Brightwell Modified NeoZeo

[recoiljpr]

After the thread by cpreefguy I thought I'd start one on Brightwell. I've seen the awesome results of Zevoit, and brightwell has some pretty good results as well. I figured i'd do Brightwell as it's a little more cost effective, and a LFS carries most of their products. I'll use this thread as my experiences with the product. Just a note though, I will NOT be following the full system, as I will not be using the stones and some other dosing.

I will be taking closeups of some of my coral (most are frags) to get coloration views and growth rates with it. I will use the same camera, same white balance, ambient light, etc as I can for the pictures.

The corals (most are frags) I will be taking the photographs for will be -


30,000 leauge lokani
Pink birdsnest
Ora Birds Of Paradise
Green Damicronis
Paletta Lovelii
Purple Digitata
Frogspawn/Mixed Zoa colony (I know, not sps, but hey why not)


After the 2 week MB7 startup (starting 8-31-09), I will start also dosing their biofuel (basically a replacement for Vodka). I have not decided if I will be adding any amino's, etc. With as heavy as a I already feed and supplement, i'm not sure I want that in my system yet.

[Mr Cob]

Cool. Following along. Thanks for sharing.

[clone]

i have used this method before and plan on it again.
I also started with MB7 and BioF.
I was feeding amino in the morning before i would leave to work(lights were still off)and i would also dose MB7.
So my skimmer would be off for 8 hours.
This stuff is OUTSTANDING.
PE will double and colors will pop alot more.
i was alos useing Koralcolor and replinish after awhile.

just ask rob how colorful my eflo and redplanet were.

[txav8r]

Tagging along. This is going to be interesting!

[recoiljpr]

As promised, here are my first results and pictures. I started dosing approximately a week ago. All pictures are taken with reeflux 10k (2 175W) with no actinic supplementation. I figure if this can give me good colors without actinic and with 10k bulbs, that would be a good feat!

NH4 (amm) - 0
NO2 (Nitrite) - 0
NO3 (Nitrate) - 10
P04 (Phos) - .1
Ca - 380
dKH - 11.2
PH - 8.4
Salinity - 1.025

I notice my polyps on the bird of paradise, A floridia and the yellow unknown are extending quite nicely. I have no visual signs of algae in the main tank, but honestly my fuge is full of it. I have noticed my coralife skimmer has overflowed every day, hours after dosing. I turn off the skimmer for (I dose at 6:00 pm) 4 hours and I place the bubble level where normal. In the morning, everything is running fine when I get back from work, for the past few days it has overflowed. Luckily, my sump is placed in a larger container just for that kind of issue. I'm going to leave my bubble levels even lower to see if I have the same issue. I do notice white tips on almost all of my coral, so i'm hoping it's from growth and not tip burn from my semi-high dKH. I will not dose two-part for a day to see if my alk lowers (I dose brightwell reef code A&B for cal & alk).

[recoiljpr]

Second set of pictures. I named the pictures what I believe the corals are named, if I have any mis-identified feel free to let me know. The second pic is one of the worst part of my fuge.

[recoiljpr]

Third set

[recoiljpr]

Just an update (Pics to come next Tuesday).

My levels are all staying where they were on Tuesday, no changes up/down on any. I am noticing a buildup of tan crud on my glass I am having to clean almost daily.
I am also starting to notice the HA that I have in my sump has a brown tint to it, but i'm not sure if it's from the same stuff that is on my glass, or if it's starting to die.The brown film is not apparent on my rocks or sand (But I do have 2 huge turbos for the rocks, and a diamond goby for the sand). In my overflow, I am noticing brown stringy strands of something on the glass and acrylic.

I had to dial my skimmer WAAYY back because it kept overflowing hours and hours after each treatment. I'm not getting a heck of a lot of skimmate, but since I had to dial it back I won't contribute it to the product.

All of my coral and livestock seem to be doing just fine, and no huge color changes yet.

[clone]

so today a salesman from Bigthwell came by the store today.
he's going to email me some instructions on how the owner of BW ended up making this system.
so i will be making copys to pass out if anyones intrested.
he says that it teaches you how to use it and why its good for your aquariums health.
its like a 10 page report so im not going to type it all up.

[CoryDude]

Sounds like you may be experiencing some of the "slime" that I've read about on RC. Please keep us informed if this dissapates over time. The long term price of the additives and this sludge have kept me from jumping ship and trying this.

[recoiljpr]

so today a salesman from Bigthwell came by the store today.
he's going to email me some instructions on how the owner of BW ended up making this system.
so i will be making copys to pass out if anyones intrested.
he says that it teaches you how to use it and why its good for your aquariums health.
its like a 10 page report so im not going to type it all up.

Is this the report he gave you? http://www.aquabuys.com/neozeo-method.pdf

If not, let me know when you make some copies and i'd like to stop by and get one. I can then scan it in to PDF and post it up here for everyone.

[clone]

im not to sure yet i havent checked the mail.
i will know when i get to the shop today and let you know.

[recoiljpr]

Okay, here is the weekly update. I was not able to test Phosphate last night as one of my helpers decided to clean out my reagents to keep everything clean. :Timeout:

I am picking up a new test today.

NH4 (amm) - 0
NO2 (Nitrite) - 0
NO3 (Nitrate) - 10
P04 (Phos) - ?
Ca - 400
dKH - 10.8
PH - 8.3
Salinity - 1.025

What I've seen so far is explosive growth on my Pink Birds Nest. It looks like a teenager with pimples, new growth is breaking out everywhere. All of the other corals are looking good, but growing by what I would consider normal (pics later tonight).

I'm also still fighting the brown film on my glass and in my overflow. I'm having to clean the glass every other day. It's different from diatoms in that it doesn't look "dusty". When I clean it off it comes off in slimy sheets. Through reading posts, this seems to be fairly normal when starting out this product (it's the bacteria). I'm not having the same issue on my sand, but that may be due to Max (my diamond goby).

I am noticing in my fuge the HA seems to be thinning out a bit. I'm also noticing my chaeto instead of being in a ball is spreading out and is not as tight as it's been. I still see no patches of HA in my display.

I also thought i'd outline my feeding regimine to give an idea of how I feed. Since I feed what I consider heavily for my stocking level. If this product helps to keep my nutrients in control, it will say a lot for the product. (I have 2 medium clowns, 2 small chromis, 1 medium diamond goby)

Feedings-
Daily - New life sprectrum pellets (approximately 1 tsp)
Every day I alternate 1 cube of - Cyclops, mysis shrimp
2X per week - I alternate both Kent Phytoplex and DT's
2X per week - 1 silverside with toothpicks in sand
2X per week - live brine (selco enriched) about 1 1/2 TBSP

[recoiljpr]

Here is a full tank shot showing the brown stringy film i'm talking about and the growth from the birdsnest over the past week.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/recoiljpr/DSCF0218.jpg

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/recoiljpr/DSCF0250.jpg

[recoiljpr]

I picked up my new phosphate test kit so I was able to get a test on the phosphate. This is the first week I have seen my nitrate and phosphates go down. I have not changed my feedings, nor my water change routine. I have noticed a small reduction in the amount of skimmate, but it's darker and smellier. It is taking me about 2 weeks to fill the cup of my Coralife 65 skimmer. I'm also still messing with my alk/ca dosing to get it exactly where I want it.

NH4 (amm) - 0
NO2 (Nitrite) - 0
NO3 (Nitrate) - 5
P04 (Phos) - .03
Ca - 410
dKH - 9.6
PH - 8.3
Salinity - 1.025

I am starting to notice the brown film on the glass is starting to lessen a bit. Instead of having to scrub every day, I'm down to every two days. Now where I do miss it by the rocks, it does get long. I do really wish I knew what that stuff really is.

My birdsnest is really taking off, and my isolated patch of xenia is also growing really well. I've noticed my Lokani frag is starting to get a more intense blue color to it and my A. floridia is starting to get a lime green color. I'm also noticing some growth starting on my digi, but no color as of yet. Finally, I am also seeing growth on my damicronis.

To note, while I did recently add actinics, I am taking note of these colors when I turn the actinics off.

This is the first week I start dosing the Reef Biofuel (their version of Vodka) to add as a carbon source for the bacteria. I am also reducing the dosing of the microbacter to every 2 days and I will be keeping my skimmer on instead of turning it off.

I'll post pictures tonight when I get home.

[clone]

cool cant waitto see ssome pic's.
im going to be starting MB7 tonight and dripping kalk on the new tank

[recoiljpr]

Here is the update for the week.

NH4 (amm) - 0
NO2 (Nitrite) - 0
NO3 (Nitrate) - 5
P04 (Phos) - .03
Ca - 420
dKH - 9.6
PH - 8.2
Salinity - 1.025

I'm noticing that brown stringy stuff is starting to go away from the back glass. I'm not entirely sure if it's from the dosing or from me lowering the temperature in the tank earlier in the week. My tanks temp was a little higher then I liked for a while. After a great suggestion by Kevin, I put a Walmart fan up in my canopy, and that dropped me down 2 degrees so now I hover between 80.3 and 79.8.

As far as dosing I am now dosing 5ML of MB7 daily, and 5 ML of Reef Biofuel daily. Every other day I am adding 10 ML of Brightwells 2 part. Once a week, I add 1 drop of lugols.

I am noticing a few spots (3 about the size of a quarter) of algae on the rocks. I am going to manually remove it tomorrow. The chaeto in my sump is still growing and doing well. I am not seeing it dying like some others have seen using brightwell. I have noticed though almost all of the HA is gone from my sump.

[recoiljpr]

I also purchased a new Acro today that I think will make a great test to see if the MB7 can really help color up a coral. As you can see, it's fairly colorless. It's tinted brown now because of the lugols dip I did to it before placing it in the tank. Otherwise, there is a very light blue tint to the tips, and a light, light green tint to the base.

[ballardjr2000]

so what do you think got rid of the brown stringy stuff cause i have it like crazy and been fighting it, with no luck. any suggestion would help me flow/less lighting/i only feed once a day. my additives are coralvite by kent, and essential elements, by kent haven't added these in a week.

[recoiljpr]

so what do you think got rid of the brown stringy stuff cause i have it like crazy and been fighting it, with no luck. any suggestion would help me flow/less lighting/i only feed once a day. my additives are coralvite by kent, and essential elements, by kent haven't added these in a week.

I think it was a combination of a few things I think that are helping me get rid of it, not just one thing.

1. I replaced one of my Koralia 3 with a Koralia 4. So total flow in my 65 is now a Mag 5 return, K3 & K4. I also move the direction of the powerheads every other day. I want to ensure that all areas of my tank get flow. It really helps get rid of any detrius caught in the rocks and then suspends it letting the corals and other animals feed, and the skimmer get rid of the rest.

2. I lowered my temp's in my tank about 2 degrees. My high was running around 82.9. Now, my highs average around 79.8. All I did was add a walmart fan to the canopy.

3. I started dosing the reef biofuel (Brightwells version of Vodka).

I feed on average 3 times a day and I feed fairly heavily. I have not changed my feeding.

[ballardjr2000]

Sweet k, now i need to figure out how to sqeeze more fans in my canopy, the 2 i have move 65cfm, so i will try to add some more. I got a couple of aqua clear 50's i might throw in the tank. I am currently running a k4 and k1 with a mar 9.5 return so with the 50's i should get enough flow.

[clone]

so since I got the new tank running ive had a thin layer of hair algae pertty much all over the place.

so as of tonight ive strated-
dosing kalk + -brightwell
MB7
I also put half carbon and half phosban in a phos reactor.


no coral yet, but as soon as i get this algae gone or under control i'll start adding stuff again.
but for now i'll dose MB7 for two weeks and start on BF.

OH also if no one takes the NEOZEO that we got in at the shop i'll end up taking it,and starting with that in two weeks as well.

[recoiljpr]

Sweet k, now i need to figure out how to sqeeze more fans in my canopy, the 2 i have move 65cfm, so i will try to add some more. I got a couple of aqua clear 50's i might throw in the tank. I am currently running a k4 and k1 with a mar 9.5 return so with the 50's i should get enough flow.

And as an additional note ballard. I am also running both Carbon and GFO in reactors. I've run those though for a while even when I had the major issues with the brown stringy stuff. A few days before then stringy stuff started lessining I did replace my GFO. I doubt (but can't prove) that did anything to help.

[recoiljpr]

Well folks, here is my weekly report.

All of my levels have stayed the same, no change from last week. I'm still noticing decent growth on the corals and I will post some side by side comparison pictures tomorrow to look at. I haven't noticed any "wow" colors coming out on them yet.

Last night though I couldn't sleep so I went down with my red-light led light and looked at my tank. I haven't been night looking since I started the microbacter. I can tell you one thing, my rocks are probably about 40% covered in pods, scuds and other zooplankton. Switching the light from red to white caused mass exodus for cover. I've always had a decent number but since starting the microbacter the population has exploded. It does make sense though, since a major part of pods diet is bacteria. Basically, i'm dosing food for them everyday in a way. I also think that's why coral does real well with the zevoit/neozeo methods. You are heavily dosing and innoculating your system with bacteria constantly. Seeing that your filter feeders, pods and even SPS can and do eat bacteria, it makes sense to me. I've also noticed about 20 new small tube worms forming underneath my rocks.

Most people dose phyto, but the whole bacteria dosing is kind of a new phenomenon. I do wonder how much of the results you get are from the bacteria itself processing nutrients, and how much is because the micro/filter feeding life can populate heavily because of the new amounts of food available via the bacteria?

[recoiljpr]

Here are some comparison pics of the coral through the past month. The pics with the name BOM are Beginning of last month. The pics with the name EOM are from last week.

I was wrong about the WOW color changes, as I have grown accustomed to their colors. But, looking at my beginning colors and size till now, it's blindingly evident.

First up is A. Floridia.

[recoiljpr]

Next up is the Green BN. Not only has this guy colored up well, his growth has exploded over just such a short time frame. It doesn't look as green anymore, as the aqua color is really showing up well now. I think that's because the polyps are really opening up on it now.

[recoiljpr]

Last up is the coral I have been calling Palletta Blue (If I am wrong, let me know folks)!! This one has really colored up well. It's also put on fairly good growth.

[recoiljpr]

NH4 (amm) - 0
NO2 (Nitrite) - 0
NO3 (Nitrate) - 5
P04 (Phos) - .03
Ca - 380
dKH - 9.2
PH - 8.4 (Re-calibrated using 7 & 10 solution)
Salinity - 1.024

The tank is doing great, and it was good to know I didn't have a ph problem, just a mis-calibrated probe! I'm noticing coraline coming in very well on the back glass and the rocks. All of the dots you see on the back glass is Coraline. I've also noticed the koralia 4 I placed in the tank about a month and a half ago is starting to get covered in it. The coral continue to color up nicely and grow. I'm having an issue getting a good shot of the pink birdsnest coral (user error). As soon as I figure out how to get a good shot, i'll post it.

I still notice only one dime size patch of HA on one rock, no HA anywhere else. That patch has not spread and is stating to get a clearish color. My chaeto is still growing well in my fuge, I am not noticing it dying off as others have with MB7.

My sand is still very white, but I count that more to my goby then anything else. I haven't had any problems with cyano as of yet. I'm still dosing 5 ML of MB7 and 5 ML of biofuel daily after my halides turn off for the night.

Other then the colors on the corals, I am noticing all of them are extending their polyps nicely both during the day cycle and night cylce. A piece I purchased a few weeks ago that was very light is starting to get blue tips on the piece.

[recoiljpr]

Additional pictures

[clone]

nice PE on all the corals Jason.
im right behind you still doseing 25ml a night,but starting tomarrow ill cut back to 15ml a night.
why 15ml, thats just the way i did it on my last tank.
also ill be calling for the AA's tuesday,so hopefully we'll get it in this week.

[danielcherian]

I started dosing MB7 w/ BF a few weeks ago and have noticed a huge increase in PE. Great stuff.

One thing though-- I've heard that you should not use GFO alongside the MB7 + carbon source since the GFO simply competes against the bacteria in removing the phosphates. As a result, you should stick to one or the other-- Bacteria + Carbon source OR GFO.

[stoneroller]

Just ordered the biofuel today. Going to see if it will amp up coral health on its own. Seems to me there should be plenty of bacteria already in the system.

[recoiljpr]

I started dosing MB7 w/ BF a few weeks ago and have noticed a huge increase in PE. Great stuff.

One thing though-- I've heard that you should not use GFO alongside the MB7 + carbon source since the GFO simply competes against the bacteria in removing the phosphates. As a result, you should stick to one or the other-- Bacteria + Carbon source OR GFO.

I've read that as well Daniel. But, I never have gotten rid of my GFO. I've run it in the same reactor the whole process. I figure that anything the bacteria doesn't get is taken by the GFO. I feel i'm getting good results, but you could be right and I could be getting even better without the GFO. But, that being said right now at least I feel better running the GFO.

[recoiljpr]

Just ordered the biofuel today. Going to see if it will amp up coral health on its own. Seems to me there should be plenty of bacteria already in the system.

It may work, considering the biofuel is basically the same thing as vodka dosing, just a bit modified. I like the Microbacter personally because at least with that I know i'm constantly refreshing the colony and adding any additional bacteria that may have been lost by other means.

But, I don't know for certain that it really IS doing that. I'm stricly now going by observed results that are by no means scientific.

[CoryDude]

I've joined the band wagon and started dosing MB7 about 2 weeks ago.

Here's my question. If you achieve a desired low nutrient level in your tank, and you start dosing Brightwell's other additives for corals, aren't you just paying to put something back into the tank that the MB7 and Biofuel helped take out?

[clone]

any updates Jason?
I do, but I have no proof of the changes. Ive noticed a bigger polyp extenion almost on a daily basis. My colors are starting to come around on my acros, and coulndnt be happier with the colors on my chalices.
Do you remember that one acro that I showed you was going to be my tester.
well it has started to get a greenish tint to it and the blue tips are starting to be more defined. My red planet is still real green and the polyps are still blood red, but for some reason I cant get the polyps to extend as well as the other acros ive got in there.
Crazyeyes came in and hooked me up with a birdnest and some real cool looking green acro, so now I have more to experament with.

[clone]

I've joined the band wagon and started dosing MB7 about 2 weeks ago.

Here's my question. If you achieve a desired low nutrient level in your tank, and you start dosing Brightwell's other additives for corals, aren't you just paying to put something back into the tank that the MB7 and Biofuel helped take out?

Yes in a sence but when they are taking them out, they arent just taking out the bad ones, it's taking out good and bad, so then you would have to replace the good ones back into the system.

[CoryDude]

Guess you have that problem whether you go with just skimming and liverock, or add a bacteria driven system like this. You're pulling out good and bad either way. At least you have a choice what's being added back to the tank.

[clone]

Guess you have that problem whether you go with just skimming and liverock, or add a bacteria driven system like this. You're pulling out good and bad either way. At least you have a choice what's being added back to the tank.

yes siR.
Thats the beauty of this method, it goes futher that any other line out there.

[txav8r]

I started dosing MB7 w/ BF a few weeks ago and have noticed a huge increase in PE. Great stuff.

One thing though-- I've heard that you should not use GFO alongside the MB7 + carbon source since the GFO simply competes against the bacteria in removing the phosphates. As a result, you should stick to one or the other-- Bacteria + Carbon source OR GFO.


Wow! Awesome first post from a member who joined in 2005!

[Crazyeyes]

Well it's pulling good and bad out, but it it maintaining the levels which in return keeps consistency which is key in this hobby. As far as this additive, it does is give us an low nutrience for hard corals, but don't add the mb7 while the skimmer is on. With more bacteria they help break down ammonia and complete the nitrogen cycle in the fish tank.

[recoiljpr]

NH4 (amm) - 0
NO2 (Nitrite) - 0
NO3 (Nitrate) - 5
P04 (Phos) - .03
Ca - 400
dKH - 9.1
PH - 8.5
Salinity - 1.026

I don't have any pics on my pc here at work, but I'll post some later tonight. All of my corals and other life are doing really well, no issues so far. I'm noticing excellent coralline grown in the tank for it being such a young tank. My pumps are about 40% covered with the stuff, and all of my rock is getting a good dusting of the stuff. I'm learning to have a love/hate relationship with it as I love it on my rocks, I hate it on the glass.

I recently added a MP40 to the tank and for a few days my corals were in a kind of state of "shock". They all pulled in their polyps and didn't really extend. But, starting Sunday or so they are now used to the current change and are back to extending their polyps.

I'm still dosing 5ml of MB7 and 5ml of the biofuel. I still have not started adding any other additives besides my 2 part.

My chaeto is still growing well, so I have not noticed the macro die off like others have noticed using this system. I think it's because I do feed a heck of a lot, so I still have enough nutrients to allow it to grow. I have not had any problem with cyano at all and any spots of HA I've seen have been smaller then quarter size. My fish and cuc usually get rid of it within a few days.

My wife wants me to get rid of the Neomeris annulata (Caterpillar weed)http://farm1.static.flickr.com/130/360159233_680d6cf053.jpg?v=1169005651. It's growing very well in my system and my wife hates the way it looks. This isn't a typical nuisance alage but it is an algae (calcareous algae like halimeda). So in a way, I wonder if this is a sign I need to up my dosage of MB7 and biofuel? The chaeto & other macro alages are still growing well points to the fact I still have plenty of nutrients in my tank. What do yall think?

[DSAfanatic]

I too am running the Brightwells system. I use BF, MB7, Koral Color and aminos. I have a 90g and I dose 10ml BF, 20ml MB7, 1ml amino, and 20 drops of Koral Color each day. I didn't notice better colors until I started dosing the Koral and aminos.

Your chaeto is taking in nutrients all the time which is why it is still alive. The biofuel bonds to the nitrates and phosphates making them heavier which makes it be able to be skimmed out with a good skimmer. The chaeto isn't getting food for 3-5 hours after dosing the BF or until it gets skimmed out.

The biofuel is attaching itself to everything and will starve other bacterias. That is why the MB7 is good because it keeps from having a mono bacteria system.

What size tank do you have?

[recoiljpr]

I have a 65 gallon tank DSAfanatic.