mixed reef lagoon

[hobogato]

ok, so i will be starting up a new tank very soon. i am getting a 4'x2'x30" rimless tank this weekend. in order to make sure there is less lifting to do, i wanted to have the stand built and ready before moving it.

today, after work, i was able to build the stand.

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05302.jpg

tomorrow, i should be able to sand and stain it. then, the next day, seal it.

the stand is only 20" tall, so the top of the tank will be 50" above the floor so there is a view from the top and the sides. all four of the sides will be completely viewable.

as far as the plan for this tank, minimal is the operative word.

-no electric lights - will be directly under 3 solar tube sky lights (for now - may add some blue leds later)
-no sump
-no skimmer
-one or two koralia 4 pumps for circulation
-6" DSB
-about 80 lbs of live rock
-one or two large mangroves that will eventually grow into small trees (can get 5' tall in the space and still have sunlight
-various macroalgae species in the tank
-maybe some lower light corals eventually
-no fish

2 pairs of captive bred cuttlefish S. bandensis - hopefully eventually producing many offspring

[Squiers007]

Wow, this sounds like it will be an amazing tank when it is done. I cant wait to see it. How often are you planning on doing water changes? I know cuttlefish can be pretty messy eaters. Will you be able to keep a cleanup crew in there either? Dont they eat inverts? Also, just out of curiosity where are you getting the captive bred fish from?

[RayAllen]

Sounds awesome. I love the fact that you will be able to look down into it as well as see inside at seat level. Following along on another Hobogato build.

[txav8r]

No joke! That is going to be awesome! Cuttlefish are amazing creatures.

[mabel_photo6]

Keep posting updates... I'm really excited about this one.
I absolutely love Cuttlefish!!

[ErikH]

Ok so the big question is food. Whatcha gonna feed them without getting to into it? This will be the perfect habitat for them to emulate the passing of the clouds. I have always wanted to do them, but food has always been the issue. Oh and you can find CB cuttles on Tonmo.com, they are pretty much the major cephalopod forum, although it is fairly inactive at times.

[stoneroller]

Awesome! Can't wait to see it in action.

[blindside]

Woo man, this is going to be good!

[ErikH]

Oh yeah BTW that last half was to Squiers, not you Ace. LOL don't want you to think I am that kind of crazy. EDIT: Wait, is the boat going to be ocean going? Are you going to incorporate boat trips into cuttle food trips?

[hobogato]

thanks for all the comments, i am getting pretty excited myself :)

yes, as erik said, there are several people breeding them on tonmo.com. jeremy at reefs2u can also get some captive hatched ones on occasion - that is where i will try first. the tank wont be ready for them for a couple of months tho.

as far as cleanup crew, they will eat crustaceans, but not mollusks, so i will be adding some captive raised snails and stomata from the school system. we got about 50 a couple of years ago thru a project dibs member and now they are breeding like crazy in that system.

anyone else catching the other major idea behind this tank yet?

as far as feeding them, they typically eat frozen mysis when they are very small and some will continue to eat frozen as adults. will jump that hurdle when i get to it :wink_smile:

btw, i will be looking for frags of gorgonians and other filter feeding corals from members a little while down the road, so if you have some and want to start thinking about making some frags to sell.....

[Squiers007]

If they do begin to not like the mysis anymore I would try and get some larger pieces of squid and see if they like that. Some cephalopods are cannibalistic so they may like the squid pieces.

[hobogato]

oh, i should have been clearer. they will eat frozen mysis when small, but have to move on to larger and more diverse foods as adults. when i had them before, the female would eat anything previously frozen including krill and silversides, but the male would only eat live grass shrimp and live fish. i never tried squid tho, so thanks for the idea :)

[ErikH]

Umm clams? :) Would be great in a system that you can lean over.

[Mr Cob]

Very cool Ace. Glad to see you making use of those solar tubes. It will look awesome when the mangroves grow into small trees. This should look very natural.

[hobogato]

Umm clams? :) Would be great in a system that you can lean over.

funny you should say that.... :D

[NateDogg]

[QUOTE=hobogato;697562]
anyone else catching the other major idea behind this tank yet?

No one has mentioned the fact that everything you are mentioning is captive breed. I really like that and the fact that you are taking your class is that direction as well.

It seems, that once it is going it will be quite self sustaining as well.

very cool!

[ErikH]

WHADDAYA GOT DEWD!!!!??????!!! Those clams will love those trates!


funny you should say that.... :D

[hobogato]

you got it nate, trying to do as much aquacultured/captive bred stuff as possible.

erik, dont have anything yet, but will go in that direction down the road.

[fishypets]

Let me know when you're ready for some frags. ;)

[ErikH]

Ace I still have some gorgos!

[hobogato]

clint, thanks for the offer - dont know if i will be putting in any of those rare corals that you have tho.

erik, i will definitely want frags of them at some point.

got the stain and seal done on the stand in spite of the rain - at one point i was drying the doors to the stand with a hairdryer bc they got wet :lauging:
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05303.jpg

also got the sand i have here rinsed. more sand to pick up in the morning and hopefully after moving it here in the afternoon i will get it filled with water and start mixing in the salt.

[ErikH]

I'll be there Sunday just to say hello. I can help ya if you need.

[hobogato]

see ya then :)

[hobogato]

got the tank moved (thanks for the help everyone!).

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05304.jpg

sand in and filling with water - may be able to add live rock tomorrow....

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05305.jpg

[Triggerman]

That's going to look pretty cool...really nice foot print on the tank....

[hobogato]

well, since the silicone and top edges on the tank were not perfect, i decided to cover them with a wood frame that will eventually be stained to match the stand. i made this corner molding and attached it

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05306.jpg

should be able to add rock on monday

[cbianco]

As far as size goes... A far cry from your old tank. Regardless, I still like it.

I know that this will be a cuttlefish tank but how do you feel about the height of the tank? It seems tall.

Are the solar tubes still in place? What kind of lighting does a cuttlefish tank need?

Christopher

[blindside]

Looking good! Definitely a good tank/stand combo!

[Mr Cob]

Very unique looking. I love seeing non-common tanks and stands.

[mabel_photo6]

Oh my gosh... it looks awesome.
I went to an aquarium recently and I couldn't get away from the tank with a few Cuttlefish.
I LOVE them... I'm super excited for you and can't wait to see when you get them!!
Looks awesome so far!

[hobogato]

thanks for the comments all

chris, yes the solar tubes are still in place and i removed the diffuser and replaced it with clear acrylic on the one over the center of the tank. cuttles need little light, but there has to be enough light for the mangroves and macroalgae. i wasnt sure i would like the height at first, but i am really happy with it now. it is big enough to keep two pairs of cuttles, so it should be fun :)

[hobogato]

got the tank molding stained

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05308.jpg

you can see my ghetto water clearer upper in the corner here - a plastic tub with a power head in the bottom and sheets of foam in the top
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05307.jpg

may put the live rock in it this morning....

[dmweise]

Very nice. What's in the bucket?

[hobogato]

that is my home made water clearer upper :)

powerhead and some foam

[cbianco]

Everything is coming together nicely Ace. :thumbs_up:


...but there has to be enough light for the mangroves and macroalgae...

And some gorgonians I presume?


got the tank molding stained...

The tank, stand and trim all look nice. Your dyi skills never cease to impress me.


...you can see my ghetto water clearer upper in the corner here - a plastic tub with a power head in the bottom and sheets of foam in the top...

It's like a modified under-gravel filter, lol. I noticed the tank is not drilled. What more permanent plans do you have for filtration on this tank? HOB skimmer?


...may put the live rock in it this morning...

Can you say, "PICTURE UPDATE!" :p

Christopher

[hobogato]

no future plans for additional filtration - goin the all biological route :wink_smile:

rock is in, but the water is cloudy again from stirring the sand - pics when it clears up.

[Big_Pun]

man ace you waste no time, 24 hours and its a totally diff tank, looking good

[cbianco]

This is what you need, if you can find one.

http://www.atbskimmers.com/products/inventory/Multi-Use%20Skimmers/Multi-Use%20Skimmer/001b.jpg

http://www.atbskimmers.com/products/inventory.php?category=Multi-Use%20Skimmers


no future plans for additional filtration - goin the all biological route :wink_smile:...

Biological...thats just some scientific myth. The man wants you to believe in biology. :angel:


...rock is in, but the water is cloudy again from stirring the sand - picks when it clears up.

Don't make me wait to long, I may show up at your door step asking to sit in your boat and see your tank. :shades:

Christopher

[hobogato]

water is still a little cloudy, but you get the idea....

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05309.jpg

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05310.jpg

[Big_Pun]

how did u end attaching the k4, rock work looks good where are the mangroves going

[mabel_photo6]

:hypnotyized: I can't wait to see the end result.

[Rychek]

I love the rock work. I'm glad you've decided to give cuttles a try again. Oh, and I'm home now, so whenever you're ready to get the sand, I'll be ready.

[dmweise]

Awesome rock work! Did you epoxy the rocks together?

[hobogato]

thanks for all of the comments


no, i will be gluing the rocks in the tower, but the rest fit together pretty well and are stable.


Awesome rock work! Did you epoxy the rocks together?

[Squiers007]

Looking good man, Keep up the good work! I cant wait to see the finishe product!

[Jeff]

i like the set up, it looks real good.

[donnyda]

Ace, Glad the tank worked out for you! It looks fantastic! I can't wait to see the little tentacles waving through the top of the water ;-)

[hobogato]

thanks again donny, i think it will be perfect for what i am doing.

[ErikH]

Ace, Glad the tank worked out for you! It looks fantastic! I can't wait to see the little tentacles waving through the top of the water ;-)


thanks again donny, i think it will be perfect for what i am doing.


Quotes like ^that demand pics ! :D

[ballardjr2000]

AWESOME LOOKS AWESOME

[Crazyeyes]

Glad you haven't fully gotten out of the hobby and the tank looks great.

[hobogato]

the only thing living in the tank for the next 6wks to 2 months will be mangroves, macroalgae and some snails. not very picture worthy, but i will snap a few occasionally.

i want to be sure to take my time and make sure the tank cycles correctly before adding the cuttles :wink_smile:


Quotes like ^that demand pics ! :D

[hobogato]

well, i added a couple of mangroves and a little macroalgae(thanks bill) and a couple more small pieces of liverock. i am gonna add one more mangrove when i can make it over to ed's shop. i am still looking for some other types of macroalgae - especially the two red ones.

since i know erik will demand em, here are a couple of pics :)

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05311.jpg

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05313.jpg

[Mr Cob]

It looks really nice Ace. It will be sweet when the macro takes off.

Nice pics too! Very clear. Man, I need someone to take some nice pics of my tank :)

[hobogato]

i can prolly come by some time saturday if you want me to take some pics for you. i need to pick up that stuff for the school anyway. lmk.

[Paul28]

Man ace thats comming along nice when are you getting the little guy

[hobogato]

not gonna rush anything, want to make sure everything is cycled to avoid stressing the cuttles when i get them. probably will be at least 6-7 weeks.


Man ace thats comming along nice when are you getting the little guy

[Paul28]

:)

[joelb]

i like that wood frame idea, i think it looks better than rimless. did you use photoshop to make that wall that use to be there invisible? can you do that to my wall also :) ?
good job

[ReefCube]

wow looks great ace!

[sharkboy]

like the deep sand bed idea...certain to help with filtration

[Big_Pun]

hey ace i have some red macro i dont know if it the one your looking for, if it is i have some pieces that broke off you can have, or you can make me a canopy lol, but seriously let me know if this what your looking for

[cbianco]

Hey Ace...Everytime I see the title of this thread on the portal, I read it as "cute lagoon" instead of cuttle lagoon. Are you sending subliminal messages?

Christopher

[hobogato]

thanks richard and joel - took a few days to get that wall out and make it look like there never was one, i wish i could have just used ps

yep art, the sand is the main filtration for the tank...

chris, that is not one of the two specific ones i was taling about, but i would still like to have it. as far as a canopy goes, if you want to pick a day where you can come help, we can put one together. heck, might even turn into another impromptu group lesson gathering :) pm me.

you found me out chris :D

[Squiers007]

Correct me if I am wrong, but dont mangroves usually need to be placed in the sand bed, not in the rocks? I am sure that they will root ok in the rocks, but I was under the impression that many of the nutrients they need they uptake from the sand/soil?

[hobogato]

they will do fine either way, the roots of these will eventually reach all the way down into the sand - should look pretty cool eventually :)

[mabel_photo6]

It's looking sweet!!!

:nailbiting: I can't wait!!!
Cuttlefish!!!! :nailbiting:
I'm super excited to see the outcome!!

Here's a picture I took in Galveston, TX.
Moody Gardens Aquarium... :D
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v628/mabels_corner/Vacation/myspace_MG_8779.jpg

[hobogato]

wow, that is a great pic! i used to have some videos that i took there when i got my first digital camera. i could just stand there and watch em for hours....

[Big_Pun]

let me know what time you are goin to swing by eds so i can get you that macro

[mabel_photo6]

wow, that is a great pic! i used to have some videos that i took there when i got my first digital camera. i could just stand there and watch em for hours....

Ah, why thank you! They're interesting creatures, aren't they?
I didn't want to leave the aquarium they were in.
It was pretty dark so I had to play with my camera to figure out what settings to have it at.
Sometimes, the meter isn't as accurate as you want them to be...

Sorry, photo talk. lol :ph34r:

[hobogato]

i know what you mean, i tried to get pics of the ones at the aquarium in atlanta this summer, but it was entirely too crowded for me to stand there and try to stay still and figure out the best settings. that shouldnt be a problem here in my house with the solar tubes :)

[ErikH]

Ace I have this green macro that grows in a very cool fashion. I have one piece in my natty tank where it has grown off a koralia (a home for my two stripe) that is on the back glass and grown like a bridge all the way to the front of the tank gently curving towards the front. I wrapped some dragons breath around it and now I am waiting for the lights to come on to inspect it's beauty!

Yes, you can have some. :p

[hobogato]

cool, you gonna be home this afternoon?

[ErikH]

we're going to go see cloudy with a chance of meatballs in IMAX 3D at 2:40 and then we will be after that. Call me.

[hobogato]

thanks everyone for all the stuff i picked up today, pics tomorrow :)

[mabel_photo6]

Yay!!! Will be looking forward to the picsssssssss!

[hobogato]

here are some pics, redid the rocks a little as i glued them in place and added the mangroves/macroalgae

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05323.jpg
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05324.jpg
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05325.jpg
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05326.jpg

[hobogato]

decided to add some recessed halogen lights for night time viewing when needed. still have to do some touch up work on the ceiling, but you get the idea :)

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05327.jpg

the light they produce is very yellow, so hopefully i can find a better color bulb somewhere
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05329.jpg

[ballardjr2000]

Looking great

[Mr Cob]

Cool idea on the night lights Ace. Looks very cool. The tank will look awesome when those mangroves take root!

[Paul28]

Man you got skills thats sweet :)

[hobogato]

thanks guys, here it is :)

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05333.jpg

[ballardjr2000]

nice now i just need a beach blanket and a beer

[Paul28]

DANG !!! thats cool

[mabel_photo6]

Wow, I'm amazed. The tank is coming out GREAT!!
Those mangroves look sweet too... and the macro algae. :)

[hobogato]

thanks all, yes it does have a sunset at the beach look to it - twice a day :)

(once for the real sunset and then again with the lights on)

[hobogato]

wow!! just finished cutting up eggcrate covered with zoas, palys, kenya trees, gsp, and shrooms that pete (ping) gave me. some are staying with my tank at home, but about 60+ frags will be going to the school coral prop tank.

here are all of em (minus a few that fell into the tank when i knocked one of the containers over)
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/environmental%20systems/DSC05334.jpg
here are the ones staying in my tank
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05337.jpg

[hobogato]

pics of them in the tank tomorrow when they open up :)

[mabel_photo6]

Please do 'cause they look like wood chips to me. LOL
This really is all exciting. I'm digging how everything is coming out!

[clone]

you never FAIL!!!!
Ace FTW

[hobogato]

here it is today, some of the frags have started opening up. most were fewer than 5 polyps, so it will be a while before they are visible in a fts

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05351.jpg

[mabel_photo6]

Wow, that's amazing.
Looks really good!

[Crazyeyes]

Starting to look really good. So as far as it goes for being natural how will you do water changes?

[hobogato]

once the bioload increases i will do 5 gallon water changes twice a week.

[ReefCube]

where are the cuttlefish?

[NateDogg]

how long are you going to let the tank cycle before adding the cuttlefish?

[hobogato]

total time about 2 months - that means about 6.5 more weeks. i know, it is killing me to wait too, but it is the right way to do it in my opinion.


how long are you going to let the tank cycle before adding the cuttlefish?

[lakers10]

patience is the key lol

[hobogato]

just finished adding in my stuff from the reefcleaners group order, so i thought i would snap a quick pic

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05356.jpg

[lakers10]

nice looking tank bro

[cpreefguy]

Very unique set-up. Looking forward to future updates!

[stoneroller]

What was the "stuff"? Macroalgae? Inverts?

[mabel_photo6]

Wow, it really is looking good!
Can't wait to see the Cuttles :)

[hobogato]

no inverts yet, just macroalgae and mangroves

[devonian]

wow, sounds great, another vote for cant wait to see it in action! I have a few gorgs growing on my tank, let me know when you are ready!

http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc263/donfishy76/for%20sale/IMG_4102.jpg

[hobogato]

thanks devonian, i will take you up on that soon :)

got my LED lights in to replace the halogen bulbs i had in the recessed lights

here are the bulbs
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05383.jpg

here is a comparison shot
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05384.jpg

i will take a pic of the tank in a while when the light is gone from the sky lights.

[mabel_photo6]

Whoa... that looks intense!

[cbianco]

I lol'ed

http://i686.photobucket.com/albums/vv229/biancochris/DSC05356jpeg.jpg

[hobogato]

:rofl:

here it is - not really happy with the lights.
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05389.jpg

they are bright enough, but the light is too spread out - doesnt focus on the tank enough. found some more on ebay that are twice as bright and supposed to be spot lights - we shall see....

[cpreefguy]

Ace, what type of bulbs/base are they?

I ask because I know of a guy offering narrow-optic bulbs with a few different spectrum options.

[hobogato]

these are gu10 bases. these bulbs are 120 lumens. the ones i found that i am thinking of getting are 30 of the same smd LEDs and are supposed to be spot lights. they say 200 lumens. if you have a better source, i would love to know about what his options are....

[Bill S]

Ace, we were talking about these earlier today on a sailing forum. Not sure about the 6500k part, though. Trying to find out when they might be available:

http://www.philipslumileds.com/pdfs/PB66.pdf

[hobogato]

that page says 5600k.... way too yellow. these are the standard cool white which look about like a 10K or 12K SE halide.

[Bill S]

What's funny is that everyone in boating says the LEDs are too blue!

You can go to www.ledsupply.com and build your own. Most of the LEDs have spot lenses available you can put on them.

[cpreefguy]

Hey Ace,
I thought they might be gu10 and remembered reading on another forum about them. Unfortunately what I found was the guy saying that the gu10 base did not offer enough power but he might work on some spotlight bulbs in the future. Sorry, thought I had a solution to offer! Good luck with the new led bulbs.

[hobogato]

sean, i can change the socket to another style as long as it wires to standard 110v two wires. it just has to fit into the recessed fixture and not get too hot.

[devonian]

no problem Ace, let me know whenever

[cpreefguy]

The options get much better with the standard medium e26/e27 base, but won't go along with the recessed fixture...

Are you looking for a bulb with a more concentrated beam? I feel like the 30 led bulb you're talking about will throw light everywhere like the ones installed now.

Superbrightleds has some mr16 base bulbs that may fit, with more narrow optics and a higher kelvin color temp. Look towards the top, some are close to 10k:
http://www.superbrightleds.com/compMR16.htm

[cpreefguy]

I ask because I know of a guy offering narrow-optic bulbs with a few different spectrum options.

This is the individual to whom I was referring:

http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/index.php?s=&showtopic=192645&view=findpost&p=2179996

^^^ That pico bulb may be an option. He has been pumping out some seriously cool LED projects too. I've a product of his coming today :)

[hobogato]

thanks sean. i modified the recessed fixture a little by adding some acrylic lenses that hold the leds inside the fixture more, and they are focused on the tank more. i may just keep what i have or go with the same in a 30 led bulb to make it brighter. they are really only there so we can see in the tank when the sun is not shining - not meant to be supplements to the sunlight.

[hobogato]

well, the new led bulbs came in and they are barely brighter than the others, but they are a little more blue in color.

also, my captive laid cuttle eggs are on the way :D should have an update with pics tomorrow...

[txav8r]

Sweet!!! We will need pics Ace...

[mabel_photo6]

I wanna seeeee :hypnotyized:

[carlinsa]

yeah i want to see some more pics of this thing. still havent seen a cuddle fish

[corruption]

Run a google search on "cuttle fish" -- you'll find a ton of pics and info :D

Here's a wikipedia link for starters:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cuttlefish

-Corruption

[sampsonndelila]

OK I looked at the pics on Google, sweet looking! How big do you expect the ones you ordered to get?

[mabel_photo6]

I'm super excited to see!
Take a picture of the eggs when you got 'em! :D

[hobogato]

i have eggs.... pics coming later :)

[txav8r]

Thats awesome! Can't wait to see them

[hobogato]

ok, here they are :)

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05552.jpg
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05553.jpg

here is one with a light behind it. not the best pic, but you can see the cuttle on the right and the brighter oval yolk sac on the left. they are easy to see in person
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05547.jpg

[Rychek]

That's cool, thanks for sharing! How many are in there? I'm counting 8-10, but it's hard to be certain.

[hobogato]

12 - i counted at least 9 that are viable (could see the baby cuttles in em)

[Rychek]

Do you have some at home and more at school?

[hobogato]

yep - got 22 eggs in all today :)

[blindside]

man, thats crazy, i cant wait to see pics of one out the egg!

[dmweise]

That's awesome! I want to see the eggs too.

[mabel_photo6]

lol it looks like poo
But the creatures with in are amazing! :D

[Europhyllia]

The picture of the embryo (?) is very cool!

[hobogato]

hehe mabel they are black because the mother injects ink into the shells when she lays them. they get more transparent as they get closer to hatching time.

[Europhyllia]

they are black because the mother injects ink into the shells when she lays them.
Why?

[hobogato]

not sure on that one karin - maybe to hide the developing babies since they usually lay the eggs in a dark area like a cave in the rock?

[Mr Cob]

Super duper cool! Do the eggs have to be turned or do you have to do anything so that they develop?

[ErikH]

taggin along. good stuff Ace.

[mabel_photo6]

hehe mabel they are black because the mother injects ink into the shells when she lays them. they get more transparent as they get closer to hatching time.

Well that's cool :D I'm way excited to see these guys hatch.

[corruption]

So am I gonna get to see the cuttle lagoon tomorrow when I get my sump? ;) How do you like those sun tubes? Looked at the pics from when you changed over the old tank to them, it was quite a change... bet the energy savings were grand! :D

-Corruption

[Europhyllia]

So are there any pictures of the parent cuttle fish? Did I miss them? The only thing I can picture in my mind is the cuttle fish bones that I have in my garden for the totroises. Would be interesting to see the animal that goes around the bone!

[hobogato]

no, i dont have adults - i am starting with eggs.

[corruption]

Any updates on the cuttles, Ace? This tank is really gonna be one to watch out for -- even cooler, low-key setup in person! Those mangroves will be a sight to see in a couple years...

BTW, here's that mangrove write-up by Calfo I was telling you about, that describes the intertidal relationship and how to encourage the cool roots:

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-12/ac/feature/index.php

Thanks again for the sump and overflow! :)

-Justin

[hobogato]

no cigar worthy news yet...

[mabel_photo6]

lol awww about how long until they hatch?

[rocketeer]

Very cool, unique venture. Watching, fingers crossed.

Jack

[Paul28]

Wow thay those are sweet cant wait to see them hatched

[hobogato]

well, still no hatches here (six of ten have hatched at the school but the water is much warmer there)

i did decide to replace the k4 with a closed loop to make is safer for the eventual cuttles. i also decided to add a single t5 bulb on the front and the back edge of the tank.

so, friday after work, i drained the tank, moved the sand aside, drilled two holes in the bottom of the tank, plumbed up the pump and put most of the water back in

here it is just after putting the sand back - that unpainted elbow will be replaced with locline
from the end
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05585.jpg
from the front
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05586.jpg
here is the pump underneath
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05587.jpg

took this pic to show how much water the closed loop will be moving - i think the pump is rated around 1000 gph
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05588.jpg

this morning i put the rocks back in and waited for the water to clear up so i could arrange them.


after finish the rockwork this afternoon, i made a couple of low profile acrylic fixtures for the t5 lights.

first i cut groves in the acrylic to make it easier to bend
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05590.jpg
here it is once the fixtures were finished and installed
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05594.jpg
here it is - water is still pretty cloudy and i still have to add a "y" and a couple of nozzles on the locline
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05596.jpg

[kkiel02]

Love that rockwork. Looking good ace

[lakers10]

how did u get those rocks to balance lol

[hobogato]

lots of luck (and superglue :wink_smile:)

[lakers10]

Very nice wish i can do that my luck won't be that good lol

[jeffro]

That's awesome Ace, you have some real talent!

[allan]

Sweet set up there Ace. Can't wait for the CF to hatch.

Any plans for that K4? :)

[corruption]

Fantastic, Ace :) Thanks for taking a few minutes out of your clearly busy day to help me out! The rockwork is really amazing -- thats all balanced with superglue only? No dowels/drilling/tie-straps? Amazing. :)

-Corruption

[cbianco]

Steinhart Aquarium the first to successfully breed dwarf cuttlefish

http://www.reefbuilders.com/2009/11/13/steinhart-aquarium-successfully-breed-dwarf-cuttlefish/#more-12166

[hobogato]

ok, so it turns out a dumb mistake on my part caused the demise of the cuttles in the eggs before they hatched. i poured the salt in onto the sand as i was setting the tank up and mixed it as it filled. for a long time, the salinity was fine. then, whatever salt that had settled into the sand finally dissolved. it drove my sg up to 1.034 over the last few weeks. that is likely why the eggs never hatched.

so.....

instead of ordering more eggs, i am going to wait for captive laid/hatched eggs from my classroom. this should take about 6 months. in the mean time, i decided to add some blue damsels just to provide some movement. i have also added some corals.

here is a fts
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05598.jpg

here are some individual corals - some were added today and have not opened up yet.
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05602.jpg

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05603.jpg

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05604.jpg

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05605.jpg

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05606.jpg

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05608.jpg

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05609.jpg

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05610.jpg

[Bill S]

Been to see Dr. Mark?

[hobogato]

how did you guess?

[Bill S]

That nice circle of orange polyps looked familiar...

[Mr Cob]

Haha...that's funny. Looks nice Ace! Sorry about the eggs.

[aquasport24]

I thought you wanted a Green Star polyp not a Carnation? b/c he saw him bagged it already...LOL

[ErikH]

Looks very niceeeeeeeeee! Are those damsels future food?

[Europhyllia]

Oh I love the colors! You have such great taste!
I really want some Gorgonians/sea fans. Your tank looks wonderful.
Sorry about the cuttles not hatching.

Karin

[Calvert13]

Flamboyent(sp?) is my FAVORITE of all creatures land or sea, I would love to house some .... too bad they'd kill me! haha

[zerreissen]

That looks amazing Ace! I love your rock work!

[allan]

Ace, you're an artist!

[hobogato]

thanks guys, here are some white balance corrected (in camera) actinic shots

fts
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05650.jpg

top down
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05651.jpg

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05653.jpg

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05652.jpg

[ErikH]

Makin' my sweet tooth go nuts right now, look at alllllllll that candyyyy. :bigsmile:

[corruption]

Just gorgeous, Ace. Lovin' it. :)

-Corruption

[Mr Cob]

Man Ace.... it's coming along nicely! Love the colors.

[mabel_photo6]

Awww I'm a little sad :( 6 months is way too long :(

[hobogato]

ok, so if you have ever had a tank without running a skimmer, you will know exactly the problem i am dealing with. all of the proteins in the water tend to rise and concentrate in a scummy layer on the top surface. to solve the problem without adding a skimmer, i came up with this idea.

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05656.jpg

i will put it on the tank once or twice a week for a couple of hours as needed to keep the surface of the water nice and clean. hopefully, as biological filtration gets more efficient in the tank, i wont have to use it as much or at all.

[txav8r]

Simple and clever!

[Mr Cob]

Nice.

Any problem with just running it continually, besides aesthetics?

[hobogato]

no problem, just probably not necessary and yeah - aesthetics :)

[Mr Cob]

Well, it's a cool idea. Pretty much a surface skimmer.

[hobogato]

good idea, bad execution. apparently, the k4 i used was leaking voltage - quite a bit actually. i have removed three dead damsels with burn marks and a few more look like they will not make it. the clam is closed and all of the corals are ticked off. hopefully they will pull thru.

this fish is pretty burned, but is acting normally - sorry for the oof pic. this is a fiji blue damsel - supposed to be solid neon blue
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05657.jpg

it is a good thing i had rubber sole shoes, may have been a long day(or short) otherwise.....

[Europhyllia]

Are you using GFCI outlets? What about a grounding probe?

[hobogato]

no, but it likely wasnt enough stray voltage to kick a gfci.

[Europhyllia]

I always have trouble remembering which one's for which (grounding probe versus GFCI outlets)

[hobogato]

well, i will be installing gfci outlets in a little while.

[hobogato]

hmmm.... this is the same k4 i had on the tank before i drilled it for the closed loop. i wonder if this is what really killed the cuttles in the eggs? live and learn, eh?

[Europhyllia]

poor cuttles!
Glad nothing happened to you though!

[hobogato]

well, here is the new and improved surface cleaner with added carbon media reactor. this time it is powered by a new mj900, so hopefully no more stray voltage

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05659.jpg

have only 7 of the original 17 damsels left, but they all look like they will pull thru. the clam is still iffy tho. most of the corals look like nothing happened as well.

[hobogato]

"feed me seymour!!!"
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05668.jpg

feeding
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05680.jpg

some more random pics (actinic lights only - white balance corrected in camera and saturation decreased on computer to make them look more realistic)
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05669.jpg

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05670.jpg

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05671.jpg

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05672.jpg

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05673.jpg

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05675.jpg

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05676.jpg

[corruption]

Lookin' good! Glad to hear the stray voltage is gone too.. never good to get shocked in water!

-Corruption

[ErikH]

One of the mouths on that elegance looks like it's related to Elvis!

[Paul28]

What kind of PEs are those in that last pic ? those are sweet, tank looks great man !!!

[hobogato]

not sure paul, you would have to ask mrs.z28pwr - i got them from her.

here are a couple of full frontal shots (of the tank! get your mind out of the gutter :) )

actinic - no white balance correction
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05686.jpg

actinic - camera corrected white balance
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05681.jpg

[clone]

that actinic pic is nice.

[Mrs. z28pwr]

They are Goldschlagger Palys. Wow they look really good in your tank.

[txav8r]

Awesome pictures Ace!! I love the Actinic shot

[hobogato]

caught the boys looking at a snail and had to take a pic. white balance was still set for actinic shots so the colors look weird, but i didnt want to miss the candid shot
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05715.jpg

here is one of the clams i picked up from reefs2u last week
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05725.jpg

and one fts - things are pretty happy considering i just treated for redbugs two days ago...
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05717.jpg

lots of little frags that should look pretty good when it grows in

[Europhyllia]

Very, very beautiful! The fts is just amazing!!!

[hobogato]

thanks karin

[Pennies2Cents]

Awww. Thats so cute! :) I love to see the kids look at the tank and they are in total amazement everytime. :)

[txg8gxp]

Awesome tank, the layout looks great. Hope I can have a tank half that nice. Keep up the great work.

[cbianco]

It's nice to see that you couldn't stay away. Nice "cuttle lagoon"...ahem...reef tank. :)

Christopher


http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05717.jpg

[Mr Cob]

Man...it looks so nice Ace. Very realistic and natural looking. Great work.

[Texreefer]

Looks Great Ace.. Makin me think.......

[d3rryc]

So when might the cuttle lagoon make another run at hosting cuttles?

[hobogato]

well d3rryc, i am down to one surviving cuttle in my classroom, so it doesnt look like i will be getting any from that breeding program any time soon. i am thinking of ordering some hatchlings if they are available, and if i order more for the classroom, i will order a few for myself as well.

[d3rryc]

What's been the main cause of mortality among the classroom cuttles?

[hobogato]

they hatched very small and many of them refused to eat even live mysid shrimp. the one that is left is now eating ghost shrimp, so it is past a major hurdle.

[Jordan N.]

Just read through this entire thread, I'm sorry that the cuttles didn't make it but the tank looks pretty awesome as it sits right now. Kind of cool to actually see some damsels in the tank.

Also I really respect the commitment to buying only tank bred livestock; the dichotomy between the fact that fishkeepers love the reefs but that very love is slowly dismantling them has always bothered me. Where are you getting your livestock? Your classroom? If it was feasible I might think about going down this road with the 37 I just set up.

*Edit* Are there any species of blennies that are commonly tank bred? Wrasses?
~Jordan

[hobogato]

i have to admit, i have slipped on that idea with a few corals, but most came from other reefers tanks - home grown frags :)

[hobogato]

got a new HD video camera and here is the first tank video. you can see the 1.5" wave that the wavebox is producing, and it is only turned up about half way.

3_yXwNagJl4

[Big_Pun]

its amazing how fast this tank has come along, last time i saw it there was no water in it, lol

[joelb]

nice!, can the wave box be set to do 1 wave every say 6 seconds?

[Europhyllia]

wow. Didn't know such a thing existed. That's pretty awesome!

[hobogato]

the time of the wave must be set to match the size of the tank - the longer the tank, the longer the time between waves.

[Europhyllia]

the time of the wave must be set to match the size of the tank - the longer the tank, the longer the time between waves.

I am guessing the wave replaces any need for powerheads?

[hobogato]

well, i have the closed loop, but there were some stagnant areas. with the wave box, those no longer exist.

[justahobby]

I understand why you want the macro, but

Won't the macro become problematic as it climbs up the LR to your corals? I'm under the impression that one can only remove so much while pieces of macro inevitably climb higher without regard for corals. Seems like a nightmare of pruney hands.

Have you anticipated any aggression problems arising from the damsels after placement of the cuttle fish?

[hobogato]

you are right justin, the macro will take constant attention, but that will be the only way to export nutrients. i have moved most of it to the back of the rockwork to keep it somewhat isolated from the majority of the corals.

as far as aggression, i will attempt to remove the damsels with a fish trap when it is time, but the ones that are stubborn will end up as food for the cuttles as i wont release cuttles into the tank until they are large enough to take care of the damsels. i actually looked into ordering some hatchlings today, but it doesnt look like any will be available until after the beginning of the year.

[justahobby]

Sounds good, the large polyp gorgonia is suh weet.

[joelb]

So that wave box could help with the surface skimming and the slimy buildup? no more diy electric chairs :) or reactors?

[hobogato]

yeah justin, that thing has been healthy since the day i brought it home from aquarium masters. it has grown about 1/2" in a little over a month

:lauging: joel.....

it has actually kept the surface clean (a side effect i was not expecting). i will still put the carbon reactor on the tank once in a while just to polish the water a bit. i think (like my 240 did) the water will get a green tint over time with all that macro algae and no skimmer. running carbon occasionally will clear it up

[Mr Cob]

Sweet video Ace. Man HD really make s a difference. So clear. Looks like you didn't lose a whole bunch with uploading to u-tube.

The wave box looks great on that tank!

[hobogato]

thanks rob - i think the video is ok for a first attempt, but i have some learnin to do....

i am happy with the wavebox. at first i was thinking of an mp40 or nano wave box, but i am glad i went with the full size wavebox.

[hobogato]

i did have to redo the top molding so it would hide the water level - very distracting to se that from the front of the tank

[ErikH]

YES! Finally someone else got an HD video cam and IS POSTING! :D

First off, great looking tank Ace!
Second, that is the best song with that crazy wave action. Matches perfectly. Makes me wanna drink a redbull and dance!

[hobogato]

YES! Finally someone else got an HD video cam and IS POSTING! :D

First off, great looking tank Ace!
Second, that is the best song with that crazy wave action. Matches perfectly. Makes me wanna drink a redbull and dance!

:D i thought it matched pretty well also.

[Bill S]

Makes me wanna drink a redbull and dance!

Oh, no. The world can't stand ANOTHER video of Erik dancing - and this time in HD...

[Mr Cob]

Makes me wanna drink a redbull and dance!

Just make sure you have some stars on the ground for guidelines!:rofl:

[hobogato]

i realized that i had the period of the wave set too short - actually had two waves going. i got it reset to the correct frequency and here is a new video to with the correct wave action

Fn_lBheroZo

[jpond83]

where would you get a tank those dimensions?

[Europhyllia]

Nice. I like it better how you have it now. When I watched the first video it was cool but I was actually thinking how I would rather have a slower longer wave than the shock-shock waves. I figured it was due to tank size.
Beautiful swaying motion now!

[hobogato]

you might be able to special order it thru one of the local shops, i know gabe's, ad, and reefs2u do that sometimes.

you could go thru glasscages.com - it almost the same as the 150 tall they have listed

[Jordan N.]

I loved seeing the tank earlier today, as good as the pictures look it's even better in person. Really different than a lot of what you see out there.

-Jordan N.

[allan]

Awesome Ace. Makes me really miss my wavemaker. Once you go wave you never go... uh, back to no wave?

[Mr Cob]

Ace, just watched the last vid posted! Awesome man, the music is so perfect! The duncans at the end look like the composer!!! Love it! The entire tank is so natural looking.

[hobogato]

just made an order (thanks for the heads up karin)..... more details when i get shipping confirmation :wink_smile:

[corruption]

....and the air suddenly crackled with the potent electricity of anticipation... :D

-Justin

[Europhyllia]

:D I am excited and it's not even my tank! Can't wait to see pics.

[hobogato]

made this today in preparation. have not received shipping notice yet, so i they may not come in until next week :(

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/PDRM3844.jpg

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/PDRM3845.jpg

[Jordan N.]

Looks like a nice temporary cuttlefish home. Have you started removing the damsels yet? how did that go?

-Jordan N.

[ErikH]

I think he means on using the damsels as eventual food.

Looks like Ace is readyyyyy to rumbleeeee.

I sincerely hope you raise them and breed them. I know your last ones were very shy, but they are just such amazing creatures. Tab may let me keep the 75 to use as a "cuttle crib" and CB babies would be awesome.

[hobogato]

took a quick fts while taking frag pics tonight
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05900.jpg

[Jordan N.]

Ooh, looks like the other white and red branch (Can't remember the name) opened up since I was there. Looking really good! I love all your filter feeders.

-Jordan N.

[Third Coast Tropical]

Nice FTS

[joelb]

that tank sure did fill up quickly! looks great!

[mabel_photo6]

I've been looking forward for this moment. :nailbiting:
I can't wait to see them cuttlefish!

[hobogato]

man, it is a good thing we are all patient! they did not get shipped today, but should be shipped tomorrow for arrival on friday:nailbiting:

here are a couple of pics to hold you guys over...

that spiny oyster from gabe's - very unusual critter
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05958.jpg

feather star
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c329/hobogato/cuttle%20lagoon/DSC05959.jpg

was not planning on getting another one of these even tho the one i had in the 240 did very well and this is a very similar type of tank. however, a local shop got this one in and i couldn't leave it in the store knowing it probably would not survive without very specialized care. so far so good...

disclaimer - before you think "cool i want one" do lots of research. they are generally considered to be very poor candidates for home aquaria and typically do not last more than a couple of months as they molt arms faster than they can replace them due to starvation in the typical tank. even though i think my tank gives this creature a chance because of the way it is setup and fed, i would not have intentionally sought to acquire one. i only reason i have this one because i could not bear to think of it starving to death in a tank whose owner didnt know what its requirements are.