Stocking 175G

[ramsey]

Here's my current fish:

yellow tang
kole tang
lawnmower blenny
false perc
blue damsel
yellow tail damsel
mystery wrasse
flame hawk
mandarin
5 chromis
2 6" engineer gobys

My questions is, do you think the current bioload is about all I can do or do you think I could safely add more fish? 175G seems like a lot of water so I'm thinking I could add more but I don't want to overdo it.

[Europhyllia]

I was wondering the same for my new tank.
Bob Fenner wrote some things on that.
Here's the page:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/stocking1.htm

Density/Stocking Rates/Carrying Capacity/Size:
Everyone can't agree on any one darned thing it seems. Some folks like Country & Western, other's Bach; why there's even people who enjoy eating lima beans!
Well, actually, there may be an item we can all get behind; the fact that marine system's should be under-crowded. How much is too much? That depends on many factors; the size and shape of the system, filtration, aeration. maintenance, the kind of livestock, it's size, feeding, temperature, and a whole lot more.
As a real good rule of thumb I'll say, oh, five gallons per cubic inch of livestock is about right. I know this is a very general measure, purposely vague, and with a larger-than-most margin for error; but it will do for almost all circumstances. A veritable fifteen pound treatise (not by me) could be written on all the interacting quantities and qualities that might figure into maximum and optimum stocking rates. All this is irrelevant in light of the above guideline, and:
"When in doubt, leave it out" will become your motto for talking yourself out of that "just one more specimen" which may be one too many. The dynamics of quantifying the carrying capacity of a system is not your only concern. Sure, your filter may be able to support a beluga, but what about the behavioral interaction with the rest of your livestock and that "sea canary"? Don't believe the filter system manufacturers and their writing/advertising lackeys; under-crowd and you and your livestock will live happier, longer lives.


Not sure how wide some of your fish are (have not kept some of them so it's tough to guesstimate).
I just did a quick estimate for my system.
I have 215g tank plus 50g sump but lots of sand so I'll go with 200 gallons actual water volume. Or should I go with water volume for the display tank only? That would be 175 gallons.
So I have 35 - 40 cubic inches of fish space to assign...

My fish are:
Clowns:
1"x0.5"x2.5" = 1.25 cu.in. times two (got a pair) = 2.5 cu.in.

Bartletts:
1.25"x0.5"x2.75" = 1.7 cu. in x 6 = 10.2 cu. in

Mandarins:
0.75"x0.5"x3" = 1.125 cu.in. x 2 = 2.25 cu. in.

Jawfish:
0.75"x0.75"x3" = 1.7 cu.in. x 6 = 10.2 cu. in

PJ Cardinals:
0.5"x1.75"x2.5" = 2.18 cu. in x 5 = 10.9 cu. in

comes out to around 36 cu in of fish (not all of them are that size yet. I used numbers that allowed growth into final average aquarium size)

Looks like I am fully stocked then!

[Europhyllia]

I'll take a stab at yours :)
yellow tang
0.75x3x3= 6.75

kole tang
0.75x3x4= 9

lawnmower blenny
0.75x0.5x4= 1.5

false perc
1"x0.5"x2.5" = 1.25 cu.in.

blue damsel
1"x0.5"x2.5" = 1.25 cu.in.

yellow tail damsel
1"x0.5"x2.5" = 1.25 cu.in.

mystery wrasse
1"x0.75x4 = 3

flame hawk
1x0.75x3 = 2.25

mandarin
0.75"x0.5"x3" = 1.125

5 chromis
1.25"x0.5"x2.75" = 1.7 cu. in x 5 = 8.5

2 6" engineer gobys
1x1x6= 6x2 = 12

so... your total according to me is ;) : 45.6

Your fish space allowance is 35

[StevenSeas]

cool calculations Karin, but I think your over estimating the width of the fish. I havent ever seen a 3x3x.75 wide yellow tang, sure the full grown extremely healthy specimen might be like that but a juv. would be more like .25 imo, and the same with the damsels/clown. of course neither of us know what Ramseys fish look like, and the other figures seem resonable

[Europhyllia]

hm... I was looking at my false percs. They're about 5 years old and pretty big. I bet they're wider than 0.25"
I actually am holding a ruler here while I write all this.
0.25" for a Kole tang? Seems very very skinny (Kole tang was the only tang I ever owned). I'll settle for 0.5

I'll redo it for ramsey's skinny minnows though ;)
yellow tang
0.5x3x3= 4.5

kole tang
0.5x3x4= 6

lawnmower blenny
0.75x0.5x4= 1.5

false perc
1"x0.25"x2.5" = 0.625 cu.in.

blue damsel
1"x0.25"x2.5" = 0.625

yellow tail damsel
1"x0.25"x2.5" = 0.625

mystery wrasse
1"x0.75x4 = 3

flame hawk
1x0.75x3 = 2.25

mandarin
0.75"x0.5"x3" = 1.125

5 chromis
1.25"x0.5"x2.75" = 1.7 cu. in x 5 = 8.5

2 6" engineer gobys
1x1x6= 6x2 = 12

so... your total according to me is ;) : 40.75
Looks like you are just about perfect right now. You could add more (everybody does) but it would be less ideal than it is now.

[RayAllen]

Being in the aguarium hobby both fresh and salt for a while now, ive seen a few formulas for calculating how many fish should be in what size aquarium. I do not think this can be formulated in any way.

Way to many things to take into consideration when simply calculating the true volume of ones aquarium. Amount of rock, sand, space your overflows take over, pumps etc. all displace water. This obviously changes how many gallons one actually has.

Examples:
One can say you may be albe to lightly overstock if your filtration can handle the bioload. In some cases with certain species its better to have many to cut down on aggression. In one huge tank you may be able to have only two large fish because of the species you choose. Only 2 huge lion fish in a 250g aquarium will look understocked to most people. I could go on and on with this.

Bottom line you with a little research of species and just experience you will know when your tank is at its maximum capacity or everything just seems right.

I do not know if anyone who has a aquarium where they are to a point of just saying WOW its perfect I do not want to add or take away anything else, but it would be nice.

[Mr Cob]

Nice fish list Ramsey.

Karin those calculations are neat. Pretty technical.

Ramsey, I think you will find the right balance as you add the fish. I personally think some tanks can handle more and some less especially considering the amount of rock you might have or don't have.

I would consider adding a Saphire Damsel. I have one and it's my oldest fish. I have had it for about 2.5 years...super peaceful and very hardy. He eats pests from the liverock as well.

Can't wait to see it all in action.

[Europhyllia]

Karin those calculations are neat. Pretty technical.
I think that makes it such a nice starting point. Sure there are many more factors to consider (even Fenner says that in his write up) but I think it gives you a good idea of where you'd be at in this scale.
Because let's face it the many factors we consider almost always include our own 'wants'. And there always seems to be room for just one more. Putting a number on it makes it a little more accountable/less fudgable.

How often do you read stuff from people saying: I know that fish is too big for my tank, I have a lot of fish for that size tank, I know those fish are generally not considered compatible but: it's working out for me and my fish are happy. Then a couple of weeks later reports of ich, reports of fish die-off, some fish not eating, some fish never coming out of hiding, aggression, etc.

Newsflash: fish that are not eating are not happy. Fish that are dead are not happy. Fish that are sick are not happy. Just because a bunch of fish can manage to swim in the same tank on the same day does not mean it's working out well. ;)

[Europhyllia]

In some cases with certain species its better to have many to cut down on aggression.
Exactly. But you don't cram those 'many' into a too small tank just because you need 'many' to make it work. You either have a big enough tank for 'many' or you choose a different fish.

[ErikH]

The biggest thing is minding where the fish swim, hang out, etc. Some are open swimmers, others are top, some are rock clingers, others are bottom feeders. If your tank looks fully stocked, then it is. :)

[ramsey]

The biggest thing is minding where the fish swim, hang out, etc. Some are open swimmers, others are top, some are rock clingers, others are bottom feeders. If your tank looks fully stocked, then it is. :)

It does so I guess it is. I wanted to add more stuff but I guess the old saying is true "If you have to ask...".

[ErikH]

Oh, another thing to consider is rockwork. I used to use a bunch of tonga branches to raise larger rocks of the sandbed to allow for more swimming areas for my tangs. They would race around through the new structures like it was a racetrack. If you have enough space in your sump you can always throw your less attractive rock down in there and open up your display some.

[Europhyllia]

I agree with Erik.
When I tore down my old tank I was surprised how some fish (the anthias especially) seemed to really respond well to the open space.
It was a big decision maker in the design of the new tank: less rock, more tunnels and more really open space to swim.

[ramsey]

It's pretty open already but could use some improvements. I have a cave on one side that a lot of the fish like to hang out in. On the other side it's pretty much just open space. They spend some time in the open but the cave seems to be their favorite place.

[tebstan]

cool calculations Karin, but I think your over estimating the width of the fish. I havent ever seen a 3x3x.75 wide yellow tang, sure the full grown extremely healthy specimen might be like that but a juv. would be more like .25 imo, and the same with the damsels/clown. of course neither of us know what Ramseys fish look like, and the other figures seem resonable

Depends on the fish I'm sure... my 3" tang is about .5" thick, maybe more after a good meal. But my 2.75" clown is probably .75" thick. She's big boned. :)

Does anyone else's fish freak out when you put a ruler up to the gl*****

Cool link Karin, doing some measuring and math now.