Starfire - how important

[Europhyllia]

Okay correct me on all that is wrong in these assumptions:


starfire is a low iron glass so instead of having that slight green cast glass usually has it is completely transparent
starfire distorts colors less
starfire is significantly more expensive
starfire is not clearer. the benefit is more accurate color representation
light bulbs etc. change color representation anyway

[BSJF]

I was talked out of getting it and wish I had spent a little more money. With the larger tanks, and thicker glass is harder to see through clearly and it took me a long time to get used to.

[RayAllen]

Starfire is a personal preference. Its not important. To be honest with you I do not know looking at a tank rather or not it has starfire glass unless im told it does.

What you listed is correct though.

[RayAllen]

Before Starfire people didnt have a hard time seeing clearly into any tank unless it was dirty or all scratched up. Now that its available people simply want it.

One of those its the newest coolest things...... ;)

[aquasport24]

Here you go, judge it for yourself Karin.

[Europhyllia]

Giau I saw that. I am okay with a slight green cast since I already will run several purple and blue bulbs anyway I am assuming my color won't be accurate either way.
I am wondering if it goes beyond color. Will there be more clarity? Like starfire is HD or something.

Ray, did my husband PM you or what? lol

[aquasport24]

Yes i would say it clearer than regular glass, i have 3 sides starfire on my cube.

[txg8gxp]

My next bigger tank will be starfire for sure. The difference seems to stand out alot to me.

[Europhyllia]

Yes i would say it clearer than regular glass, i have 3 sides starfire on my cube.
Okay I'll look over your zoas for sale thread again... ;)

[aquasport24]

You have to see it in person to able to tell the diffrent..

[hobogato]

have you guys with starfire had a problem with scratching? i had heard that it is a little easier to scratch than normal glass.

[aquasport24]

That;s what i've heard too,but so far i have no problems, but i have no sand either..lol

[aquasport24]

Okay I'll look over your zoas for sale thread again... ;)

Those zoas were taken from top down view.

[RayAllen]

Giau I saw that. I am okay with a slight green cast since I already will run several purple and blue bulbs anyway I am assuming my color won't be accurate either way.
I am wondering if it goes beyond color. Will there be more clarity? Like starfire is HD or something.

Ray, did my husband PM you or what? lol

LOL, thats just the way I think about a lot of products out there. Always something new coming along.

Dont get me wrong I think starfire is great, but not everyone wants to shell out the extra $$ to get it.

[Europhyllia]

Those zoas were taken from top down view.
I know but when I pick them up I could look at it from the side... ;)

Oh scratching that's no good. I try to keep the magnet high up but if I forget some little grabby hands might do some cleaning for me...

[aquasport24]

I know but when I pick them up I could look at it from the side... ;)

Oh scratching that's no good. I try to keep the magnet high up but if I forget some little grabby hands might do some cleaning for me...

Just let me know when and how many, so i can start cleaning the glass..lol..

[fishypets]

Once you go starfire you never go back, I can assure you that. Go to A.G.E.'s website and see the difference on tanks side by side with thicker glass. As for me my tank is 3/4 inch glass with three sides starfire and the back panel regular glass and the difference is night and day. Spend the extra money, besides it's your "dream tank" right? Go all out you won't be sorry.

[Europhyllia]

what about it being easier to scratch though?

[kkiel02]

karin honestly i also have a hard time telling the difference . i seriously thought about it for my new tank order but when it came down to orering i backed out as my glass usually isnt cleaned but once a week and the algae i accumulates would defeat the purpose for me

[acropoorer]

Karin,
I agree with Clint. First time I really saw a full tank with starphire was Green Maco's tank. I thought it was his coral, but identical coral in my tank with the same lighting just didn't have the pop. I wouldn't worry about scratching low iron any more than regular glass. I built my tank and when working the glass (grinding and polishing) starphire didn't seem any softer to me. Acrylic is where you have to worry about scratching. Also, the cost differential for three sides on my tank (which didn't have any labor ) was $300 out of the $3000 I have in the material and shipping. Makes even less sense to skimp when you look at all the $$ in livestock, upkeep, cabinets, lighting, sumps, chillers, calcium reactors, lighting....

Have you heard from the guy with starphire that regrets buying it. I haven't seen such a post (seen plenty that hate acrylic).

[ErikH]

Starphire is much clearer, to me, by far. That 45 I had was awesome. Starphire is HEAVY, at least on a small tank.

[Big_Pun]

Have you heard from the guy with starphire that regrets buying it. I haven't seen such a post (seen plenty that hate acrylic).

ive seen a couple starphire tanks in person and both dont regret the extra money spent, my next tank will be starphire. why buy the best coral and equipment to skimp on the one thing everyone will look at first, no one but us fish geeks appreciate the equipment.

[fishypets]

For all of you folks that can't tell the difference, click on this link and view the first picture second row. If you still can't tell the difference, you need glasses. ;)

http://www.acrylicandglassexhibits.com/index-1.html

[Europhyllia]

I think what the skeptics are wondering/saying is how much difference is there once the tank is full and the blue bulbs are on, etc.

[fishypets]

Karin,

You'll have to trust me on this one, if you can afford it low FE glass is the way to go. And IMO it doesn't cost too much more. The reward vs cost is far greater.

[fishypets]

And what I'm saying here is none of the skeptics have owned starfire so how would they know??? So far everyone that HAS owned starfire has all agreed it's the way to go. But in the end it's your money and you need to be happy with what ever decision you make.

Clint

[Europhyllia]

I'll pick up some frags from Giau soon and can look at his tank from all sides.
I'm okay with like $200 more of so. But if it requires a totally different approach (like a much more expensive custom tank instead of the general stock 215) then it may not be worth it.
My main concern is still the scratching

[txmike]

LIG is nice I am sure soon aomone will make that out of Borosilicate glass

[Europhyllia]

So far everyone that HAS owned starfire has all agreed it's the way to go.

I've been looking aroundon RC and a frequent complained I read form people that went with starphire and regretted it was that they scratched it up.
Maybe it scratches more easily because it's softer. Or maybe small scratches show more because it's clearer.

[neogenix]

Honestly, I was torn between my next tank being acrylic or starfire panels... It seems logical that you'd buy something that you could polish scratches out of, because you can recover from those mistakes?

[Europhyllia]

I don't think starphire is as easily scratched as acrylic just *maybe* more easily than regular.
I haven't actually found any real info that supports this. Just anecdotal evidence of people saying they scrtached their starfire. Who knows. Might have scratched regular as well.
I DEFINITELY don't want acrylic. Way too soft for me. Yes you can drain the tank and fix the scratches in acrylic but honestly taking down a 215 gallon tank to buff scratches just isn't my idea of fun. ;)

[kkiel02]

For all of you folks that can't tell the difference, click on this link and view the first picture second row. If you still can't tell the difference, you need glasses. ;)

http://www.acrylicandglassexhibits.com/index-1.html

If you have them side by side of course you can tell a difference. You can even see acrylic being even slightly more clear. Again though they are at someones house unless they have two tanks setup next to each other I have not been able to tell the difference. For instance I didnt notice Erik having a starphire tank when I was over until he just posted it now. I look at it like HD televisions yes at the store side by side you can easily tell differences but once you get them home and out of the box you lose that perspective.

[StevenSeas]

Karin, here's my two cents on the subject. When we first started carrying starfire or HD glass (depends on who makes it as starfire is just a name brand of low iron glass) I didn't think there was a very significant difference between normal glass and low iron. I had even told a customer this when they were looking at a starfire reef tank setup. A few months later we set up one of the HD glass tanks, I was like "wow that actually is a significant difference." I could really tell the difference of the clarity of what was in that tank and allthe other tanks just inches away. As far as scratching I just looked at it and haven't seen any scratches, now this is in a store where multiple ppl clean it and if we leave a mag float on it we too wil have little ones clean it. All of this led me tolooking into getting starfire for my own 30 that I was about to setup. Admittedly I didn't get it starfire because of the price difference for that siZe tank. I knew I would be upgrading as soon as I graduate from college, I would be moving it two times a semester and couldn't bear to break it had it been starfire. Just my opinions and thoughts from having set one up at work and working with them for a while and a potential customer. Hope that helps.

[neogenix]

I don't think starphire is as easily scratched as acrylic just *maybe* more easily than regular.
I haven't actually found any real info that supports this. Just anecdotal evidence of people saying they scrtached their starfire. Who knows. Might have scratched regular as well.
I DEFINITELY don't want acrylic. Way too soft for me. Yes you can drain the tank and fix the scratches in acrylic but honestly taking down a 215 gallon tank to buff scratches just isn't my idea of fun. ;)

The way I figure it is that *if* i scratch the starphire, i *CAN'T* drain it and fix it, fun or otherwise, but I can with acrylic. You're right though, it does seem to scratch more easily, but as long as you're aware of this, and you do your work to make sure that you don't, you should be good, I'd assume... although you'll have to be very careful.

[Teeb]

My 2 cents....I wouldn't even consider buying a tank that wasn't Starphire.

[alton]

Sorry I was out last Thursday/Friday, but anyway I got a custom 29 gallon made by Oceanic from Eddie at Alamo at least 5 years ago if not longer and it was made out of Starfire Glass. I clean it with a Kent Scraper with a stainless steel blade and it does not have any scratches that I can see. The levels of iron in glass tanks vary. I had a custom tank from Oceanic back in 2003 and it was clearer than most tanks. Where you can tell the difference in having a starfire tank is taking pictures. On my 300 it has starfire on the front with regular on the sides and just looking at a distance you would never notice the difference. When it was empty there was a big diiference. I guess it becomes how picky you are and how much money you want to spend? Some aquarium builders charge a little and some charge a lot for starfire.

[aquasport24]

I'll pick up some frags from Giau soon and can look at his tank from all sides.
I'm okay with like $200 more of so. But if it requires a totally different approach (like a much more expensive custom tank instead of the general stock 215) then it may not be worth it.
My main concern is still the scratching
Have you made up your mind yet?...lol..

[Europhyllia]

Hm no! Now I am considering a bigger tank. Mind made up even less (!)...
Was hoping the non starfire side on your tank would be viewable as a comparison.
Everything on yours is so vivid but it's hard to tell if it's the starfire glass or the light or the anthias. lol

[aquasport24]

You know what they say...........GO BIG OR GO HOME........LOL

[Europhyllia]

Pft. Once I add this all up I may have to go home -yours! lol
I'll figure it out.
Not feeling super motivated right now. My own tank looks terrible torn down so I am not feeling the love right now. Didn't expect to feel so unenthusiastic all of a sudden...

[aquasport24]

We all have that feeling every now and again, you'll feel diffrent tomorrow.

[alton]

Karin I have felt like that several times in the last 19 years keeping saltwater. You will get the bug back we just need a couple of drizzle days to keep you locked up inside to get you in the mood again. Gabe and I where talking yesterday how warm clear days are bad for business because everybody wants to go outside and enjoy versus shopping. Just incase you are thinking about going big, Lonestar Pets which is your favorite fish stores wholesaler has 300DD's with a starfire front in stock usually? And I believe someone here on MAAST has a 250DD he might want to sell? Just get what ever you want and don't cut yourself short otherwise you will never be happy.

[Europhyllia]

I think part of the problem is that I am not totally sure what it is I want. I do know the torn down neglected 125 is not it though...

[kkiel02]

Talk to Gabe maybe you can get you one like mine and we could split shipping. jk But get a tank that makes you happy. For instance- my 65 gallon was only 18" wide. I could only build a steep rock wall with little room for corals but that was all. My 180 is ok but my idea of aquascping cant be done with 24" either very well as I want various islands. I wanted to make sure I got 36" this time around so I know that I can do pretty much whatever I want without having to worry about room/space. As Gabe mentioned to me the other day you will be the one looking at it 90% of the time so get what will make you happy. :)

[nubz]

anybody think it would make a difference in the thin glass of a ten gallon?

[Europhyllia]

anybody think it would make a difference in the thin glass of a ten gallon?
I always read that in small tanks it makes very little difference.

[txg8gxp]

The big difference between the glass is the amount of light distortion. So the thicker the glass, the more effect. Starfire glass even thin will have less distortion then standard glass...but probally not worth the money. Just my 2 cents.

[Europhyllia]

Okay I am still waiting on the quote. :(
Monday it will be 2 weeks I think. I know it supposedly takes 6-8 weeks to make the tank but if even the quote already takes 2 maybe I should get used to the idea that the tank will take more like 3 months...
I just want to make a decision and start worrying about something else.

[Europhyllia]

I contacted a few people that in my opinion had fantastic photos (including regric -last month's POTM winner) to inquire what kind of glass they had and all of them had regular -not starphire- glass.
My main concern was really how clear it would be in pictures since I'd like to get more into photography (again - I still have my old Minolta film camera on my desk right now. lol) With that out of the way the difference between a stock tank with regular glass and a custom tank with starphire (since I just want a regular stock size) doesn't seem to justify the upgrade in my case.
In fact I might squeeze out a nice starter kit on a camera with the savings.