Can You Over Clean your tank???

[papijames]

Hello Guys,
I'm new to the Hobby,(2 1/2months now) and joined Maast last night. I have a 55 gal FOWLR which seems very small now to me. Anyway, I used to change 5 gal per week, and now got in the habbit of changing 15gl per week. Am I doing the right thing? please your advices are welcome.

[RayAllen]

Hello Guys,
I'm new to the Hobby,(2 1/2months now) and joined Maast last night. I have a 55 gal FOWLR which seems very small now to me. Anyway, I used to change 5 gal per week, and now got in the habbit of changing 15gl per week. Am I doing the right thing? please your advices are welcome.


Welcome to Maast!

15g per week is fine. Most do a 15-20% water change a week. Some like myself do not do a water change every week. It comes down to personal preference and if your tank inhabintants are happy and doing well. Also a good skimmer is a must with a FOWLR. A 55g FOWLR will become small very quick, I say this because the fish that people normally put in FOWLR are larger species. With that said they will quickly out grow a 55g and become aggressive towards one another. Just watch your stocking and you will be fine.

[erikharrison]

Could you give us the full rundown?
How long has your tank been running?
Amount of Live Rock and Sand (in lbs)?
Inhabitants?
Filtration? (be specific, brand names etc)
Lighting? (be specific, brand names etc)
Are you testing your levels? If so, Which ones and what are they?
Are you dosing anything?

I know I asked alot of questions, but we need to know as much as possible! :)
Welcome to MAAST, we are all here to help.

ALSO, we have a GREAT search function, and TONS of threads chock full of information, so if you are curious about something and want a quick answer, do some good research on our site! :bigsmile:

How'd you find us?

[papijames]

Thank your for the reply guys. here's what I have
Tank-55gal @Alamo Aquatic
Lightning- 2 50/50 6500 trichomatic daylight and Actinic420 from REEF SUN @ Petco
Live Rock- 51lbs total. 32lbs from Wolf Reef and 19lbs from Alamo Aquatic
Wet/Dry Filter- Proclear75 Capacity 75g or 300 GPH BIO from PROCLEAR AQUATIC and
Protein Skimmer- MPS75 from same company. got them both @ Alamo Aquatic
Powerhead- I have 1 RIO1700 from TAAM RIO for the Wet/Dry from Alamo Aquatic
1 Hydor Koralia3 850gph for circulation in the tank, and
1 Aqua-Tech 170gph both on oposite side of the tank

Inhabitants
5-Blue Legs Hermit
5-Redtip Hermit
1-False Clown
1-Black & White Butterfly
1-Orange Butterfly
1-Hippo Tang
1-Bicolor Pseudochromis/Royal Dottyback (very mean little guy for his side)
1-baby Dwarf Lion
1-baby Saddle Valentini

I keep my temperature at 80 because I heard high temps keep HICKS away.
I dose 1 cap of Liquid Calcium Reactor and 1 cap Purple up weekly.
I use Deep Six to check my salt level and keep it between 1.021 and 1.022
Feed them 1cube marine cuisine and 1cube Spirulina/Brine Shrimp/Mysis in the morning. and 1 cube Brine Shrimp at night

Now I really want to know if my equipments are suited for the job,and if I'm doing everything right. if not, I would like to hear your suggestions. thank you all

[erikharrison]

Sounds like you have a great setup going for you. With your stock list, and equipment, you should be able to keep a great softie tank.
"I keep my temperature at 80 because I heard high temps keep HICKS away."
haha, this is Texas and it's HOT! Yet there are HICKS EVERYWHERE, lol. Ich or ICK won't necessarily stay away because of high temps, in fact it increases the speed of it's life cycle. Lower your temp about 2-4 degrees and you're good. The keys to avoiding ich outbreaks are great water quality, diversity in your feed, and fish that are not stressed.
I had that same wet-dry, and what I would do is remove 1/4 of the bioballs and replace them with live rock. Repeat that process weekly until it is all swapped over.

BE CAREFUL when buying LR from Alamo, as I bought some when I first started that was not fully cured. If it reeks of sulfur, it's not ready to go into your tank!

Do not dose ANYTHING unless you are testing for it. On your tank regular water changes should keep everything in order until your tank is loaded with coraline algae and corals. If you do really want to dose use the two part solution called B-Ionic.

At some point, you may want to swap out those PC bulbs for T5 High Output (HO) bulbs, as they last much longer than PC bulbs. You could also start looking at sump options and a larger skimmer. As those fish grow, a better skimmer will definitely be in order. :)

I love your quote, that's what life is all about.

[papijames]

Erik it seems like you know alot about fish. So I hope you don't mind if I use you as my "fish advisor" :). Anyway, about my wet/dry you wrote "I had that same wet-dry, and what I would do is remove 1/4 of the bioballs and replace them with live rock. Repeat that process weekly until it is all swapped over" now do you mean to take away those blue balls and put live rocks in that area where they were instead? also when you wrote" You could also start looking at sump options and a larger skimmer. As those fish grow, a better skimmer will definitely be in order" I see people talking about sump but I know quiet get it. Also what kind of good Skimmer is out there? last but not least how many extra fish can I add in that 55g before it's time to upgrade for a bigger tank? seriously I only want to add 3more fish to make it a total of ten. 1 Bicolor Angel, 1 Scribble Rabbit/Foxface, and 1 Xmas Checkerboard Wrasse. I saw Justin at Pets R Us and said he could order them for me. Now can I add those extra 3 or am I at my Max amount already?

[copperband]

yes Erik means take out the blue balls but not all at once and fill it with live rock the also what part of the sump do you not get if we know we can help you properly as the fish go definetly talk to Erik i am going to make him my fish adviser if thats ok as well

[papijames]

Well Copperband since the sump from my wet/dry can only hold less than 3g and is occupied by the protein skimmer and the Powerhead, I want to know if Have to buy a small tank, and how would I be able to hook it with the wet/dry? by the way did you get your name from the Copperband Butterfly? this fish was on my wanted list, but after hearing how hard it is to get that fish to eat I got cold feet and stepped down to a black & white Heniochus.

[ismvel]

Papijames, here is an interesting read by MELEV....which is not me...LOL...I really need to change my name..it is calld Reefkeeping 101 - Sumps
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2008-01/newbie/index.php

And as far as sumps go, you can have someone make you a sump, purchase a sump, or simply purchase a 10 - 20 gallon tank and place baffles in it (used to separate your chambers in a sump, and more importatntly to keep the air bubbles at the surface and not going back to your display. Here is how to make your own baffles. From what I beleive Erik said, he has tried it and it works well. This is the route I will go with my sump.
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ca/volume_3/cav3i1/Baffles/baffles.htm

Speaking of which. Erik, can this EPDM foam rubber weather stripping be pruchased at home depot / lowes as well??

[papijames]

Wow Maelv good articles. I heard that some of the Board members here at Maast are smart enough to build a Protein Skimmer or Sump. You don't happen to be one, or know one of them? Cause I think it should be cheaper that way, instead of buying one at the store. By the way, based on the number of Inhabitants I have in my tank do you think that's something I should consider ASAP or just in the near future?
Thanx

[alton]

Ok I am not an expert at saltwater aquariums, corals or fish, but I have been in the saltwater hobby since 1991 when I walked into Texas Tropical and started my second try at keeping a saltwater tank. The first was in 1982 which didn’t last long because of complaining from my mother because of salt creep on her walls. In 1991 I purchased a wet dry system “Made by Dan” maybe some of you know him? Filled with it up with at that time was Bio Bale and then a few years later switched to bio balls. Sixteen years later that wet dry is still being used as a filter system for a 58 gallon with the same bio balls that are over ten years old. My current setups are as follows 200 gallon with 48” wet dry with bio balls since 1999 and a 24” fuge half full of Chaeto for about a year now. Ammonia “0”, Nitrites “0”, and Nitrates undetectable which is causing problems right now because my corals are suffering for a lack of, so I am going to find a way to raise my nitrates. I do a 30 to 40 gallon water changes on this tank every other month. Second tank is a 158 gallon setup since 2003? (Oceanic didn’t put a sticker in it so I can’t remember the exact year. Once again 48” wet dry “Made by Dan”, filled with bio balls but without a fuge. Once again nothing is detectable but nitrate and it is barely on the scale so I am guessing below 5 mg/l? My 200 has 10 fish and my 158 has 4. It would take me 50 pounds of live rock to fill my wet dry, and I would rather look at that in my tank. I am not here to criticize but if you have your tank is set up with bio balls leave it, if it you want to change it out down the road then do so, if you want to add a fuge then do. I believe that bio balls are not the culprit they are made to be by having high amounts of nitrates in people’s tanks. Poor water change practices, over feeding and stocking of fish are I believe are the reason for high nitrates. Also there are plenty of low light corals out there that love to eat fish waste and clean your tank so go buy them and put them in. There is no reason to have a fish with live rock only tank any more. Xenia, Mushrooms, and GSP come to mind as easy to grow and do not require a lot of light. In closing after being in the hobby for 17 years straight and never having any of my tanks crash I believe that wet drys with bio balls are not as bad as some make them out to be.
P. S. in time your deep six like most plastic salinity checkers will become a liar so look to purchasing a hydrometer in the near future.

[ismvel]

Wow Maelv good articles. I heard that some of the Board members here at Maast are smart enough to build a Protein Skimmer or Sump. You don't happen to be one, or know one of them? Cause I think it should be cheaper that way, instead of buying one at the store. By the way, based on the number of Inhabitants I have in my tank do you think that's something I should consider ASAP or just in the near future?
Thanx
You know, alot of this hobby is a matter of opinion...Alton just provided you with proof of that by stating that many believe Bio Balls are evil, yet he has been using them since '99. I personally could not attest to that, as I have never used a wet dry, trickle filter, or bio balls. I currently run skimmerless on a 29 gallon, and on my 220, I will run skimmerless for a while also (mainly during the cycle) while I get other items I need for the tank. But when the time comes to start stocking up, I will have a skimmer. There are soooo many ways to set up tank properly (and improperly as well). All I can suggest is that you really start going through different forums and do research and figure out what you want to do and how you want to do it; then run with it. What works for me, may not work for you.

When I am ready to stock, I will be running a 40 gallon fuge, with a deep sand bed, some LR, and a skimmer. That is a basic set up I think for a large reef. Others may have less, others will have more. It really is a matter of opinion on what will work.

As far as your question, Hobogato (Ace) makes both sumps and skimmers, and with your stocking list, I would recommend you get a skimmer at some point, however Alton stated you could get by with some low light corals that can help with the fish detritus.....as I said, I am fairly new in the hobby (about a year and a half, so I am still learning, always....learning)

[junkstang]

I agree with ALTON my tank is doing just great with bio-balls, 20% water changes every 2 months. If you want some xenia, gsp, or shrooms I have a few chunks to sell.

[Bill S]

For skimmers, sumps, etc., ask Ace (aka hobogato).

[erikharrison]

I do agree that bioballs are not necessarily the culprit of becoming famed nitrate factories. The only problem is that they are a pain in the wazoo to clean out when they get packed with detritus. To me, I found it much easier to clean a wet/dry with live rock in it than one with bioballs.
Ishmael(sp?) you can get epdm or marine grade at HD or Lowes, goodiebag, aka Brad from Aquarium Design has them in his sump, I personally don't have any baffles, I have live rocked packed in every square inch of water that is my sump.
Another good place to read up on sumps is www.melevsreef.com (http://www.melevsreef.com)
I personally would wait on adding any other fish until you get a bigger, better skimmer, especially if you want to add corals. Granted softies are somewhat more tolerant of poorer water quality, but I do not promote poor water quality by any stretch of the means. Especially with a hippo tang in there.
I have a 29 gallon tank as my wannabe sump. I just took the hose from the overflow box and put it in the 29. It just hangs in there. I put a EuroReef skimmer in there, about 60 lbs of sand, and about 50 pounds of rock to occupy the rest of the space. I buried my mag5 return in the rocks to keep microbubbles from the skimmer from getting in it. I also took the inside of some swim trunks and covered all inlets of my pumps to prevent any of my clean up crew getting stuck in either of those pumps.
I have my heater in there as well, but it only turns on at 75 degrees. My water pretty much stays at 76 constant, so the ebo-jager only turns on to prevent a catastrophe.
Keep an eye on your nitrates, and keep doing about 15-20% water changes to air on the side of caution. If you do a search, there is plenty of info about skimmers on this website. If you want an inexpensive skimmer that is worth it's weight in gold, try an Octopus Skimmer. Aquarium Designs sells them. One for your setup will run you roughly 100 dollars, but you'll need a simple sump like mine for it. You can come by and check mine out if you'd like, just let me know!

[erikharrison]

For skimmers, sumps, etc., ask Ace (aka hobogato).

Ace can build ANYTHING that you will need.

[copperband]

ya i did get my screen name from the fish im not sure if im going to get one though

[papijames]

I agree with ALTON my tank is doing just great with bio-balls, 20% water changes every 2 months. If you want some xenia, gsp, or shrooms I have a few chunks to sell.

I would like that. But do I need to upgrade my Skimmer first before getting any Corals?

[Richard]

and Nitrates undetectable which is causing problems right now because my corals are suffering for a lack of, so I am going to find a way to raise my nitrates.

Hey Alton, I have the same problem on one tank. Nitrates are zero, like true zero which is not good. To keep things happy I dose a little "Flourish Nitrogen" made by Seachem every day or two. Just make sure it's "Flourish Nitrogen" and not regular "Flourish", that has phosphate and a bunch of other stuff you wouldn't want.