Live Rock Recommendations

[rrasco]

I'm new to the salt scene. Been keeping Africans for years and thought I'd jump over to the dark side with a tank or two. I'm starting up a 29g reef tank, hopefully this weekend, and was looking for recommendations on where to pick up some live rock. Any advice I can get on choosing live rock would be appreciated.

[Europhyllia]

depends on your style lol

Trying to avoid trouble? Go with dry rock. Personally I prefer pukani. The bacteria will come eventually. You avoid all hitchhikers this way

Interested in variety and not afraid of the risk? Florida Liverock will come with all kinds of interesting stuff. Richard at Tampa Bay Saltwater is awesome. You can get an all in one with this one: bacteria, macro algae, starfish, shrimp, a variety of very desirable critters, even coral! ...but also a variety of not so desirable critters.

Those are sort of the opposite ends of the spectrum. I would choose one or the other. Either play it safe or really have some fun with it.
Of course there's also the middle route of going with some cured liverock. It means all of the interesting stuff has died off in transit from the Pacific. Some small critters (pods etc.) might be there, the bacteria is there, but not much else.

[ErikH]

I would start with nice dry rock. Phenomenal Aquatics has had it in the past for 1.99/lb. I am rebuilding my 200, and I used all new dry rock to avoid complications. In smaller tanks, bad things happen faster, so try and keep it simple.

[rrasco]

I've been doing a lot of reading.....from what I understand, with cured rock there is no need to cycle the tank. If I were to use dry rock, would I need to perform a cycle?

[Europhyllia]

yes. you can seed it with bacteria. I've done the ammonium chloride/Fritz bacteria thing with great success.

You still have to cycle a tank with liverock too only that the liverock will contain the bacteria

[rrasco]

I've also read that if you have enough live rock, a filter is not necessary, is this true? And if so, does the same hold true for dry rock?

[tebstan]

I've also read that if you have enough live rock, a filter is not necessary, is this true? And if so, does the same hold true for dry rock?

You'll still need flow, though. Do you have a sump?

For a long time I didn't use a skimmer, or carbon, or reactors, or anything fancy. Just live rock and lots of flow. (I have a sump, and always had a skimmer on hand even if it wasn't hooked up.)

As things aged and I fed more, I added other types of filtration. Every tank will be different... you may get away without "filtration" if you have a large enough tank with enough flow.

[rrasco]

No sump. The plan was to use a hydor koralia 425.

[tebstan]

I would still look into a good canister filter with a tank that size. Even if you don't think you'll need it, it can't hurt to have one around in case something happens and you need to run carbon.

[rrasco]

I'm used to running bio/mech on my fresh tanks. A hob or can would add mechanical and some bio. Are there benefits to running carbon on a sw setup as opposed to fw? Like...dosing chems more often? I don't ever run carbon and didn't plan to here and I don't use chemicals, besides dechlor, really at all. I would prefer to not run a filter if I don't need it. I have extra filters if I needed to throw one on in any event.

[tebstan]

Are there benefits to running carbon on a sw setup as opposed to fw?

Depends. :D
Every tank is different... some people insist on carbon or bio chem type stuff, some people would never use it. If you don't use things like that normally and want to go all natural, it can be done.

[Europhyllia]

I don't run a filter but I do have a skimmer on each of my systems.
How easily you can get away without one might largely depend on your bioload and maintenance routine. Ace doesn't use skimmers but he does water changes twice a week. If you got lots of messy eaters in your tank it will be tougher to keep things well than if you stock lightly, etc.

[tebstan]

Karin brought up the best point... bio load. I re-read the original post; you don't mention what kind of tank you want to set up. Reef? FOWLR?

[rrasco]

Depends. :D
Every tank is different... some people insist on carbon or bio chem type stuff, some people would never use it. If you don't use things like that normally and want to go all natural, it can be done.

That's how it is with freshwater, wasn't sure if there was a difference in relation to salt. If I were to run carbon, it would be to remove chemicals I may have dosed for illnesses, which I have never had to do. Chemical filtration is unnecessary IME.

I have no idea how high my bio load will be. I'm planning on having few fish, mainly a reef tank. But I do want fish, just no idea what I can have outside of a clown. Worse case, I will add a can or decent HOB for mechanical if need be. Are corals messy eaters?

[alton]

I use a HOB emperor 400 on my 29 for a filter. I use one side with a filter fluff filter and I filled up the other side with rubble. I also run two nano power heads for circulation. I am not abig fan of carbon (to each his/her own) that is why I just run filter fluff. Water changes once a week and the tank has about 30 lbs of live rock. I keep SPS, LPS, and softies in this tank, fish consist of two pearly jawfish and a cleaner shrimp.

[rrasco]

I use a HOB emperor 400 on my 29 for a filter. I use one side with a filter fluff filter and I filled up the other side with rubble. I also run two nano power heads for circulation. I am not abig fan of carbon (to each his/her own) that is why I just run filter fluff. Water changes once a week and the tank has about 30 lbs of live rock. I keep SPS, LPS, and softies in this tank, fish consist of two pearly jawfish and a cleaner shrimp.

What are you using for lighting?

[tebstan]

Are corals messy eaters?

Well, I'm a messy feeder.

You can target feed most corals, but it's so easy to just pour food in and let the current take it. I target my lps with pellets once in a while. I use a lot of powdered foods for the other corals; it took a bit to get the delicate balance right.

[Bill S]

As several have noted, go with dry rock. I will never put live rock into a tank again. Yes, it might take a week or 2 longer. Who cares. It will likely save you major headaches later.

[rrasco]

The main reason being to avoid hitchhikers?

[Europhyllia]

crazy algae, hitchhikers, aiptasia and majano (did I spell that right). Anything you don't want

[rrasco]

Is dry rock just dead live rock? Or is it different? Sorry for all the questions, just trying to understand.

[Europhyllia]

two types:
there is dry rock like the pukani that originated in the ocean and was dried out. Pukani is very lightweight. You get a lot of dry pukani for the money.
and then there is land harvested rock like the kind our sponsor store reefcleaners sells.
It is mined inland. It hasn't seen ocean water in millions of years but probably originated there. it's calcium carbonate. It's heavier and denser than pukani but from an ecological perspective probably more responsible

[alton]

I have a canopy with 4 T5HO lamps and reflectors. If I had the money or if Karin wanted to give me one of her LEDs I would change.

[rrasco]

I have a canopy with 4 T5HO lamps and reflectors. If I had the money or if Karin wanted to give me one of her LEDs I would change.

4x24w?

[alton]

Yes 3 UVL and 1 ATI

[Bill S]

If you've ever made the decision to tear down a tank due to pests - which I have - you will never accept hitchhikers of any kind - swimming, crawling or growing (algae).

[rrasco]

Dry rock it is.

[kkiel02]

I first seeded my 65 gallon with live rock about 4 years ago now but every upgrade since then it has been dry rock. Like Bill said the hitchhiker risk is just too much.

[rrasco]

I'm planning on putting about 50-60lbs of dry rock in there when I can track some down. Waiting for phenomenal to open so I can see if they have any. I'll take the advice of everyone here and avoid any future problems from the start.

[rrasco]

Is this, or was this, live rock? I bought a tank a couple years ago that was used as saltwater, it came with a few of these and a big piece of texas holey rock I used in my cichlid tanks. I threw this stuff out back and forgot about it. At the time, I had no idea what live rock was. It was dried out in the tank when I bought it. I'm assuming it is...if so, ideas as to what kind and/or recommendations on using it.

http://www.rrasco.com/AquaticPics/liverock.jpg

[kkiel02]

Texas holey rock is different than dry rock. Our sponsor ReefCleaners sells dry rock at a good price.

[Bill S]

Your pic looks like dry "live" rock. Holey rock is heavy.

[rrasco]

I know what texas holey rock is, I used that piece in my cichlid tank. It's the piece in the picture that I suspected to be dried out live rock. I was just curious if it was bad to use pieces like this, I mean, it has been in my backyard for 18 months.

[alton]

Cook it and it should be fine as long as you did not spray it with pesticides or weed killers