Beckett-Pressure pumps

[::pete::]

OK I have set up my 180 and have been playing with new toys. I built myself a dual beckett and tried to run it off my return with a wye from an amp master 3000. I was unsuccessful :( . I then decided to try a different pressure rated pump that Alex loaned me to try before actually buying one. It is hooked up as a dedicated pump to the skimmer and pulls directly from the in on my fuge @ 2' to the pump horizontal. It then goes around 18" to the becketts.

I have had to tweak this pressure rated pump since installing it each and every day. I thought thats the reason you install one ... hmmm ... to avoid this. I am getting skim mate and it is dark, but it is not constant. The only thing I dint try way cutting back the pump!!! I cut the pump back half way and I cant stop this thing now!!! Its steady and producing great skim mate that is dark and semi wet, wet enough to flow through the tube and about as dark as coffee!!

Im sure all systems are different, but hobogato (http://www.maast.org/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=viewtopic&t=11861) is using a mag 12 with great results. A pressure rated pump ... NOT!!

[don-n-sa]

is this directed at someone??? :lol

anyway you weren't completely clear on which pump you cut back half way.

[::pete::]

Iwaki 70 ... not directed at anyone, except the reef community that insist that you need a pressure pump. Just trying to save y'all some cash to get mo' corals with .... learn from others and dont beleive everything you read!!

Except this :D

[NaCl_H2O]

Not familiar with the becketts, but I assumed the claims for a pressure rated pump were to keep the becketts sucking the right amount of air? I would think any inconsistent skimming will settle out after 3-4 weeks of use after the reaction chamber breaks in. It would be interesting to see how it works after 3-4 weeks with the pump opened back up?

[::pete::]

It has been running for a little over a month off the amp master ... I think its broke in!

[captexas]

From what I have read, the idea of using a pressure rated pump is that it is much more efficient than using a non-pressure pump. A pressure pump can run at lower GPH as it can handle the back-pressure better. Your ampmaster has to crank out massive amounts of water to make up for the head loss from the back-pressure created by pushing the water through the 2 becketts. This is an issue of not just efficiency, but also pump life. I have read a few stories of people running their beckett skimmers with Sequence pumps that are not pressure rated and it has resulted in cracking the seals/wet end casings.

Sure both types of pumps work, just a matter of getting the water flow and air flow adjusted to make the skimmer work the best in each situation. I still think you have to make adjustments to becketts no matter what.

[matt]

I cut the pump back half way and I cant stop this thing now!!! Its steady and producing great skim mate that is dark and semi wet, wet enough to flow through the tube and about as dark as coffee!!

Im sure all systems are different, but hobogato (http://www.maast.org/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=viewtopic&t=11861) is using a mag 12 with great results. A pressure rated pump ... NOT!!

The idea of running beckett skimmers off of pressure rated pumps is that the pumps have lower volume for a given motor; usually a smaller outlet, or something like that. This allows the flow to remain more constant with varying degrees of back pressure that typical beckett skimmers exert on the pump depending on organic load and foam production.

It sounds to me that by throttling back the pump, you've kind of done the same thing. Less flow, same pump power.

Look, use whatever pump you want. I can only speak for my experience with skimmers that I've made, and they work ALOT better with pressure pumps at the right flow rate. If yours or anyone else's work fine with mag pumps, terrific.

[::pete::]

Matt
Less flow same pump power ... so then a smaller pressure pump would still do the job?

Like Joshua said
Perhaps you're pushing too much water through it and it's moving too fast to allow the tiny bubbles to rise up properly? is what got me thinking as I was staring at this thing for an hour or better. So I tried throttling back the pump and everything in the 6" tube was still spinning and it was full of bubbles, but not as violent :) .
I then played with the air (1/4 open) and the output.

Sound right to you?

[matt]

Yep, that sounds like what I've experienced. Mine work best when there is a nice smooth flow in the tube with very little turbulence at the top. That's also what got me building longer tubes; running the level high up in the tube really cut down on the turbulence.

[NaCl_H2O]

I would love to see one of y'all try to make a custom recirculation skimmer like the Aquamedic Turbofloater. These have huge contact volume/time and zero turbulence. I get great performance out of mine, on a 700g system, and it is fed with a Mag12!!

The TF5K is very expensive ($650+ship) and I would think a local source could make just as good of a skimmer for a VERY competitive price!

Who wants to come over and study it and take a stab at a prototype? I'll test/buy the prototype, and we could compare side-by-side with the TF :)

[jaded]

thats a heck of an offer!!!

[::pete::]

Who wants to come over and study it and take a stab at a prototype? I'll test/buy the prototype, and we could compare side-by-side with the TF

Did you have to ask?!?! :)

[z28pwr]

The TF5K is very expensive ($650+ship) and I would think a local source could make just as good of a skimmer for a VERY competitive price!

Who wants to come over and study it and take a stab at a prototype? I'll test/buy the prototype, and we could compare side-by-side with the TF :)

I'll buy the TF5K and you keep the prototype :D .

I don't think it would be hard to make it, specially if you buy the pump with the "special" impeller.

[NaCl_H2O]

Did you have to ask?!?!
Let's do it!!!

The Ocean Runner (http://www.premiumaquatics.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=AM-70007&Category_Code=Oceanrunner) pump is available, and "cheap". The large acrylic reaction tube & cup will be the biggest cost. The other challenge is the rather exotic plumbing (custom cast parts) used to flow the skimmed water out of the TF without any (or at least very little) suspended bubbles.

Honestly, the offer is real. I'll be more than happy to work with Pete to "inspect" the TF and come up with a comparable design for a recirculation skimmer, fund the prototype materials & parts, test performance next to the TF 5K, and start a thread to document it all (maybe not the design ;) ).

Then he can build one for everybody :D

[::pete::]

Im in!!!

[matt]

The TF5K is very expensive ($650+ship) and I would think a local source could make just as good of a skimmer for a VERY competitive price!

:)

$650 for a skimmer that can handle 700 gallons is not expensive IMO. Probably anything of comparable size I'd build would be more, but I'd want to use thick cast tube, etc. When I get back, I'd like to have a look at it.

[captexas]

Yeah, that's a great price for a skimmer to handle that kind of volume. I have a Euroreef 12-2 recirculating skimmer rated for 400gallons and it retails for around $1200.

[captexas]

Pete - if you can build one of them, I'll take 1 and sell my ER. I would love to have a skimmer with a smaller foot print that can still handle a large system.

[::pete::]

If? :)

Start saving!! ;)

[captexas]

LMAO, yeah, yeah, I know Super Pete can build anything out of wood and acrylic! Hmmmm . . . how about a wooden skimmer? lol :P

[::pete::]

Where is that scratching head smiley?

[Tim Marvin]

I am useing the dart for flow and the dual beckett you made Pete. Most of it goes through the skimmer, and it produces tons of nasty scum. I fill the collector I bought off of Alex about every two weeks, (probably a gallon). I did up the skimming a little because of Joshua's posts and a couple others. The tanks are doing great, but also use a refugium, sand beds, and rubble beds.

[TexasTodd]

What model of TF are you talking about? I've seen the T1000 and it's like $126.00 without a pump.

Hmm, on the becketts I'm confused. I know of several people that run a single beckett with 100% of an Iwaki 70rlt through it. From what I've read there the trick is limiting the AIR intake. There have been several threads where is was mentioned that using LESS air actually gives you more and much smaller diameter bubbles-----the ideal "shaving cream" look to them at the top.

Opinions? I've never run one and am looking at getting one. More feedback here would be great!

Todd

[z28pwr]

He's talking about the TurboFlotor 5000 72" version. It's awesome.

[::pete::]

Here are a couple shots ...

http://offthereef.org/images/skim.jpg

This is what the cup looks like and I have cleaned it already too!

http://offthereef.org/images/half.jpg

The dedicated iwasaki 70 turned half back on a dual beckett.

http://offthereef.org/images/waste.jpg

I end up with this ...

[jaded]

I gotta get mine dialed in... how long did it take to get that?

[z28pwr]

Dang Pete looks like you've got some filthy water ;) .

Looks like it's doing a great job, where is your water level at in the skimmer? (pic would be great).

[::pete::]

I never even paid attention to "how long" I was working on getting it!

[::pete::]

Dang Pete looks like you've got some filthy water ;) .

Looks like it's doing a great job, where is your water level at in the skimmer? (pic would be great).

The water level is just below the flanges. Its scummed up in that area to so a picture wouldnt help. I have to use a flash light and point it directly on it to see. It only takes one day after cleaning and it scummed up again!

[TexasTodd]

BELOW MESSAGE IS A COPIED ANSWER FROM BOMBER ON REEFCENTRAL. I VERIFIED HOW HE USES HIS SINGLE BECKETT BULLET 3 WITH iw70 WIDE OPEN? Now I'm getting more confused! :mellow


Whew, thank God that's a easy question. I'm having a day. LOL

That's it. I have no idea what the air flow is though. I just make shaving cream.




quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

TexasTodd wrote on 05/20/2005 03:42 PM:
Hey Bomber I seem to remember you using a Precision Marine Bullet skimmer.

Is it the Bullet 3? I know you did a mod from 3/4" non-straight to a 1" straight on the inlet I think.

Are you running this as the sole outlet at 100% from an Iwaki 70rlt pump?

Do you know the airflow?

Thanks again for the helping,

Todd

[BIGBIRD123]

I have a Turbofloater 1000 that I'm not using (less a pump). It even comes with the bubbletrap and bio balls. Pete, I would let you have it for maybe a discount on the skimmer I'll need later for the BIG tank. What you think? I can bring it to the meeting.

Steve

[NaCl_H2O]

Pete just left, and he is going to make me a 6' tall recirculation skimmer (the prototype) :)

I'm going to order the OceanRunner pump, and he is checking on material costs. When it is all done, guess I will be selling either a TurboFloater 5000 or an OffTheReef Recirc Skimmer!

Once we get started we will post progress & results :)

[BIGBIRD123]

Steve,
I was just offering something he could play with as food for thought and no out of pocket expenses. The TF are (as I know you are aware)basically the same, just different sizes and capacities. I thought this might give him something to "tear-apart" so to speak. I've been trying to figure out how to use it as a reactor of some sort. Just haven't got there yet. I'm working on a Kalk stirrer made from a SeaClone right now. Will post pix soon. See ya Sunday.

Steve

[::pete::]

Todd
Is that the answer or the question?.

Steve (bigB) Bring it to the meeting we can surely do something with it ;)

As Steve said (NaCl H20) we will have it finished in about 2 weeks depending on delivery. :D

[don-n-sa]

Guys...put me in line to buy the skimmer that will be sold.

[::pete::]

Seriously?

[NaCl_H2O]

Guys...put me in line to buy the skimmer that will be sold.

You got it! Only $1,999 for our friends ;)

[TexasTodd]

Pete, that message was as follows:
1. My introduction on where the information came from.

2. Bomber's short message confirming how I THOUGHT he was running his single beckett Bullet 3.

3. My questions that were sent to Bomber.

Make sense now?

Anyway he runs an Iwaki 70RLT wide open to a single Beckett. Cuts air BACK until he get's "shaving cream bubbles".

TT

[TexasTodd]

Forgot to mention that Bomber runs a 450g sps tank. He's a PHD on Coral and lives in the FL Keys.

He runs bare bottom and this is the only skimmer he uses for his large system. He runs it "wet" so the skimmate looks like green tea.

TT

[don-n-sa]

Seriously?

IF the price is right and if it will fit in my closet... :)