (OMG unbelievably long) build and design process. I just want to hurry up and get it built and wet, ******! LOL

[alton]

I agree hurry up, just joking this thing will be awesome!

[Chuntaro]

SWEET !!!! NOW I WONT HAVE TO FOLLOW ON AUSTIN REEF I HOPE YOUR ABLE TO KEEP UP ON THIS SITE AS WELL.

[fjr_wertheimber]

Okay, so here's the basic plan for the aquascaping. It's obviously not quite how I plan to have it look, but then SketchUp isn't really setup well for organic shapes, but at least it'll give you a basic idea of the overall feel.

http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/aquariumacrylicsteel4x7aquascape2.png
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/aquariumacrylicsteel4x7aquascape.png
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/aquariumacrylicsteel4x7aquascape3.png

[350gt]

AWESOME!.....

[hobogato]

that looks awesome aj!

[fjr_wertheimber]

Thanks, guys! I'm pretty stinkin' excited about it, and Wendy actually is, too (as she admits when she has a weak moment... LOL).

[Europhyllia]

Stop doodling so much and get to work! We need actual photos

[fjr_wertheimber]

LOL Gonna be a while before that, Karin. We still need to have all the steel welded, etc.

[Kristy]

Wow. What an amazing design! What do you plan to use the negative space for (beneath the shallow side)?

[Europhyllia]

how long can that take? We had a whole horse barn welded in a day. No more excuses...geesh!

[txg8gxp]

Looks awesome, I'm sure when it's all done it will be a total work of art.

[BBQHILLBILLY]

not fair. Im telling my wife.:hypnotyized:I had to buy a wall in my house with cash. Looks faantastic.

[fjr_wertheimber]

Yes, Karin, but the tolerances on this are a whole lot smaller than the ones on a barn... LOL

[fjr_wertheimber]

Thanks, Kristy. Part of it will remain open to below to allow room for a larger skimmer (still trying to decide which one to go with), the other side will be where my controller and doser will go.

[fjr_wertheimber]

So a bit more info: The rock structure will be live rock with a PVC substructure, covered in pond foam and formed Polygem Zoopoxy #307 LITE and custom latex press molds to give the appearance of actual live rock. I'm going to have the pieces cut on a CNC waterjet to ensure accuracy of ±.003" and perfectly leveled cuts on each axis.

[kkiel02]

For my stand I used 2x2" square tubing for the most part and added 1x1" square tubing braces to every corner. I also used self leveling feet to make leveling the stand easier. I added a sheet of plywood on top of the stand followed by the pink foam HD sells.

I did the bedliner myself with a paint brush and a roller. I also first primed it with Kilz to be extra safe it never rusts.

I like the tank design! Sketchup is awesome when it comes to planning stuff out like this.

[allan]

This is going to be one heck of a build, can't wait to see the finished product.

That drop of concept blows my mind.

Hurry. I wish I could come into this thread and just read through several pages to the finish rather than waiting for you to update. Don't do a robert jordon on us. :)

[fjr_wertheimber]

Don't do a robert jordon on us. :)

ROFLMAO!! Trust me, Allan, I'm even more anxious to get this going than you are... LOL

[allan]

:D

[fjr_wertheimber]

Okay, so just a few updates. I put together a mockup of the new tank will go into, so we can figure out furniture, etc. Also, Wendy wanted a nano tank for some h. barbouri seahorses, so I mocked up a tank for her from the scrap cut to make the L-shaped pieces for the main tank. It will definitely be the stoutest nano EVER, as it's 24"l x 16"h x 12"w, made out of 3/4" low-iron glass. LOL It'll have a sump underneath with a WAY oversized skimmer for the tank size, to accommodate the nastiness that seahorse tanks create.

You'll pardon me if the models aren't exact, but I just wanted to make sure I was giving myself enough room for the Alpha 300 Kone skimmer, for the two HY5000 returns, and also to check the placement of the four Vortech pumps (2x MP40wES, 2x MP60wES). The two 40 gallon tanks up front are going to be quarantine tanks, the water jugs are for top-off water (and will be pulled from with an auto-topoff turning on/off an Aqualifter pump. The large portion of the sump towards the front will be a refugium/frag area. Oh, and I added 2" tabs with holes for attaching the wood facing on the stand.

Anyone see anything I'm missing, something I could improve or you think I should change?
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/tankwithequipment.png
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/tankwithequipment2.png
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/tankwithequipment3.png
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/tankwithequipment4.png
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/tankwithequipment5.png
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/Fishroom34view.png

[BBQHILLBILLY]

You have taken this to a new level. Looks faantastic. You have inspired me.
Change the furniture to a beach feel. Im gonna do that to mine.
You could sit more with kool orange cushioned chairs with small side umbrella styled tables and Coronas:bigsmile:.
You need a place for a flat screen.

[betiuminside]

You are a master on 3d modeling! Looks awesome! How much per class? I can pay with labor! I will help you with anything you need! :) Awesome tank!

[BBQHILLBILLY]

question: The wall that the tank is against length wise, is it arched that way in your house so you could see the tank from both sides?

Dont forget room for your tanks water chiller. Nice job.

[fjr_wertheimber]

Thanks, guys. Betiuminside, I'd be happy to help in any way I can, really it just comes down to messing with Sketchup for hours and hours and hours until you (kind of) get it to do what you want it to. LOL Yup, BBQHillbilly, the wall that the long side of the tank is up against is actually a nice big open archway to the entryway, so the tank will be viewable from three sides. I'm going to try running the tank chiller-less, using LEDs and low wattage pumps to lower the amount of heat dumped into the tank, and using evaporative cooling with fans on the sump for the few degrees I might have to drop it. We generally keep the house pretty cool (69-74 degrees) and the tank is directly below an A/C outlet, so I don't forsee too many problems with that, but if need be I'll add a cooler on the side of the tank under a custom housing.

[fjr_wertheimber]

A few new renders of the fish room, we finally decided on a paint scheme and flooring. The photos are all ones I took on our dive trip to the Great Barrier Reef. Some of the renders don't have the main tank so you can see the rest of the room better. Gotta love V-ray!

http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/vrayroomwithtankpainted.jpg

http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/fishroomlightsinprogress.jpg

http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/vraynightrender.jpg

[BBQHILLBILLY]

Very very nice. Top of the Line.

[fjr_wertheimber]

So, it might not be much (yet) but it's a start. We cleaned and primed the room today (this pic was after the first coat of Kilz primer). Tomorrow we'll paint the room with Valspar Kitchen and Bath, then on Monday I've got a couple of electricians coming out to give me quotes on doing the electrical. I've already installed the dimmer switch for the room, and the track lighting (with LED bulbs) is waiting in the garage for when the painting is done.
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/IMG_0019.jpg

[fjr_wertheimber]

And now with the first coats of paint and the LED light fixture...
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/IMG_0032.jpg

[KING]

WOW I LIKE THIS :applause: :bigsmile: :hypnotyized: :nerd:

[Mr Cob]

love it, nice 3d renders too!

[fjr_wertheimber]

Cool, thanks!

[fjr_wertheimber]

So, I've gotten a bunch of quotes on the electrical work, and so far I'm actually looking at about a quarter of what I projected for the cost of bringing in two fresh 20 amp circuits into the room. Looks like I'll have three dedicated 20 amp circuits into the fish room (not counting the separate 15 amp circuit the LED room spotlights are on).

Oh, and speaking of improvements in the room, looks like rather than doing the industrial laminated flooring, we'll actually be going with a pressed tile that looks like oak, that way it's impervious to water in case of a spill. The other stuff is fine, I found, if you spill on it directly, but if it gets below the floor surface to the bottom layer of the laminate then it just dissolves, which I think we can all agree is something bad to happen to your flooring. LOL

[kkiel02]

Yeah you will want at least two dedicated circuits. I ran two to my little fishroom and I also run a couple things off my living room circuit where my builder added an extra outlet in the fishroom.

[Kristy]

we'll actually be going with a pressed tile that looks like oak, that way it's impervious to water in case of a spill.

Oooh, I really would like to see this when you get to a point you could share a pic. We are going to be replacing some flooring in our house and I've been debating our options.

[Regric25]

Amanda and I had vinyl tile installed about 4 years ago. Its made to look like real ceramic tile with the grout line and everything. It does look realy and most people dont know the difference until they touch it. It even has texture to mimic ceramit tiles. It handles water and spills easily and wont crack. ill post a picture when i get home. Amanda (wife) works for a flooring distrobution company and got the stuff at a discount.

[fjr_wertheimber]

This is the stuff we're looking at possibly using, Kristy:
http://www.lowes.com/pd_89487-372-TE206241P_4294856525_4294937087_?productId=3274701&Ns=p_product_prd_lis_ord_nbr|0||p_product_quantity _sold|1&pl=1&currentURL=%2Fpl_Floor%2BTile_4294856525_429493708 7_%3FNs%3Dp_product_prd_lis_ord_nbr%7C0%7C%7Cp_pro duct_quantity_sold%7C1&facetInfo=

As always, no affiliation, your mileage may vary, offer not valid in some states, yada yada yada...

[Big_Pun]

This is the stuff we're looking at possibly using, Kristy:
http://www.lowes.com/pd_89487-372-TE206241P_4294856525_4294937087_?productId=3274701&Ns=p_product_prd_lis_ord_nbr|0||p_product_quantity _sold|1&pl=1&currentURL=%2Fpl_Floor%2BTile_4294856525_429493708 7_%3FNs%3Dp_product_prd_lis_ord_nbr|0||p_product_q uantity_sold|1&facetInfo=

As always, no affiliation, your mileage may vary, offer not valid in some states, yada yada yada...

i saw this flooring at the parade of homes and its looks nice! looks like real wood, they where using it in the restrooms.

[Kristy]

Thanks AJ.... I really like it! It seems like the best of both worlds - and they even have it in a couple different "wood" colors!

Now back to our regularly scheduled 440g drop off reef tank programming... :)

[Bill S]

I saw some vinyl flooring in a high end house that was so well done I couldn't tell it was not wood (I'm a real estate appraiser - I see LOTS of homes). Even on my hands and knees. Wish I could remember what it was called...

Oh yeah - good call on the wiring. I had to do that after the fact, and it was way more complicated.

[fjr_wertheimber]

Hmmm... That sounds intriguing, Bill. If you happen to remember what it was called please let me know. I just saw this on the Lowe's website:
http://www.lowes.com/pd_356402-84875-WD8071_4294773821_4294937087_?productId=3379236&Ns=p_product_prd_lis_ord_nbr|0||p_product_quantity _sold|1&pl=1&currentURL=%2Fpl_Luxury%2BVinyl%2BPlank_4294773821 _4294937087_%3FNs%3Dp_product_prd_lis_ord_nbr%7C0% 7C%7Cp_product_quantity_sold%7C1&facetInfo=
Think I'll stop by and take a look at it. I like the idea of the durability and slight give of vinyl, as opposed to the rock hardness of the tile. Kind of like wood, but without the whole "disintegrates when wet" issue... :)

By the way, off topic, but I'm REALLY looking forward to this month's MAAST meeting! Will be my first one since before I deployed, and Wendy's first saltwater meeting ever. Yup, slowly but surely bringing her into the fold... I started her off with a planted freshwater tank, and that was kind of her "gateway tank"... (like a gateway drug, but more expensive and legal... LOL)

[fjr_wertheimber]

Okay, so here's the planned setup of the LED lighting for the tank. It will be built in a curve over the tank so as to mimic the natural change of lighting angles throughout the day, and allow gradual ramping up/down across the overall fixture for more gradual lighting changes. Well, that's the plan, at least. LOL

The layout:
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/Untitled-1.jpg

The breakdown:
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/Untitled-2.jpg

[fjr_wertheimber]

For those of you asking what I mean by curving the LEDs, here's what I'm referring to. The LEDs will be mounted on strips (as denoted by the spreadsheet diagram above) that are on a curve over the tank, so that all the LEDs are equidistant from the center of the tank. This way, as the LEDs following their ramp up/ramp down schedule, the light will appear to come from a light source (i.e.- the sun) passing overhead throughout the course of the day, rather than from a fixed position. Or, at least that's the plan. LOL
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/aquariumacrylicsteel4x7LEDlayout.png

[350gt]

sounds like a awesome plan..... cant wait to see this get started.

[fjr_wertheimber]

A few folks have asked why I'm using so many LEDs, rather than pivoting a fixture of having it move via a stepping motor. Actually, the original plan was to either pivot the fixture, or move it using a stepping motor or hydraulic actuator throughout the day, but the issues I found in those plans was a) access to the tank without having to basically disassemble that whole assembly b) angles available without a HUGE canopy c) one more level of mechanical complication (I hate having to rely on motors unless absolutely necessary. I'm definitely a solid-state kinda guy.) and d) I like the flexibility of that many LED circuits, i.e.- if it's 2pm and the lights are on the "west" side of the tank and I choose to have a "lightning storm", I can dim the "west" side and have the lightning flashes come from either the "east", "west", or a combination of the both. And yes, trust me, the color balance will change throughout the day, with more of that afternoon "golden light" that photographers love so much showing up in the early morning and late afternoon.

[fjr_wertheimber]

Hope everyone is enjoying the planning as much as I am... Now to get back to the building! Speaking of which, the room is almost done, we're doing our paint touchups tomorrow, getting some drapes for the room, the electrician is coming on Wednesday, and the custom floor should be in sometime in the next couple of weeks! Woohoo!

[FireWater]

I want to see some pics of the light system when you get it going. Sounds intriguing. Are you worried about running them in shape you are and not getting full coverage from the sides since they are pointing towards center line?

I am guessing you settled on the floor since you are scheduled to have it put down. I meant to comment the other day and forgot. We went PVC planks for our new floor. Between the 2 dogs (labs), my son, the tank, and me it was the best choice for durability and convenience. If I damage one area I can simply remove it and put down more. The floor is a wood look a like and it is hard to tell the difference until you look really close.

[fjr_wertheimber]

No, not really too worried, since I designed the entire optics specification based on ensuring complete coverage without undue light spillage outside the tank. And hey, if need be I can always adjust or even remove the curve to fix/change any issues I see with it.

Where'd you get your "wood" planks from, John? We decided on some ones from Lowe's in a "hand scraped walnut". Looks spot-on, without any of the normal worries of wood.

[FireWater]

The flooring came from Champion Floors. Took forever to come in but everything else was great. It is a brand called Art Select. They are textured as well to give the look of real wood

[fjr_wertheimber]

Sounds good, John. I'll have to post some pics once the new flooring comes in. Wendy and I are like kids waiting for Christmas... LOL Just think, if we're THIS excited about the flooring, imagine how crazy we'll get once we have a delivery date for the tank?!? LMAO

[fjr_wertheimber]

After getting a bunch of quotes from various electricians I finally went with Jeff Gray from Grayzer Electric LLC. Jeff and his apprentice just left here, and I've got to say I'm absolutely THRILLED with the quality of their work, their awesome price, and the speed with which it was all done. In less than an hour they had run the conduit outside, run the new circuits through the ceiling, into the wall, and installed the boxes and faceplates (I'm WAY oversimplifying all they had to do in order to get the circuits run). So, I now have all the electrical I should need for the tank (three dedicated 20amp circuits), woohoo! One step closer!

[Bill S]

I put 2 20A circuits. The 2 20A that I also put in for my wife's Xmas lights, apparently, isn't enough.

[fjr_wertheimber]

Wait, so four 20 amp circuits wasn't enough for your tank?? What're you running, Bill, 10 400 watt halides?? :wink_smile:

[Bill S]

Wait, so four 20 amp circuits wasn't enough for your tank?? What're you running, Bill, 10 400 watt halides?? :wink_smile:

BNo, 2 20A circuits was not enough for her 40,000 Xmas lights. Seriously. We actually had a small fire this year in a timer.

[fjr_wertheimber]

Okay, so one change to the overall design and specification of the tank... I've decided to go with the Reef Angel controller. Why, you ask? Well, let's see: DIY LED control... check. Vortech ES control... check (well, on the way). Dosing pump controls (and dosing pumps)... check. Open source for tinkering and really cool $#!*... check. Oh, AND it's cheaper than 99% of the other controllers out there? Yup, count me in!

[350gt]

BNo, 2 20A circuits was not enough for her 40,000 Xmas lights. Seriously. We actually had a small fire this year in a timer.


were those LED XMAS lights? thats all I use now...

[fjr_wertheimber]

Holy cow, Bill. I'd better not ever let Wendy talk to your wife, or I'm gonna be stuck buying 40,000 lights for next Christmas... LOL

[fjr_wertheimber]

Oh, and on a (semi-) side note, if you're ever looking for a good primer when painting a room, Kilz is it. We used Kilz2 in the fish room, but then figured we'd just use the Valspar primer for our daughter's room, since we're not worried about any moisture in there. Bad idea. Coverage with the Valspar (which is actually a very highly-rated primer) is about 1/2 that of the Kilz. From now on, whether the room will see moisture or not, we're going to use Kilz for our priming needs.

Just opened up the vinyl plank flooring we special ordered from Lowe's and it's PERFECT. Looks great in the room, we can't wait to get the carpet up and put the "wood" down!

[Bill S]

were those LED XMAS lights? thats all I use now...

I'd need to take out a 2nd mortgage to go LED. I buy the regular lights after Xmas for anywhere from $0.19 to $0.49 per 100. There's NO WAY to make LEDs pay for themselves at $8 a box, when you have like 400 of them.

[ErikH]

Three words.... OH MY GOD!

or..... THAT'S FREAKIN' INCREDIBLE!

[fjr_wertheimber]

Geez, Bill...

[fjr_wertheimber]

Some work in progress pics:



The room as it stands tonight. Got the photo print from Kodak today (20"x30" Pro-Print on metallic paper), got the materials to put together the frame and matting, and put it all together and hung it. We still need to get the smaller frames, possibly tomorrow. Pardon the mess, like I said, it's still a work in progress.

http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/Fishroomlarge3.png



Some of the vinyl planks. Don't worry about the drips on the floorboards, they're all getting torn up and replaced when we put down the new flooring.

http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/Fishroomlarge2.png



The photo lit by the LED light fixture. Looks fantastic (much better than in the photo) in person, almost 3D in appearance. Definitely glad we sprung for the metallic printing.

http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/Fishroomlarge.png



We also FINALLY (as you can tell from the first pic) found some drapes we liked. Just need to get the steamer out and steam out the wrinkles and we'll be set as far as that goes. Slowly but surely, the room is coming together...

[fjr_wertheimber]

So, as the title says, finally got the floor done and super pleased with how it turns out. Wendy grew up in the flooring business (her parents owned a flooring company) and even she was amazed with how it looks. Now to just find some baseboard I like and put that in, and the room portion of the build is done!
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/Fishroomlarge31.png
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/Fishroomlarge32.png
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/Fishroomlarge33.png

Now, on a (semi) side note... Wendy and I have been talking about putting together a little pico/nano for our son Tito's room. I played around with the idea, and thought, "Hey, why not make a scale version of the big tank?" So, voila!
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/SmallTank.jpg
Just need to pick up some 1"x2" for the stand and some 1/4" acrylic for the rest, and we're in business. Hopefully I can put it together this weekend, or at least start on it. I found some great little LED strips that will work perfectly for lighting it, and a great DIY for a pico skimmer, and Hydor makes some great little nano pumps and powerheads that will fit perfectly. Overall size (including stand) is 24"L x 12"W x 18"H.

[fjr_wertheimber]

I've got to say we're pretty pleased so far.

Speaking of which, I've had a few people ask about how the big tank is being constructed, i.e.- why not make it the normal way, why build it this way, why not have AGE/Marineland/etc. make it. Here's why:
Beyond the issues of having to perfectly level the two levels in order to achieve a perfect silicone bond without weak points (if you were to build it the normal glass/silicone way), the other reason it's being siliconed directly to the steel, much like a large-scale commercial aquarium. And no, unlike some people have thought, you don't want it to give, to do so introduces shear forces upon the silicone seal. Ideally, you want to silicone directly against the most stable outer surface as possible, so that the only force being acted upon the silicone is compressive force, where the silicone acts merely as a packer and seal, rather than being held in tension or shear, as most silicone and glass aquariums are. Utilizing silicone in this manner is almost incalculably stronger (assuming a strong outer surface, i.e.- strong welds and well-built structure, to seal against) than utilizing silicone as an adhesive. Not only that, but then your safety factor relies on the strength of the glass between the steel frames, rather than upon the strength of the silicone bond (either in tension or in shear) to retain the shape of the glass and keep it from reaching the point of failure due to deflection. Remember, when calculating required glass thickness, the biggest issue is bending stress, so supporting the top and bottom of the pane of glass reduces (almost to the point of removal) that bending stress at the point where it's most likely, i.e.- the top and bottom shear-held silicone bonds. Really, the only issue relative to the use of metal for the frame is the differential linear coefficient of expansion between glass and most metals, especially steel. To offset this in larger joints (i.e.- those longer than 1 meter on their longest edge, or a bit over 2 meters in this case) the thickness of the silicone seal must be changed to allow linear expansion without the fear of compressive failure. Assuming that plate glass has a linear coefficient of expansion of ~5.0 x 10^6 in/in degrees F, and steel has a coefficient of linear thermal expansion of ~7.3 x 10^6 in/in degrees F, allowing 2-3mm per meter of joint length (i.e.- 5mm seal along the large side plates, and 3mm along the front plate) will allow the silicone to take up the linear expansion differences without failure of the silicone seal.

[fjr_wertheimber]

LOL I just had a guy over on Reef Central post: "As a Structural engineer your previous post made a lot of sense, do you have an engineering background?" I guess that means I got it right... http://www.austinreefclub.com//public/style_emoticons/default/punk.gif

[FireWater]

Can't rely on luck. LOL
Floor looks good in the room. Any time frame on when we start seeing some tank pics?

[fjr_wertheimber]

Floor looks good in the room. Any time frame on when we start seeing some tank pics?
Thanks, we're really happy with it. Not sure on timeframe, it will probably be ~3-4 weeks before the frame and stand are here, then depending on lead time for the glass at that point, probably 5-6 weeks after that for glass installation. In other words, not NEARLY fast enough for my taste. LOL

[FireWater]

It's never fast enough.

[fjr_wertheimber]

Okay, so speaking of over-engineering stuff, I'm trying to replicate the big tank as much as possible, and that includes making a Bubble King über-mini clone powered by a modded Maxijet 1200 (and yes, I know that the MJ is turned the wrong way, but I realized that after I built the rest of the skimmer so I'm just gonna leave the model as-is for now...). So, here's the plan for it:
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/MiniSkimmerforTitosTank.jpg

[fjr_wertheimber]

And a sketch of it under the mini-tank:
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/SmallTankwithskimmer.jpg

[fjr_wertheimber]

By the way, stopped by the metal fabricator's shop earlier today... Things are progressing!!

[ErikH]

After reading the post about the strength's relation to the silicone, I can see why your wife is letting you do this. If I told my wife I was building a tank, it would probably go something like this; "HAHAHA, no you're not."

Awesome build, hands down. Hopefully your thread gets a TOTM or TOTY on RC.

[fjr_wertheimber]

LOL Thanks, ErikH! At this point, I'm not even thinking about TOTM anywhere, I just want TIMR (Tank in my room!).

[reefreak]

Looks like a fun build cant wait for new pics.

[fjr_wertheimber]

Hey, has anyone dealt with Live Rock Ranch (liverockranch.com (http://www.liverockranch.com)) before? For the sheer amount of live rock I'm going to need for this system, there's no way I'm going to go through one of the LFS (as much as I love 'em, I earned my $ and I'm not going to throw it away on higher prices just 'cause I like 'em), and their prices seem to be pretty great; plus with them being located in FL transit time should be pretty quick, i.e.- less die off. Anyone have any thoughts or experiences?

[fjr_wertheimber]

Okay, nevermind. Just did some more research on them. No WAY am I giving them any money... LOL

[kkiel02]

I would recommend buying dead rock and seeding it. You can actually start this now in some brute trash cans. Buying that much live rock would scare me because of hitchhikers. Just an idea.

[Bill S]

I would recommend buying dead rock and seeding it. You can actually start this now in some brute trash cans. Buying that much live rock would scare me because of hitchhikers. Just an idea.

I think Kevin is EXACTLY right. Buy dry rock. I'll never put a piece of live rock into a tank. When you start a big tank like that, you HAVE to have a quarantine tank, and you HAVE to be aware of every little thing you put into it. Your chances of getting something you don't want, that you can't control in that big an environment, is way too "good". Just go with dry rock.

[Fishstix@JewelsOfTheSea]

I think it's the large cash deposit box...could be wrong though! Sorry about that, hope it all comes together, looking forward to more pics

[fjr_wertheimber]

Hey guys, sorry about the lack of updates... I just started a new job and have been absolutely swamped. I promise there will be updates (with pics) shortly!

[buck27]

Deffinetly dry rock. I'm going marco rock. I plan to seed it with rock and sand from kenny1 and SoLiD because I know they take great care of their tanks and I shouldn't have any worries.

Sent from my SGH-T959V using Tapatalk

[Squiers007]

Can't believe I missed this build thread for so long... This is going to amazing! Keep up the good work. You are going to love the vinyl flooring. We did our whole house with it and 2 years later haven't had a single issue.

[Mr Cob]

here's to "TITR"! Great build. Will be an amazing setup.

[TeslaReef]

Absolutely incredible!
Tagging along.
-Phillip

[SoLiD]

How's it going?

[signal_4]

If your still considering "live" rock do some research on www.tampabaysaltwater.com.... he has a forum on reef central... I have ordered from him and so has Karin (Europhyllia (http://www.maast.org/member.php?9638-Europhyllia)). I was very pleased with the rock and plus you get it same day as shipped via air freight and it is very well packed in water.... lots of life.....excellent customer service......just be prepared to go fishing for some mantis shrimps but they would made a good trade or store credit at a LFS. I cant recall anyone not being pleased with the rock nor service..... hope this helps. Altan

[fjr_wertheimber]

Still very happy with my fab guys, just very UNhappy with my insane schedule at the new job... Things are starting to finally calm down a bit, so I've found myself with (amazingly enough) a bit of time. So, that being said, there actually HAS been some progress on the big tank... but that's not what I'm posting about.

You see, part of the idea/design mentality behind the large tank is for it to be a reef biotope consistent (for the most part) with the Coral Sea (where Wendy and I went scuba diving during our R&R from Iraq). With that in mind, I'd fallen in love with blue-stripe orange-fin clownfish,Amphiprion chyrsopterusand wanted to get a mated pair. The only problem was finding a pair. Well, and finding a pair that wasn't $350+.

So, anyways, I was coming back from work last week and decided to pop into Aquatek... when what do I see? Yup, a mated pair ofA. chrysopterus. Oh, and did I mention they were about 1/4 of the usual price??? GTFO. Well, crap, now where the hell am I gonna put 'em? It's gonna be quite a while 'til water is in the big tank (hell, I'm still trying to find a decent glass supplier after three different places have changed their timelines/prices on me)... I went on Craigslist and found a guy selling a 30 gallon bowfront with 45 lbs of rock, sand, filter, and LED lighting, all in great shape... for only $100??! Suffice to say, we snatched that up... only to find the tank also included a single A. ocellaris, that (of course) Wendy promptly fell in love with. Well, crap, can't put it in with the blue-stripes, what am I gonna do with him? Another Craigslist search found a great deal on a Biocube 29. Found out it had a bad ballast, but was able to score one at AquaDome for a steal. Okay, now what about live rock? Richard L from ARC hooked me up big-time on some man-made Real Reef rock which I split between the two tanks. I got some Dr. Tim's One-and-Only for Nano/Reef, gave it a few days, tested parameters, rock solid, dosed some ammonia, checked the next day, rock solid still. Sweet! (BTW, that's the first time I've used that stuff, gotta say I'm impressed; it actually lives up to the hype.)
Anyway, I know a thread is nothin' without pics, so:

Fish being acclimated (BTW, leftover Army combat lifesaver kits ROCK for IV lines for acclimation... I've got extras if anyone needs a few.)
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/fish1.jpg

Wendy's new Biocube with fish being acclimated:
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/fish2.jpg

A. chysopteruspair:
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/fish3.jpg

Another pic:
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc519/ajmerrifield/fish4.jpg

Anyway, I'm completely thrilled, can't wait to get them into the big tank now...

[reefreak]

Dude great score!

[allan]

Combat lifesaver bags... Remember trading those for SF Hollywood jumps back in the day.

I am looking forward to the big tank build.

[fjr_wertheimber]

Well, if you need a couple, Allan, I've got about 10 extra... :) How long ago was this? T-10C or D?

[allan]

T-10C or D... wouldn't get a CLS from me, no Sir! :) MC1-B or C all the way. Actually I left bragg before we got to the T-10D, we were still using the C while I was there. In fact, I pulled my last JMPI about a week before they started using the new spring loaded reserves.

Ah, the good ole days. Thanks for the offer, but these old bones don't jump anymore. :(

[fjr_wertheimber]

Regardless, you're welcome to some CLS bags if you want 'em.

[allan]

Thanks :)

[fjr_wertheimber]

Never realized that you were a Bragg-baby, Allan... If I'd have known that I'd have been giving you a harder time... LOL

On a tank-related note, I was absolutely ecstatic this morning to come down and see the blue-stripe pair swimmin' around in their holding tank... Soooo excited!

[allan]

Hmpt! Bragg baby indeed. :(
But yeah, Division bred and raised. I still sound off with "All the way" when saluting.

I know the feeling, I looked into my new tank and the Betta was hanging out in the open.

[seamonkey2]

well..so there are 2 division members here..add a third, 3/73AR 82nd ABN DIV 91-95

[Pennies2Cents]

Awesome build FJ. :) Seamonkey2 Good to see you posting again!

[SoLiD]

Any Updates AJ?

[Big_Pun]

guess this didn't happen??

[RayAllen]

I was wondering about this build also....

[SoLiD]

I think he forgot about us. To me it seemed to be too much work for one person IMO. I bet he got overwhelmed with the size of the project and the cost. It happens. $$$$

[Big_Pun]

I think he forgot about us. To me it seemed to be too much work for one person IMO. I bet he got overwhelmed with the size of the project and the cost. It happens. $$$$

yea all his post on dfw,arc, and rc are dead with people just asking about updates

[Big_Pun]

hey at MACNA AGE had this tank they build maybe you could get them to build it faster??

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/12/09/29/
5eny4y3e.jpg

[SoLiD]

No Picture?

[Scutterborn]

It's a much smaller scale.

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/12/09/29/u6ejygud.jpg


- Ben -

[BBQHILLBILLY]

there it is

[greensun]

great design,beautiful:applause:

[Big_Pun]

anyone here..................:zzz:

[Texreefer]

Chris its a "DROP OFF" tank:bigsmile:

[tylermonster]

Chris its a "DROP OFF" tank:bigsmile: har har har :applause:

[Louis-210]

Chris its a "DROP OFF" tank:bigsmile:


HAHAHHH lol