Are Bio Pellets Reactors Becoming Abandoned?

[SoLiD]

I noticed the price of Bio Pellets coming way down and a couple of people here removing them from their system. I thought this was supposed to be the next great thing to hit this hobby. Can anyone explain to me why the craze is dying down??? I understand the whole 15NO3:1PO4 ratio for the bacteria to reproduce. Is this why? Is it because most people are aiming for a 0 NO3-'s and 0 PO4's systems which wouldn't be conducive to having bio pellets in their system. Any input would be nice.

[ramsey]

I can't speak for anyone else but I've been using them for 5-6 months and love them. My tank is doing much better than it was without them. I have no detectable nitrates or phosphates. I love that I can overfeed and not worry about it. All my fish are super fat, most os my corals are happy and again, no nitrates or phosphates. The only coral that is not doing worlds better is my GSP but it grew like a weed in my old tank so it's kinda nice it's growing a little slower. SPS are doing far better.

On another note, the price of biopellets and reactors seem the same as they did when I bought 6 months ago. Where are you seeing that the price has come way down?

[SoLiD]

Vertex dropped by $20 on their Bio Pellets. From $70 to $50 for a 1000ml bag.

[allan]

I've been running them for a little over a month and I can't see a difference except that most of my lps seem to not swell much.

I've been assured that this will pass but I've considered pulling out the reactor a time or two.

[Europhyllia]

I think I was one of the ones to jump on the pellet bandwagon before most others did and I took them off line just about the time when everybody else started getting their reactors and here's why:
The things I like to keep like to eat (who doesn't!?) so my system is set up to supply food on a continuous basis (Powdered foods for seafans, sponges, filter feeders. etc.). About 8 hours per day food is dispensed slowly into the tank.
And that's the reason I even got the pellets. I am not keeping a low nutrient system.
I also was hoping the bacteria from the pellets could be used as food for my corals.
With my constant supply of food to the tank the bacteria used it in the water column causing an almost permanent bacteria bloom. None of the corals liked that. They certainly didn't seem to be happily eating the bacteria.
Sure N and P were super low but at what cost.
At some point I got so sick of it that I turned on the UV sterilizer (a 'don't do' for pellets) and within a few hours the tank was clear, the corals looked happier. My choice was then to either replenish the pellets in the reactor and keep the sterilizer running to ensure the bacteria only did their work in the reactor and not in the water column, to quit feeding round the clock or to simply do away with the pellets all together.
By that time I already knew that 50% of the reason I wanted the pellets to begin with didn't work for me: none of my critters cared to eat the bacteria stuff. Stop my automated feeding regime would have meant giving up on my intent to keep my critters fed as close as possible to how they are fed in the ocean. The cost to replenish the pellets in adequate amounts to keep up with my stuff seemed really high and so I decided to take the reactor off-line.

Ricordea finally started to puff up and split, gorgonians started to have their polyps out all the time, encrust the rocks and grow. Things looked better and that was really my decision maker right there.

At least for my type of set up the pellets were not a good fit (mostly due to my continuous feeding I am sure)

[allan]

I've never taken my UV offline. Reckon I should?

The decrease in cost could be attributed to the move from market skimming to saturation.

[CoryDude]

The decrease in cost could be attributed to the move from market skimming to saturation.

That was one variable I was thinking of too Allan. It seems like everyone is flooding the market now with their own version of the pellets.

Some people I've spoken to are having the same problems as with the Hiatt a few years back. The bacterial systems work too well, to the point of starving the corals.

With the Hiatt, I was feeding frozen, flake, and pellet foods on a daily basis, and nightly feeding of the corals 2x a week, and the sps still looked pale with little polyp extension.

[allan]

My polyp extension on the sps is poor... To nonexistent on the p lovelli (sp?).

If things don't get better I will be removing the bp.

[Big_Pun]

I love my pellets, the one thing I've run into is making sure the amount in my reactor stays constant and not let it get low. my tank is a lot cleaner and nitrates are undetectable, SPS love it but some softies suffered from too clean a tank along with algae. another thing is people use them and think they can use only a small amount as just a supplement, but I believe you need to go by directions and use the amount needed for you total system volume and remove all macro, they are not just chemical dosing but and actual biological filter.

[ErikH]

changing a prefilter all of the time to keep the reactor from clogging is what made me pull them from my system. I'm just lazy ;)

[allan]

I'm not using a pre filter, just the perforated plate on bottom and top.

I'm not crazy about the results yet. Worse case scenerio I've got one heck of a carbon reactor.

[ErikH]

Mine was getting clogged with detritus and then the plate would have uneven flow. Keep an eye on yours. :)

[allan]

I have forbidden uneven flow. :)

So far I've not had an issue with it... except for the poor reaction I'm getting from my corals.

[SoLiD]

Thanks everyone. Great info. I will take it all in and make a decision with in a week or so.

[Big_Pun]

Thanks everyone. Great info. I will take it all in and make a decision with in a week or so.

I also recommend a good reactor made for pellets not just a gfo reactor, nextreef,vertex, octopus make good reactors

[ReefCube]

keep it simple..ignore the hype remember many sps dominated reef tanks with great color have done this with ONLY regular water changes.

[Europhyllia]

keep it simple..ignore the hype remember many sps dominated reef tanks with great color have done this with ONLY regular water changes.

I disagree with that. I am all for trying new things. Some things stay. Some things change. If we just ignored any new options we'd all be filling up slate bottom aquariums. You got to have people willing to try stuff.

Once people tried it though it's often cheaper to take all the info they provide rather than spending money to experience it yourself. :)

[CoryDude]

Agree with Karin. We need people in this hobby willing to try something different. When I first started in the hobby, everyone would tell you not to buy goniopora's, because they would die after 6 months in captivity. But, hobbyists kept trying and trying and, now look where we're at.

Besides, I've seen pics of nice ULNS sps tanks using bacterial systems. Is it worth the trouble and expense with all the additives needed? IMO, not really.

David, I think the ultimate decision comes down to what type of system you're planning. If I was setting up a softie, fish only, or any other system requiring a lot of feeding, I'd use a bacterial filter in a heartbeat.

[Europhyllia]

If I was setting up a softie, fish only, or any other system requiring a lot of feeding, I'd use a bacterial filter in a heartbeat.

Really? I was actually thinking the opposite. lol

Softies don't care if there's a little extra N or P and in fact seem to do worse with less (as is the case when you got the pellets at work). My constant feeding just caused bacterial blooms in the water column. It seemed just like such a waste to spend money on the filterfeeder stuff and the pellets just to have it cancel each other out.

Like pouring blueberry juice and bleach in the washer at the same time...

I figured they should work great for SPS tanks with a few fish where all feeding is done with bite sized pieces that are eaten by the fish right away and no fine particles or liquids in the water column.

[Big_Pun]

keep it simple..ignore the hype remember many sps dominated reef tanks with great color have done this with ONLY regular water changes.

there has been an increase of pellet tank of month on RC, pretty good for only being around like 5-7 years and only recently popular in the US. no reason to give negative feedback on something you have never used.

[allan]

no reason to give negative feedback on something you have never used.

But if you have already tried it...

Actually, Rick assures me that the poor state of my LPS is a passing thing as the Bio Pellets take on the responsibility of filtering the water column.

I am, however, chewing my nails and watching anxiously.

[Regric25]

I have had a nextreef pellet reactor for about 4 months now and I love it! My nitrates were between 40 and 80 ppm becasue I feed alot and have alot of fish. I could not keep SPS in my tank because they would just die. I didnt want to give up my fish either and this was my answer to "having my cake and eating it too". Now with a 100g system I am successfully growing beautiful SPS and I have all my fish and I feed every day. NO3 is 0 and PO4 is 0! My softies and my LPS shriveled up for a couple of weeks after running it a month because the water quality changed for the better but they ALL bounced back and are growing faster than ever.

The only down side to having a bio pellet reactor is, I got a case of cyano. It was not bad and it would start to grow and then die so it could not get a foot hold on my tank. It didnt make sense to me because NO3 and PO4 is 0. I learned that the pellets provide a carbon source for the cyano to feed on. That is why its important for the outlet of the reactor to be near the skimmer and its also important to not have the flow to the reactor too high. I recently buy a ball valve on the pump line to the reactor and problem solved. Personally I recommend having bio pellets if you want lots of fish and SPS without having to do mass water changes every week. I havent done a water change in about 2 months on my tank because it does not need it. I dose fuel and feed coral frenzy everyother day and everything is happy.

[tebstan]

I also recommend a good reactor made for pellets not just a gfo reactor, nextreef,vertex, octopus make good reactors

Did anyone here try the Bulk Reef Supply reactor? It's just a GFO reactor with a special cartridge inside. It gets mixed reviews. Hard to get the pellets moving without high flow through it, but that's not supposed to be good for the pellets either.



another thing is people use them and think they can use only a small amount as just a supplement, but I believe you need to go by directions and use the amount needed for you total system volume

Why is that? (And how much is that? .5 to 1 liter is quite a range)

[SoLiD]

keep it simple..ignore the hype remember many sps dominated reef tanks with great color have done this with ONLY regular water changes.

Yes water changes are always best, but do you remember when Bob Fenner came down and gave his speech some years back? He tells the story of back then when skimmers were the hype. We all no where that one ended up. :)

[FireWater]

I have more questions than answers regarding bio pellet reactors. I have been swaying back and forth on the decision to install one on the new tank build. I plan on keeping a mixed reef tank with the majority being lps and softies so I am concerned by the reviews of folks having difficulty with these.

One of the things I have noticed is that a lot of people here have put the reactors on line on an established tank. I wonder what the difference would be if it was started from day one on a new tank?

[ErikH]

I assume on a new tank the bacteria would grow at a rate in line with the growth of the aquarium.

[FireWater]

I was thinking the same Erik. I was wondering if or how it would affect the system as a whole since there would be nothing there to start with. Might avoid some of the issues people have been talking about - cloudiness, coral stress, algae blooms. I guess I shall find out. LOL

[Big_Pun]

I was thinking the same Erik. I was wondering if or how it would affect the system as a whole since there would be nothing there to start with. Might avoid some of the issues people have been talking about - cloudiness, coral stress, algae blooms. I guess I shall find out. LOL

I believe it would work out better on a new system. all problems stem from excessive nutrients in our tanks, or maybe setup traditional with fuge then add the pellets after tank has settled in, then take fuge offline

[Europhyllia]

One of the things I have noticed is that a lot of people here have put the reactors on line on an established tank. I wonder what the difference would be if it was started from day one on a new tank?
I started my Caribbean reef with the pellet reactor online from the start. The nice thing was that I never had that hair algae bloom that new tanks usually get.
I did get a cyano bloom big enough to make me feel guilty every time I tease Allan about his. I'd say the avoidance of hair algae at the start was the only difference though.
I added the pellets when my old 125g was already running for quite some time and I added the pellets to the 215 before anything was in it and in the long run it didn't make much difference. Keep in mind even once your system is set up it changes over time. It's not a static environment.

One thing nobody mentioned here is the money. For my amount of feeding I do on a 215 gallon tank I can buy a years worth of Purigen,deNitrate and Phosguard for about $90 versus the $300 I spent for 1 year of pellets.

Here are a few more questions to consider (and some possible answers although I do not claim to have answers to everything ;) ):

* are pellets the only way to reduce N&P?
No (consider macro algae, mangroves, nitrate reactors based on sulfur or carbon/coil, nitrate absorbing media, media and substrate using anaerobic areas for nitrate absorbtion, etc.)

* are pellets the most convenient way to reduce N&P?
Maybe for some but not for everybody

* is 0 nitrate better than 5 ppm or 10 ppm or 20 ppm?
Maybe. Maybe not

* are pellets the most cost effective way to reduce N&P?
Probably not

[allan]

The only thing I'm experiencing is the coral stress. I never got an cloud bloom, and I believe the general consensus there is that since I didn't have any nitrates (probably has a sufficient quantity of phosphates) I didn't get it.

And to tell the truth, could be that my LPS are reacting to something else, but Rick recognized it as something he went through. My zoas are all doing fine, my candy cane are all swolled up. My green acans are trying, so is the colony of acans that I've had about a year and a half. But they haven't started really swelling out like they used to.

At night they all seem ready to eat, and I've been feeding them a couple times a week. Only one of my SPS isn't extending, but the color is great and I 'think' I see growth even though it's not extending its polyps.

[Europhyllia]

Only one of my SPS isn't extending, but the color is great and I 'think' I see growth even though it's not extending its polyps.
Off topic but there was a good article on the 'anorexic' reef in coral magazine a few issues back. Very interesting perspective. You might enjoy the read if you can find it online.

[allan]

I found reference to it, and a brief narrative, but couldn't draw up the article itself

[Europhyllia]

it was just posing the question why if the corals are doing so well do we not see more spawning events in the aquarium and that perhaps asexual reproduction happens even if corals are undernourished but sexual reproduction requires for the corals to be well nourished first. like I said: totally off topic ;)

[CoryDude]

And to tell the truth, could be that my LPS are reacting to something else, but Rick recognized it as something he went through. My zoas are all doing fine, my candy cane are all swolled up. My green acans are trying, so is the colony of acans that I've had about a year and a half. But they haven't started really swelling out like they used to.

At night they all seem ready to eat, and I've been feeding them a couple times a week. Only one of my SPS isn't extending, but the color is great and I 'think' I see growth even though it's not extending its polyps.

Karin, that's why I wouldn't use it on a lps or sps tank. I know bill had the same issues with the Hiatt, which even though it uses a different food source, is very similar to the pellets. The bacteria seem to cause problems on stonies for some reason.

The only reason I mentioned a softie tank, is because I used to feed mine very heavily and this type of filtration would have helped me avoid the algae problems.

[Europhyllia]

The only reason I mentioned a softie tank, is because I used to feed mine very heavily and this type of filtration would have helped me avoid the algae problems.

Makes sense - only that for me even though it avoided the algae problems it also 'avoided' the problem with softies thriving too much. So I'd rather deal with the algae problem a different way and have my softies happier. lol