remote dsb, large fuge?

[GeoB]

I recently got a 180 that came with a 30 gal sump. I'm going either shallow or no sandbed, and I'm trying to decide if I should make my old 70 into a fuge with a deep sand bed. Do remote DSBs work? Any drawbacks to a having a large fuge? I would need to buy at least another 100 lbs of sand, drill the 70, and do the extra plumbing, so I’m trying to decide if it would be worth the money and effort to do this. Would a 20 gal fuge with just a ball of chaeto be adequate instead?

I know there is a lot of web info on these things, but I'd like to get some MAAST input.

[hobogato]

i have a DSB in my fuge and a shallow sand bed in my display. so far, seems to be working well.

[PUMA]

I also have a shallow bed in the display and a DSB in the fuge. I think using the 70 as a fuge with a dsb is excellent. The dsb is a great denitrate system. And it will expand the total water volume of the system giving you alot more buffer room. I am currently setting up a 180 with a 55 fuge. I am thinking about doing the same thing to save on the amout of sand I might need. I am not quite sure yet.

[GeoB]

Thanks for the input! Since I haven't heard any "a remote dsb saved my system" stories I'm going to go with the 20 gal chaeto fuge. My sump, skimmer and 20H fit so nicely under the stand. I like the idea of the 70 fuge, if time and money weren't factors I'd do it. If I have nitrate issues in the future, I'll try 70 gal fuge w/dsb and maybe I'll have a "a remote dsb saved my system" story.

[scuba_steveo]

I have a dsb in my display and my 100 gallon fuge. Remember a true dsb needs to be very fine sand and 6" thick. The problem with this is that the sand gets blown around everywhere in the display with all of our big powerheads. I put larger particle sand on top of my fine sand to offset this. You have to maintain a dsb too. The one thing that has become hard for me is to maintain anything. I love my setup because it is a very low maintenance system. On my next tank I will not use a dsb anywhere. Except maybe a remote lagoon. lol.
Also, a dsb can crash and take all your livestock (fish & corals) with it.

[GaryP]

My only concern is that the DSB in your fuge is not going to be large enough to support the bioload for a tank as large as a 180. It all comes down to a matter of square footage of the DSB vs. water volume. Are you talking about running the 30 gal. sump plus the fuge, or use the 70 gal. as both fuge and sump? If you use half of your 70 gal. as a sump, and half as a fuge, that only leaves you with something like 24 X 18" (3 sq. ft.) for the fuge. That would be plenty to supplement the denitrification taking place in a 180 with a DSB in the display. I'm not sure if its enough to support that size of tank.

I may be totally wrong here, but that's my thought about it. I know Doinnie has tried to do the same sort of thing with his 240 and has been fighting nitrates. He actually has 2 remote fuges on his system, plus a huge skimmer, and now a sulfur reactor. Of course he has a predator tank and his nitrate load is a lot higher then a reef tank would have.

[GeoB]

It would have been the 30 gal sump plus the 70 fuge. I guess that was the gist of my question, would adding a remote 18"x48" (6 sq ft) sand bed provide enough support to a 180 bb/ssb to justify the cost and trouble. From literature I've read and the real world input here, it doesn't seem to be enough. So, the plan is a shallow sand bed display, a 20H bb fuge w/chaeto, and 30 gal sump. Thanks!

[GaryP]

I guess I'm missing something here. How is a BB fuge going to be better then a DSB fuge? I guarantee that no matter what the size, a DSB is going to be more efficient at removing nitrates then bare glass. I'm guessing somewhere around 100% better. I would sugggest going with the 70 gal. DSB fuge and just add chaeto to that.
Actually, if you are going to use the whole 70 gal. as a DSB/fuge, I think you probably will have a very good chance of success with it.

[GeoB]

I misread your post then. I thought you were saying a remote dsb is good for supplementing a system in which the main tank has a dsb. I like the idea using the 70 for dsb/fuge, but I've decided to go with the 20 bb with chaeto for phosphate control and see how things go with my skimmer and live rock for nitrate control. (I added the live rock last night and didn't realize how much I had, time to get cranking on some maxi-stream mods.) If I have nitrate issues down the line, I can add the 70 with dsb. If I don't need it down the line, I've saved myself some effort and $$$. Thanks!

[GaryP]

I have another suggestion you might consider. A carbon bed in the fuge. Talk to Richard at CB Pets about that.

Macro will remove nitrate as well as phosphates. Plants need both.

[GeoB]

Carbon bed is a new one on me. I'll look into it.

[matt]

I'd look at the "sand bed in a bucket" thread that links to the reefcentral thread on Calfo's forum (I think) where he dicusses using a really deep sand bed, like basically a big box filled with sand, as a detrification device. You don't put animals in it or any light on it or maintain the bio-diversity like a true DSB. You just let the bacteria colonize and apparently it really helps with nitrates.