Checking Interest: ORA Corals

[AquaDen]

No longer being offered.

[erikharrison]

Post pics please :)

[apedroza]

I'm curious!!!

[greenmako]

as much as your selling coral are you a retailer?

[BIGBIRD123]

That's my question, also?

Steve

[greenmako]

as its my understanding only retailers can order from ORA

[Texreefer]

ORA is wholesale only,, and to have a wholesale tax ID you have to maintain a certain amount of business to keep it... im sure this is one way to obtain that goal!

[AquaDen]

No longer being offered

[AquaDen]

Texreefer is absolutely correct. I try to sell the coral at a reasonable price so not only the high dollar reefers can afford it. This way the hobby expands with better coral at a fair price and more people can become interesed.

As for pictures i will list some picture of ORA coral that I have had in the past. This is for an upcoming order therefore i do not have the coral at this time.

[erikharrison]

The reason I asked for pics is because when I go on their website, there are no real specifics on zoas etc. It just says zoamat. :(

[BIGBIRD123]

Internet-based is still retail. You do not have to have a store front to be retail. To continue posting these type of sales, you need to contact me by PM, so that we can make arrangements for sponsorship. It's not as expensive as you think. I just think this will be in your best interest. I don't want to see posts being deleted in the near future.s

Steve

[NewB]

Internet-based is still retail. You do not have to have a store front to be retail. To continue posting these type of sales, you need to contact me by PM, so that we can make arrangements for sponsorship. It's not as expensive as you think. I just think this will be in your best interest. I don't want to see posts being deleted in the near future.s

Steve

I have not been a part of MAAST for very long but his posts really makes me question my support of this site. You say this site is to better serve the reefing community but you threaten to delete posts if they don't become a sponsor?

Regardless if it's a retailer or individual I personnaly have no objection to them posting items for sale.

[BIGBIRD123]

I have not been a part of MAAST for very long but his posts really makes me question my support of this site. You say this site is to better serve the reefing community but you threaten to delete posts if they don't become a sponsor?

Regardless if it's a retailer or individual I personnaly have no objection to them posting items for sale.

We have to protect the interest of the sponsor that we have. They paid for the right to advertise their goods. We have had this problem in the past and it had to be dealt in the same way. This not different to Maast and I understand that you are not privy to that part of Maast's past. The people involved understood and had no problems with the way we handled it. He needs to understand that we will protect the interests of our sponsors and it will be a benefit for him, too. I'm not threatening him that he has to become a sponsor but to do this type of selling and the volume, this is what he needs to do.

Steve

[AquaDen]

ORA does not have any zoanthids at this time. They are in the process of adding another green house for zoanthids. So all of there there zoanthids are growing out until the new green house opens which should be in December or so. I have many zoanthids that I grow out, is there something that you are looking for? I have gotten lucky and got 5 heads from the original colony of PPRPE's (Propagators Purple Ring People Eaters). I am in the process of growing out the colony. As soon as they are ready to frag I will let all of the Mastards know. This should be around the beginning of the year. I found out the the guy that first started them (The Propagator) only lives about 15 miles from me!!!

[AquaDen]

Please read the first line that I wrote on the post. By all means if it is not allowed, please delete it. I have no grounds to argue with something that is against rules and regulations.

But, I must clear up something. Retail is a completely different business than internet based businesses. Different licenses, store front, open hours, permits and the list goes on. As most of you may know you must have retail space to purchase most aquarium related items. Not that I am trying to ague something, just clearing up the difference.

99 percent of the of the coral I sell I grow myself in a 300 gallon prop tank in my basement. I rarely purchase wholesale such as ORA. There is a frag swap in about a month in the area that I live. For this reason I am purchasing wholesale to keep up with the demand of the frag swap. This is the reason I am offering it at the time. Otherwise I sell coral just as everyone else on MAAST does. I grow it out in a tank and then frag it as needed. I do not sell coral for a living (would not come close to paying the bills) I sell it mainly to pay for the hobby and to possibly make a little profit if at all possible. If the post does not get deleted I will post a picture of my system tomorrow to show that it is no where near retail and is nothing but a RubberMaid tank full of frags.

When it comes to equipment and supplies I do consider myself a vendor. I am a wholesaler and distributor for many companies. I know by listing supplies I would be breaking the rules, therefore I do not list supplies.

[BIGBIRD123]

Here are links from ORA website:
This is listed under Ordering.

http://www.orafarm.com/retailers.html
http://www.orafarm.com/hobbyists.html

They are pretty much self-explanatory in the fact that you must be a retailer to purchase from them, just as our LFS do so.

I have for the past two years wanted to set-up a frag system and have an ebay business but I haven't because of the conflict of interest by being a BOD. Maybe when they kick me off the BOD, I will do just that. I would love to sponsor the new Maast when that time comes because I know where they are going...

I will leave this to the BOD as how to handle this one, so that it is handled in the proper manner.

Steve

[josephatmbimortgage]

:Timeout:


:bighug:


:shades:

[AquaDen]

Since there is conflict with this post the best thing to do would be to delete it. Again, this is the reason I put in the first sentence that I am not sure if this is allowed on this thread?? No hard feelings at all!!

[erikharrison]

I have not been a part of MAAST for very long but his posts really makes me question my support of this site. You say this site is to better serve the reefing community but you threaten to delete posts if they don't become a sponsor?

Regardless if it's a retailer or individual I personnaly have no objection to them posting items for sale.

Preface: I am not related to MAAST in any way except for the fact that I have spent 25 dollars. My opinion might be totally different than everyone else's, but I too am trying to help clarify this!

Seriously, this group is about supporting our local retailers. When someone posts that they are selling ORA items, it is evident that they somehow someway sell corals that ARE NOT just frags of theirs. This is not a "group order" or any of the like. Our GREAT group of LFS owners in and around bexar county support this site to be able to TRY and reach out to us without publicly posting in all of the other forums. Retailers want to stay away from the MAAST drama, so they choose, responsibly, to pretty much stay out of posting in the general forums. AquaDen is not necessarily a Retailer, but an e-tailer. Regardless of business license or type, at some point it is obvious that a license of some type has been purchased to contact ORA. That puts Aqua in the definable area of being a retailer. I do understand Aqua's side though. Essentially Aqua is trying to pass on some savings because he/she has the ability to able to order from them and receive a discounted rate which would be to everyone's advantage, and I am sure that ALL of us appreciate Aqua trying to get us in on a good deal. The fact remains though, that this website is ran like a business, and the BOD has to make choices with a cut and dry approach. There can be no grey areas, as someone somewhere will unfortunately try to exploit it. This site makes money from retailers, and those that have paid, do deserve to get what they have paid for.

Aqua, I will send you another email pertaining to the zoas. I am highly interested and would like to get some "new stuff" to our little slice of heaven here in SA. Start taking a TON of pics!!! :):photo:

[Richard]

With the new software, on any given day I can click on "New Posts" and 40 to 80 percent of all new posts are "where to buy stuff cheap" & "I'm selling stuff cheap". This is much different than most other sites I have looked at. Since maast is primarily a trading forum now I think it doesn't matter who posts their goods for sale.

It's a limited market, people are only going to spend so much per week/month/year. So I don't see the difference between "hobbyists" making money out of their tank by selling on maast or another retailer doing it. It's all competition. The only difference is one pays taxes and one doesn't.

JMO.

[Bill S]

So, Richard, this is pretty much a "Craig's List"?

I kind of agree with Erik - my feelings are this:

If you are reselling livestock, you should be a sponsor.

If you want to sell propogated livestock that YOU grew, you should be either a sponsor, or a charter member. If you do this and it is a significant source of income, you should be a sponsor.

If you are selling new equipment/supplies, you should be a sponsor.

Other than that, if you are a "web member", any other sales should be either used equipment, equipment purchased for use but never used, or livestock that you have kept, but are getting rid of.

[Richard]

So, Richard, this is pretty much a "Craig's List"?



Yeah kinda. I know alot won't agree but that's how I view it these days for the most part. I went to another forum, clicked on new posts and 1 out of 16 threads was a WTB/WTS thread. Like I said it's usually 40-80% here, sometimes has even been 100%. Hobby related stuff, dogs,camera's, computers, household appliances, pretty much anything and everything.

[AquaDen]

My point of view..... Even if I did not post the ORA corals for sale and there were other members that were wanting to sell ORA at a good price and probably half below maket value, I sure with they would have sold me. In all, that is what I was trying to do, offer a limited one time deal on some awesome coral for those people that do not have as deep of pockets as others. If people took the time to grow out the ORA coral that they paid half the retail amount for then once it grew out I am thinking that they would offer the frags on MAAST for sale. This way the hobby improves with quality coral and with less money spent. Any of the other corals that I have offered have been trades on the corals that I had or I grew them my self. I use to use a couple different distributors but in all honesty there is too much time needed to treat the coral that you get from distributors. For this reason I grow it out, make a couple dollars but most of all enjoy it! I did not intend or want to argue with anyone over this!

[erikharrison]

Ahh man, don't take it personal. :) I know we are all just trying to help, and state our points so we all have a better understanding. I thought it was a novel idea, and still do! It is frowned upon though, but mainly because of the business aspect of the site. No worries! :)

[AquaDen]

As we can see........ Everyone has there own opinion on what should or should not be done on the site. I have also noticed that status is a big deal, wether or not you have paid membership dues, if you are a charter member, web member, sponsor and so on. I thought it was about the hobby but just like most things its all about status.

Ill sum all of it up!!!

I am not a retailer and grow out or trade 99 percent of what I sell.

This forum is for buying and selling not debating.

If the post is not allowed please delete it.

I have no problem paying to be a charter member.

I do not have the stock or the time to keep up with being a sponsor.

If you are interested in some great ORA corals please PM me for a nice savings.

A picture of my set up is below. As you will see I do not have a ton of corals to sell, mostly frags of what I have grown out. And some SWEET PPRPE's that are growing out now!!

http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r163/aquaden/IMG_2384.jpg

[JimD]

"I thought it was about the hobby but just like most things its all about status"

Thats where you're wrong. People pay to become a charter member to help support the club financialy so it can continue to function as a valuable learning tool and remain current. It has nothing to do with "status"... There is no so called "clique" or whatever, just people like you and me with a common interest.

[AquaDen]

We all have our opinions. Above, I stated the facts about myself in relation to reef keeping. JimD - I agree with you on the common interest but not all members are like that, some believe its status. With RICHARD being a sponsor of the site I must believe that he is rather level headed about it. Most sponsors would contact the board to have the post deleted but he stated some facts and left it alone, just as I want to do. Needless to say, this post keeps getting bumped to the top of the "for sale / want to buy" forum when in reality its a debate on what people think is right or wrong. So lets leave it alone so that people that have things for sale have a fair chance of having there stuff at the top of the list or delete it or move the post to a forum that is more about debates and so on. In all honesty, I believe every aspect of me selling ORA corals on MAAST have been covered.

So, I guess my final question would be is if there are any issues with me selling corals that I have grown out since I VERY rarely purchase wholesale??