Auto Top-off Set Ups

[allan]

Hey Mods, if this should be in the DIY feel free to move (no worries) but I figured maybe this belongs here.

As you all already know (well, not really, no one knows) I will be designing a water RODI/top off/kalkwasser station in my closet that will feed the back end of my tank leaving me very little to do other than add stuff here and there and generally just admire my work.

So, to the purpose of this thread. I'd really like to see how some of you have your systems duddied up. Pictures would be awesome, and maybe if you pretended that I was like... ten? when describing your system... yeah that would be great! Maybe explain it like I was five, that would be better. :)

[kkiel02]

Well I guess you saw mine today.... I used to have the kalk reactor off the ato but was getting calcium and kh readings through the roof. Like I said with my weekly water changes I dont really need the kalk reactor at the moment. I use the tunze osmolator for the ato and love it. Its pricey but with the float switch and the infared it hasnt messed up on me yet.

[Europhyllia]

I am guessing you are looking for something really snazzy so I will keep my super simple approach short:
I am using a standard ATO with dual float valve thingy, a Tom's Air Lift pump, a smallish trash can and a home depot timer.
The Reeffanatic ATO is plugged into the timer. It gets power from about midnight till 9 am. (that's when I need the extra pH)
The aqua lift is plugged into the ATO and drains into the sump. I chose the aqualift pump because it has such a small/narrow hose that it takes it several hours to fill it but it does so very gradually rather than dump a bunch of kalkwasser in at once. Oh and it's cheap but reliable.
No RO/DI top off for me. I don't mind topping off myself plus I think buckeye said it's not good to have a continuous top off thing going on so that would have to be sort of on a timer as well. Not sure how to do that.

[FireWater]

How about if I explain it like you were 9 and needed an allowance?

Here is mine - fairly reliable and accurate. Does cost a fortune to operate though.








http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p157/perry4083/005-2.jpg

[corruption]

I just ordered parts for a very similar configuration to Karin's auto-topoff.. 2 float valves, a relay switch, some wiring and a Tom's Aqualifter... It'll be running into most likely a 7 gallon bucket. I don't have the whole kalkwasser dosing in place -- I try to avoid the balancing dance as much as possible :)

Here's the basic instructions I'm basing my work on:

http://www.melevsreef.com/plumbing/auto_topoff.html

Hope that helps!

-Justin

[corruption]

How about if I explain it like you were 9 and needed an allowance?

Here is mine - fairly reliable and accurate. Does cost a fortune to operate though.








http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p157/perry4083/005-2.jpg

LOL!

Is your top-off system up for rental?? :rofl:

-Justin

[allan]

I have a aqua lift pump... any danger of that acting as a siphon when powered down? How much volume does it move in those nine hours? What is your mixture rate for the kalkwasser?

I was thinking a gallon of water a day would keep my tank full, and about a full teaspoon per gallon.

K, would you mind snapping a pic for me?

I've been itching to do this for some time, but seeing yours today (Kevin) has spurred me into action. I plan on opening the wall in the closet today to expose the piping that feeds the shower.

Right now my timer is my hearing... when the return pump starts to gurgle I know I'm way over due. My method is filling up a brute or five gallon jug, manually rolling or carrying over to the library and then slowly filling it up. I don't like the idea of sending five gallons of RO into the system and I put it in at the sump intake area to give it max time to dilute into the rest of the system before hitting the display. But five gallons out of 300 isn't too bad.

[corruption]

2.5-3 gals per hour on the aqua-lift... it shouldn't act as a siphon, one-directional reliable water movement is their job :)

Agreed, 5 gal out of 300 is 1.66% of total water volume -- pretty negligible :)

-Justin

[allan]

How about if I explain it like you were 9 and needed an allowance?

Here is mine - fairly reliable and accurate. Does cost a fortune to operate though.



HA!!! I got me one of them! Of course now that he's fifteen and stronger... I get less work out of him... maybe I should try to get another one (slapping self furiously), never mind.

[allan]

Justin, how, or what do you use, to control your RODI unit. Right now I have a valve that I manually turn. I was thinking something like a solenoid used in the sterilizer systems in a hospital... but the one's I have access to are copper.

I envision maybe a brute for the RODI, and another Brute that I can use as a mixing station in the even I want to do a water change, and then the Kalkwasser bucket/reactor which I plan on running at night.

Ok, I was able to click and open the link you gave me (I used my finger and a mouse), so I'm gonna read it now.

[kkiel02]

Well I just sold my kalk reactor today right before you got there. I can send you some pics of the ato but its just the pump with the controller and the switches. I know Ping helped to get mine setup, you may want to try and get ahold of him.

Firewaters post cracked me up as I didnt see the pic at first, then I got it.

Also a side note that I evap alot of water each day. That 20g tub only gets me a weeks worth but that may be because of the halides, etc. My tank is around 79-81 nowadays.

[corruption]

My plan isn't to run RO/DI to the top off container -- my tank uses about 1.5 gal a day, but will likely reduce to .5-.75 gal a day once I get my chiller in place next week. I have no problem just keeping my top off container manually filled. But -- I'm lazy and fearful of failure that wil llead to water filling and filling and filling.... hence why my RODI unit lives outside :D

-Justin

[Europhyllia]

I think I use at least 2 gallons a day (125g tank with 50g sump). 1tsp per gallon kalk mix.
I have never seen the aqua lift syphon back but the hose doesn't reach into the water either. ;) It just drips into the baffle.
I bet it pumps a couple of gallons an hour. I don't think I would need to have power to it for as many hours as I do but I set it that way because I consider those within the range of when I would want the kalk to go in.
I have managed to wiggle the hose loose and run a few gallons of kalk into the dining room overnight (hence the little hair clip thingy holding it in place now...) so fasten it somehow...
I am actually thinking of discontinuing the kalk thing and giving bulkreef's two part system a try.

Note on the pics: the aqualifter sits usually on top of the trash can lid but I figured you see more if I open it ;)

[aquasport24]

here is my ATO,please chime if you see think something is wrong

ro/di tank 20g

http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg305/aquasport24/DSC_1581.jpg

ReeFanactic ATO and Aqualifter, Aqualifter will get signal from Reefantic monitor than pump water thru reactor.

http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg305/aquasport24/DSC_1582.jpg

2 sensors in sump ( i hate those little suction cups , that is the only drawback from this system. Need to find a better way to mount the sensors without cups)

http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg305/aquasport24/DSC_1585.jpg

ro/di water run thru reactor before enter sump

http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg305/aquasport24/DSC_1586.jpg

[corruption]

very nice Giau -- very clean and professional looking. I likes :D

-Justin

[FireWater]

Justin thanks for the link. Giau - very nice set-up.

Allan, whatever ideas you come up with remember to have safety precautions and back-ups in place. Mike sold you that tank after the last crash that was caused from too much alk introduced into the tank. It was a chain reaction set into place because he cleaned his skimmer which in turn pulled too much water out of the sump which in turn caused the auto top off to do its job. Longer story shorter - all the extra alk/calc shot the Ph through the roof. Ever since that day of pulling dead coral after dead coral out of his tank I have been too scared to run a top off and get too automated with dosing

[aquasport24]

To prevent some of the above as John mentioned. Most of my water will fall back into the sump (in sump skimmer) when the skimmer goes nuts. My fresh water tank is 20g but will stop at 15g which my tank can handle(salinity wise). I only add 4 tables spoons of kalk into reactor weekly which will take my PH to 8.5 if things go wrong w/ ato system.The two sensors will back up each if one fails.Just to make sure you don't knock the outlet hose out when you do mantainence under the stand and you won't have to clean up smelly carpet:bigsmile:

[wkada]

I use the dual float valve setup from autotopoff.com along with the Tom's aqualifter. Their website has everything you would need to set something up. RO/DI reservior is a 5g container, although you could use any size you want. System is very reliable and I have not touched it since setting it up, plus it is fairly cheap ($50). I also have one of their single float valve setups in a box in the garage if you are interested. I drip Kalk seperately with a 5g Kent aquadoser (12 teaspoons in 5g lasts about 5-7 days).

[jroescher]

Firewater,
Your ATO is working very well. That tanks almost empty!

I have float switches that control a solenoid valve plumbed from my RO/DI directly to my sump. One float switch that controls water level, the other as a backup in case the first fails. I've been running this setup without fail for years. In the near future I plan to replace the solenoid valve with 2 valves plumbed in a series for added protection.

[allan]

WKada, we have to talk! I probably be interested in it.

Ok, John, you know Mike told me about that and I even read it here but never grasped what had happened until I read your post. Makes sense. In short, keeping in mind Giau's method, I would probably want to run the kalk dosing independently of the auto top off, in parallel rather than series set up.

I can tell you with absolute certainty that forgetting to replace water taken out while cleaning the skimmer and then overdosing the tank... well, that's something I would definitely do.

So, and maybe I missed it, what kind of switch do I use to turn the RODI unit on and off? My reasoning I would either need two systems, one to control the ATO for the tank, and another to control the ATO for the RODI barrel. Else I would have to manually go in and turn on my RODI once or twice a week.

I replace about a gallon a day in evap loss. T5s and closed canopy.

I definitely plan on having the redundant system in case something fails.

[Big_Pun]

yes the aqualift will siphon, read that and also was warned by a felllow maast member the other day when he was showing me his ato system

[Kristy]

Wow, Allan... I keep reading your reference to a gallon a day for evaporation loss. We use fans blowing across the surface of the water year round for temp control, with more fans during the 9 months of summer blowing across the sump. Our evaporation is about 3 - 5 gallons a day, depening on the season (5 in the summer) and we only have a little more water volume than you do. Interesting... what do you do for temp control? Do you have any temp issues?

[wkada]

Something like this would control your RO/DI reservior, hooked up to a simple timer.






http://www.autotopoff.com/solenoid/solenoid_1_resize.JPG (http://www.autotopoff.com/solenoid/solenoid_1.JPG) http://www.autotopoff.com/solenoid/solenoid_2_resize.JPG (http://www.autotopoff.com/solenoid/solenoid_2.JPG) http://www.autotopoff.com/solenoid/solenoid_3_resize.JPG (http://www.autotopoff.com/solenoid/solenoid_3.JPG) http://www.autotopoff.com/solenoid/solenoid_4_resize.JPG (http://www.autotopoff.com/solenoid/solenoid_4.JPG) http://www.autotopoff.com/solenoid/solenoid_5_resize.JPG (http://www.autotopoff.com/solenoid/solenoid_5.JPG) http://www.autotopoff.com/solenoid/solenoid_6_resize.JPG (http://www.autotopoff.com/solenoid/solenoid_6.JPG) http://www.autotopoff.com/solenoid/solenoid_7_resize.JPG (http://www.autotopoff.com/solenoid/solenoid_7.JPG)
Specifications

How it works:
The solenoid is an electronic valve capable of handling the higher pressure of reverse osmosis (RO) or city water system. The valve opens when powered, and remains closed when not energized. A topoff controller is normally required to use a solenoid, however some people have setup a timer to control the solenoid to open for a few minutes per day. A solenoid is commonly placed on the 1/4" water line between your RO water filter and your tank. They can also be used to fill a topoff reservoir or for water changes.
Model:Polypropylene Solenoid Valve. Normally closed (open when powered). 120VAC .09 Amps Internal components are saltwater safe (plastic and stainless steel). Quick connect 1/4" OD tubing fittings are included.
Temperature and Pressure:90 PSI Max. 120 degrees F Max. Click Here for more information (http://www.autotopoff.com/solenoid/specs400.htm)Flow Direction:Direction matters! Connect your RO system to the high pressure input side labeled "IN" (http://www.autotopoff.com/products/solenoid/images/s03_jpg.jpg) on solenoid. Connecting the solenoid backwards will cause water to slowly leak through the valve.Dimensions:Length 2.75", Width 2", Height 2.5"Cord Types and Lengths:2 prong power cord 18 Gauge, 3 feet in length. Solenoid leads approximatly 18" in length. Connection is soldered and double heatshrinked.Solenoid Valve
$34

[allan]

Bingo! That solenoid is what I'm looking for on that end. Hook that up to my RODI to fill my staging barrel. Then my ATO can be supplied by the barrel to the sump when the float valve opens/closes dependent on water level.

Karin, am I seeing your float valve right? It's in your fuge? Is your return water in the same chamber as your fuge macro?

Kristy, I should have said seasonal water evap. During the winter I use heaters to keep my water up to 78-79. Water volume prevents a rapid temp swing so when the weather (or house) temperature fluctuates out of norm it's gradually felt in the tank with no worries. I have one fan in the canopy that since I've returned the tank to its current location I haven't been using because I've been far too lazy to hook it up to the timer. I used to run it an hour after and before lights on and off. My entire canopy is enclosed and the top is vented so I've very little exposed surface water in the display to contribute to water evap. I don't run a fan in the sump because my water doesn't get hot enough for that, although I used to in my 100 gallon setup.

I would like to get something that will control (instead of a timer) my heaters and fan respective to the temperature of the water. So far those units are an arm and a leg. Of course I think it's more interesting to want something I can't afford rather than to get be able to afford it outright. Makes installing it a grand event. Weird huh?

[Europhyllia]

Allan I have two float valves. Yes one is in the fuge.
It's dripping into the baffle that comes from the skimmer department. Thinking about it it may get mixed in better if I drip it into the skimmer compartment.
I had a reason for not doing that though but I forgot what it was. Maybe something about not wanting the kalk to get majorly aerated (CO2 saturation) before being added to the tank water. I'll have to look and will get back to you on that.