D**n it! *NOW WITH VIDEO*

[labrown]

Just had an arrow crab die on me shortly after acclimation. I've got so many bristle worms and want something to keep them under control. This is the 3rd arrow I've tried to put in my tank, and each one has died less than a day after I got them. I've tried different acclimation techniques, drip, float while adding water slowly, etc, and I can't seem to keep them alive. Frustrating, I just gave my nassarius snails a fifteen dollar snack. Just sharing my disgruntled attitude...

[Morena_Model]

What are your water parameters?

[longhorn_20m]

Sorry about the crab, but for the bristle worm problem, have you tried a longnose hawkfish? Since I've added one to my tank, I've seen zero of them.

[R.Allard]

have you treated the tank for anything ? check your parameters.also whats your water temp??

[aggman]

i noticed everyone is basically asking what is wrong with your tank...but, maybe it is the livestock your acquiring. i mean, if everything else in your tank is still alive and maybe even thriving, and you have tried multiple time with multiple techniques for acclimation. maybe its the crabs. have you acquired them from the same lfs each time. not saying they are selling you crap livestock...but, you know, they might. in my early days i just dropped the bag in the tank, waited ten minutes, then plop in she went. and i still have that same one. of course, now that i have learned so much with the hobby, i drip and quarantine. so maybe try picking one up at a diff. lfs. its worth a shot. jmho.

~alex

[labrown]

Parameters:
ammonia, nitrate/ite, phosphate all 0
pH 8.4
calcium 380
kH 7 dKH
salinity 1.025
temp 77

Everything else is doing fine, even the two peppermint shrimp that I got at the same time. I know my calcium and kH are low, and I intend to use a buffer here in the next week or so.

I got my first arrow crab from petco, second from MAAST member blindside, and third from Aquatek. It is hard to tell if they are healthy or not when I get them. It is hard to tell when they're dead. The one I got today was alive and kicking when I was acclimating him, and then once he reached the bottom of the tank, it was over.

I used to have a longnose hawkfish, and really liked him. We got rid of him when we moved on to predator fish, and now that we are peacefully reefkeeping, I'd like another one. I posted a WTB thread looking for one. I don't often see them in the LFS. I was at RCA this week and at the Aquadome and Aquatek, and didn't see one.

Thanks everyone for your replies. I don't really expect to find an answer, and I don't intend to try to get another one unless I can find a member that has a healthy one and a healthy tank.

[Grindhouse Tattoos]

sometimes arrow crabs will pick at corals. try a wrasse of some sort instead.

[labrown]

sometimes arrow crabs will pick at corals. try a wrasse of some sort instead.

Good to know.

I don't think I'll get a wrasse. I have a mandarin that is my #1 priority in my tank. He is fat and happy, and I want to keep him that way. A longnose hawk doesn't stay as close to the bottom as wrasses, and are pretty peaceful. I don't want ANYTHING that will possibly cause my mandarin to have to defend his territory.

[stoneroller]

I would think the diet of a longnose hawk would significantly overlap with your mandarin's.

[labrown]

I would think the diet of a longnose hawk would significantly overlap with your mandarin's.

good point. when we had the hawk it ate the cubed food we put in. If it ate bristle worms it would never run out of food. And our pod population is through the roof. Our tank used to look like it had fleas. I can watch the pods swim around in all the dark areas of the tank still. We also have a pretty big pod population in our refugium. I have seen our mandarin eat the frozen cube food as well.

With that in mind, do you still think it would be a bad idea? Seriously, when we feed our tank, our substrate looks like night of the living worm infestation. They are out all the time because there are no natural predators for them. Our tank is at least 5 years old, maybe even older.

[aggman]

Parameters:
ammonia, nitrate/ite, phosphate all 0
pH 8.4
calcium 380
kH 7 dKH
salinity 1.025
temp 77

Everything else is doing fine, even the two peppermint shrimp that I got at the same time. I know my calcium and kH are low, and I intend to use a buffer here in the next week or so.

I got my first arrow crab from petco, second from MAAST member blindside, and third from Aquatek. It is hard to tell if they are healthy or not when I get them. It is hard to tell when they're dead. The one I got today was alive and kicking when I was acclimating him, and then once he reached the bottom of the tank, it was over.

I used to have a longnose hawkfish, and really liked him. We got rid of him when we moved on to predator fish, and now that we are peacefully reefkeeping, I'd like another one. I posted a WTB thread looking for one. I don't often see them in the LFS. I was at RCA this week and at the Aquadome and Aquatek, and didn't see one.

Thanks everyone for your replies. I don't really expect to find an answer, and I don't intend to try to get another one unless I can find a member that has a healthy one and a healthy tank.

well, that just threw my theory out the window. i was trying to say it wasn't you...you know, being positive and whatnot.:bigsmile:

so now i am changing my position...it's all you dude!!!:lauging:

nah, j/k. well, i don't know what it might be. i do hope you figure something out before you run into any problems. do you think a juvi wrasse from live aquaria might bother your dragonet too much?

~alex

[ErikH]

I bought a venatus wrasse, and no more fireworms! Most bristles are harmless and are detritovores. FYI your CA and Alk are low, not really a prob for fish and whatnot, but not good for corals.

[labrown]

nah, j/k. well, i don't know what it might be. i do hope you figure something out before you run into any problems. do you think a juvi wrasse from live aquaria might bother your dragonet too much?

~alex

I don't really know. The only wrasse I've ever had was a dragon wrasse and he didn't last long against my BJtrigger and SFeel.


I bought a venatus wrasse, and no more fireworms! Most bristles are harmless and are detritovores. FYI your CA and Alk are low, not really a prob for fish and whatnot, but not good for corals.

Yeah, I know the Ca and KH are low, I've been lazy and just adding top off water instead of changing out some of the salt water. Can't decide whether I'll do a water change or dose some B-Ionic. I have mostly softies, just a few LPS, so I'm not in a rush.

I know the bristleworms are good for my tank. But seriously, maybe I should take some video today. My substrate comes alive when I feed.

[aggman]

I know the bristleworms are good for my tank. But seriously, maybe I should take some video today. My substrate comes alive when I feed.

yeah definitely, that would be cool to see.

~alex

[CynthiaM]

I read somewhere that the coral banded shrimp will eat bristleworms. If you ever see your tank cloudy.....be ready to do a water change. Bristleworms are spawning and I think you won't want that to happen. But with all those eggs your corals will go nuts, yummy for my tummy LOL. Have you tried setting a trap at night?

We experienced the same dilemma in our seahorse tank......I went ahead and got a radiant wrasse, small one, about 2 1/2 ". There were so many worms that it kept it fat and healthy and didn't even bother the seahorses......they are soooo slow eaters. But it worked for me.

Good Luck and hope you get rid off as many as possible.

[Joshua]

Yeah CBS will eat them and cool to watch. Not sure what's going on with your arrow crabs though, 3 different sources and that one survived fine through acclimation and was dead when it hit the sand, something is wrong with your tank that's happened slowly enough for your existing critters to get used to it and tougher critters like the pepps can handle. Many critters you can just toss into a healthy tank with no acclimation at all and they'll do just fine so when you're striking out 3 in a row something's up.

[labrown]

No CBS for me. I have a cleaner and two peppermints that I like too much.

aggman, I will make an attempt at video today.


THANKS everyone for all of your replies!!!!!!:bigsmile:

[labrown]

Got some video of the feeding today. In the 4th frame you can see 3 pods fighting over a piece of food in the little cave. That is one of their favorite places to zoom around. pretty gross, huh?

http://i333.photobucket.com/albums/m366/labrown12/th_wormsgalore-1.jpg (http://s333.photobucket.com/albums/m366/labrown12/?action=view&current=wormsgalore-1.flv)

[R.Allard]

just a thought but do you have any and i mean any copper plumbing parts in the tank that you have added or new "metal parts" that are touching the water. it sounds like you have a heavy metal issue in the tank. the other thing that comes to mind is stray electrical. do you have a ground rod etc that might be coming in contact with the water in any way?

[R.Allard]

PS hope someone didn't drop a coin in your tank.

[R.Allard]

the other thing is when i had MH lighting the reflectors would rust and the rust would
drop into the tank... i found out the hard way!!!

[aggman]

yeah just saw the video...that is a gnarly frenzy. i don't have anything like that in my tank. i found something similar (much much smaller) im some lr i was adding to my tank. tore the **** thing up trying to get them all. ended up with 10 lbs. of rubble. threw it in the sump. what a waste.

~alex

[labrown]

just reposted the video. It's much clearer now.

Some interesting responses. I sometimes think I need to be testing for something more, but don't know where to go from here.

None of them are humongous. Sometimes I think I sit too close to my tank.

[JimD]

An over abundance of critters like brisleworms, Planeria, etc, are an indication of a certain ammount of whatever nutrient it likes, usualy detritus,, once that nutrient is depleted, it wont be long before the unwanted guests follow suit. Thats been my experience anyway.

[ErikH]

Yeah, I know the Ca and KH are low, I've been lazy and just adding top off water instead of changing out some of the salt water. Can't decide whether I'll do a water change or dose some B-Ionic. I have mostly softies, just a few LPS, so I'm not in a rush.


You should keep a log of when and what you dose! I started it with my CA Reactor, and now I have several logs. Daily you should only need to top off and dose, just changing out old water with new SW does not keep your levels in check! :) Keeping your CA and Alk inline also keeps deformities from occurring, as well as good steady growth. Without that, I imagine you could stress your corals since they are having to play "red light, green light" with their growth pattern. Just my observations... :)

[labrown]

You should keep a log of when and what you dose! I started it with my CA Reactor, and now I have several logs. Daily you should only need to top off and dose, just changing out old water with new SW does not keep your levels in check! :) Keeping your CA and Alk inline also keeps deformities from occurring, as well as good steady growth. Without that, I imagine you could stress your corals since they are having to play "red light, green light" with their growth pattern. Just my observations... :)

I don't dose anything, except iodine once a month. The calcium is always between 400 & 500, first time it has been low. I don't really know what else to dose. Everything else stays pretty stable.

[JimD]

That looks more like an acro eating flatworm, not good if you have SPS..... Google image is your friend.

[labrown]

No SPS. If you haven't figured out by page 3, I'm not too advanced of a hobbyist!

[ErikH]

I don't dose anything, except iodine once a month. The calcium is always between 400 & 500, first time it has been low. I don't really know what else to dose. Everything else stays pretty stable.

Don't dose anything else, water changes are sufficient. The salts are engineered for tanks!

[ErikH]

Get a wrasse... I just watched the vid.

[labrown]

Get a wrasse... I just watched the vid.

Do you think the wrasse would bother my mandarin? He's pretty bold right now, I don't want to encourage him to hide.

[JimD]

No SPS. If you haven't figured out by page 3, I'm not too advanced of a hobbyist!

Nothing to figure out, just stating an observation.

[jroescher]

I agree with what JimD said earlier. There's a reason why the bristleworms are out of control. Too much of something in the tank. They will continue to populate until they reach the limit of whatever they are feeding on.

[ErikH]

It will be a tad too busy. By the time it is done eating worms, I doubt it would go around picking fights with mandarins. I have a venatus wrasse in with my seahorses, and it doesn't bother them at all. If worse comes to worse, you could sell the wrasse after it cleans up those worms!

[R.Allard]

how much flow do you have in your tank???

[Joshua]

I don't dose anything, except iodine once a month. The calcium is always between 400 & 500, first time it has been low. I don't really know what else to dose. Everything else stays pretty stable.

BINGO! iodine in high levels can be very toxic to crustaceans of all kinds. Your shrimp molt like crazy? Get an iodine test kit, my $ says you're way high on that.

[labrown]

BINGO! iodine in high levels can be very toxic to crustaceans of all kinds. Your shrimp molt like crazy? Get an iodine test kit, my $ says you're way high on that.

Not like crazy, but I was dosing it to help them molt. I know that you're right, I shouldn't dose for something if I'm not testing for it. I'll pick up a test kit.

[labrown]

how much flow do you have in your tank???

I have 2 Koralia 1's, a powerhead, and I have an external overflow/return pump that creates plenty of surface aggitation.

I think I'm getting all the worms because I'm overfeeding my tank. Gonna cut back on that. But I still think I need a critter for crowd control.

[CynthiaM]

I think I'm getting all the worms because I'm overfeeding my tank. Gonna cut back on that. But I still think I need a critter for crowd control.

That's right!! Overfeeding will increase the population. Do you have nassarius snails in your tank?....they usually scavenge for leftovers.

[labrown]

That's right!! Overfeeding will increase the population. Do you have nassarius snails in your tank?....they usually scavenge for leftovers.

I have 4.

[R.Allard]

i talked to a couple people that are vendors of marine equiptment and have been in the business for over 30 years.i talked to them at different times during the day and they both came up with the same answer first was copper in the tank but when i told them you had
other inverts they both said the same thing.... check your salinity one even said ill betcha
his salinity tester is broke

[labrown]

i talked to a couple people that are vendors of marine equiptment and have been in the business for over 30 years.i talked to them at different times during the day and they both came up with the same answer first was copper in the tank but when i told them you had
other inverts they both said the same thing.... check your salinity one even said ill betcha
his salinity tester is broke

I will check that, thank you for asking!

[R.Allard]

if it is high take it down slow over the next 2 or 3 weeks