everything dead

[Gator]

i just came home and i lost power and everyhting in my tank is dead , all fish 1 shrimp out of 10 living, snails look dead, i have taken out all teh fish i can find. will my clams and corral be alright i cant loose those , if i do i think i will never do corral again. what would cause this lack of oxigoun or what should i do water change i dont want to loose corral thanks for any help

[Gator]

4 chevrons, 4 vlamingi, i powder blue, 1 sohall, 3 wrasses, 9 shrimp, 1 heniocus, 7 damsels 12 porcelin crabs all dead and a buch of stuff i cant remeber becasue i am so ****ed

the only fish i wish would die a black and white damsell is still living strong only fish left.

[don-n-sa]

wow Gator...I am so sorry for the loss/losses....yes it was the lack of oxygen and no flow is what did your fish and shrimp in. Do you have any idea of how long the power was out?

If you are sure that you have removed all of dead livestock the I would think that a good sized water change and with everything powered back up, you shuld not lose the corals.

Again...that really is unfortunate, if there is anything I can do let me know...I can be available from right now through tommorrow.

Donny

[Chris]

Ouch :(

I'm sorry to hear that. :(

I've been there... it sucks starting over. :(

[don-n-sa]

Gator,

I just pm'd you my cell...if you need help, call

[jaded]

I really sorry to hear about this... maybe I/we can learn from this...

if a fish can make it in a bag for 24 hours how long does the power have to be down for something like this to happen???

[Gator]

don thanks for the offer i appreciate it.

jaded my wife was wondering the same thing, the power was onlky out for mabey7 hours. what about my clams i have 10 huge clams do you think they will make it

[NaCl_H2O]

Gator, that really sucks! I would expect the clams & corals have a much lower oxygen requirement, the clams may actualy benefit from the increased Nitrate levels, etc., but that's what could wipe out your corals.

With as much livestock loss, there is probably a lot you can't see in the rocks, etc. I would think a big Ammonia/nitrogen spike is the danger to the corals, and possibly a bacteria bloom is what could get your clams.

Put an airstone in your sump to get the oxygen level back up, crank up the skimmer, do a 25% water change, and run Charcoal. That's what I would do?

If you feel it is not improving, lots of us have space to hold your livestock until the tank re-balances.

[Jimnorris]

Gator,
Clams can live without water 4 plus hours. I once imported about 200 clams and they were in bags for over 72 hours during the winter. I lost only 10. I think with the power back on they sould be alright.
Jim

[::pete::]

Wow .. that does suck! I hope the rest of the tank pulls through ok!! Keep us posted.

[StephenA]

Have you contacted your Insurance Agent Yet? Since it was a power outage it might be covered.

[Reef69]

Man, that REALLY sucks. I saw some pumps that when the power goes out, batteries run them, im thinking of buying a cpl of those..

[bigdscobra]

Sorry to hear that. Hope the rest of the tank will be ok!!

[Dozer]

if a fish can make it in a bag for 24 hours how long does the power have to be down for something like this to happen???

I have the same question! Can anyone on here answer this?

[NaCl_H2O]

Well, I think it has to do with the ratio of water surface in contact with air (air exchange) compared to the volume of water in the bag. Plus, during transport the water in the bag is shaken around somewhat to help the gas exchange. Compared to the volume of water & depth of a tank, the gas exchange surface compared to water volume is much less. Add to that no water circulation to turn over water with depleted oxygenation ... just my thoughts!

Also, there could have been a temperature change that didn't help?

[captexas]

Gator - I'm terribly sorry to hear of this unfortunate loss. I hate to hear these kinds of things happening to people, especially with the awesome tank you have.

I'm not 100% positive on this, but I've seen some places actually add oxygen to the bag before they seal it for transport. This way there is additional oxygen mixing in with the water during shipping that helps the fish last longer. Of course after shipping, fish are very weak and stressed, so you want to get the bag open as soon as possible to give them some fresh air and allow them to acclimate without stressing them even more. It's always good to have some kind of back-up system in place for power outages, whether it be a battery powered air pump to keep the oxygen up, a good UPS to keep one of your pumps running, or even a back-up generator for those that have major investments in large setups. We are fairly fortunate here as we have a good power system and outages are rare, especially one as long as what Gator seems to have suffered.

[Andrew]

sorry to hear about your loss gator

hope the rest of your livestock pulls through

andrew

[gjuarez]

Gator, I am very sorry to hear about your loss. How big is the tank? Can the livestock be transferred to a friends tank till yours gets better or until you diagnose the problem. WOw, I have had power outages for longer than 7 hours and everything just absolutely fine. Is there anything else that you might suspect that made this happen?

[Instar]

Wow Gator, terrible news. Really have nothing to say that can help. Really sorry.

There are thousands of animals in a reef with live rock. There is only one fish in a bag pumped with O2 top off. The bacteria in the rocks, zoos, coral, pods and macro consume lots of O2 (especially at night RE Power off) and put CO2 into the water when the pumps all go off. It takes minutes to start the redox dropping and the pH follows behind that. Respiration increases surface tension and when the O2 hits critical low, things that can't close and shut down, start to have difficulties and things that can't handle the slide in pH and rapid drop in O2 go down. There are no cultures of live rock in a shipping bag. As a result of the same thing, a 2 day power failure, I have a generator and 4 battery back up pumps. The 2 day power failure cost me the generator, but, when the electronic box burned out on it the power came back on. One of the battery back up air pumps I have starts the second the line power goes off. That has saved the life of many fish for me. An electronic version of this is available on-line for around $60 dollars. Just run the air line in and split it with a T and weight an air tubing down in the middle of the tank with no airstone, just open end line. These large bubbles don't create any spray to speak of and will save your reef from such disasters. As we add numerous lines to the power grid down here from Calavaras plant and Braunig to support the rapidly developing SA area, we can expect more shut downs and failures like this. I have also burned out 2 computer UPS with the power hits here over the last year or so. A really good UPS can run a small back up maxijet to roll the water surface hard for quite a while. These simple things will help and personally after my coral reef death in the flood of 02, I think everyone should have these electronic backup air lines on their tanks. Power can also go out if a GFCI trips. Hope that answers some of the questions here.
Man Gator, really sorry again. I feel the pain.

[Dozer]

Thanks everyone, great answers!

I'm convinced now that we all need to get something like this: http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?pcatid=8120&ref=3055&subref=AR&N= 2004+113029

Gator- I'm sorry too! This really sucks. I live pretty far from you but if there's anything I can do just ask!

[Instar]

Actually, if a line such as a GFCI does trip and you don't have a line voltage drop out alarm on it, then how will you realize it until the backup goes dead? All critical lines need alarms to indicate voltage loss FWIW.

[mathias]

It would also have to do with the livestock in the tank if there is a lot of livestock that time of course is going to be less....

[GaryP]

All you really need is enough amperage to maintain your circulation pumps. You can go without lights and a few other luxuries for several days. Unless you just want a big generator to run the whole house its not really necessary. I saw what a major ice storm did to the reefing community when I lived in the Carolinas. Its not pretty. I was lucky, we lived in a newer area that had underground utilities. Let us know what we can do Gator.

[Gator]

should i do a water change today or wait till tommorow, i have gotton out every fish i can see except 1 damsell, i think all big fish are out except mabey 1 the clams look good the corral look like some are rtn, mabey it would be a good time to get out of the hobby or go to fowlr

[StephenA]

I would do a water change now.

[Tim Marvin]

You'll be OK Gator. Fish are much easier to replace than some of the corals. I am going to bet your corals will pull through and grow back. Instead of fish only do just a couple really cool fish like maybe a black tang and ? Then do the battery airpump.

[NaCl_H2O]

Well, I had plans for a switch box and a generator for my system, but that kinda got pushed aside, I think I need to pull this idea out and think about it again!

[Ed]

Very sorry to hear of your loss. Hope everything else pulls through. I know the urge to get out or go FOWLR is there right now, but please give it a few days before you decide. Tim is right, most of the corals should pull through. It sucks to lose fish, but look at it as a new opportunity to get that one fish you always wanted. Again, sorry for your loss.

[OldSalty]

I made a ups system for my tank consisting of a 400 watt inverter, 33a/h battery, battery charger and a couple of switching relays. this system has saved me on many occsaions. it only runs the pump and has been in operation for as much as 2 days when the power was off. gator, stop by and i'll show ya how to make one. I think you saw it before. like gary said, all ya need is to keep some form of water movement. give me a call.

Kelly

[JEREMY78247]

wow sorry to hear that gator, i'm wondering was your calcium reactor still dripping a low ph and highly saturated c02 effluent into your tank while the power was out?

[Gator]

no it needs power to run pump and co2 regulator, i thought about that though

[jaded]

Old salty... what do you hav invested in yout DIY battery back up? Id be interested in a tutorial!!!

[Polkster13]

Gator,

So sorry to hear about your losses. I had the same thing happen to me back in September of last year. I now have my ADT security system set up to notify me if the electricty goes off at my house. But that won't help if just a circuit breaker trips. But it is better than nothing at all. Man, that just sucks!

Old Salty,

Maybe you can start a new thread and show us all how you did your backup system. I would be interested in it as well.

[GaryP]

We have a member that told me he had access some to some surplus solar panels that could be used as trickle chargers for the batteries. I was thinking of setting up a system along those lines as well. I think the deep cycle bateries like you use for trolling motors may be better for this application.

[JeffCo]

Sorry to hear about this Gator, Don't give up. your corals should pull through. Keep us informed.

[dan]

if you need to put some of your corals in my tank, i'll make some room. your more than welcome to use it. in fact i have some of your corals still here. just call if you need anything. man i can feel your pain. did you ask about your foxface? could he have release some toxins when he died? which started a chain reaction. remember i told you that power went out at my house for 18 hours with no efects on anything. just wondering what could have spead up the prosess?

[::pete::]

Hind site is everything ... ;)


http://www.tripplite.com/shared/img/products/large/APS512%2Ejpg

More Info (http://www.tripplite.com/products/product.cfm?productID=177)

[Reef69]

Any updates Gator?...let me know if theres anything i can help out with..

[wtrujillo]

Hind site is everything ... ;)


http://www.tripplite.com/shared/img/products/large/APS512%2Ejpg

More Info (http://www.tripplite.com/products/product.cfm?productID=177)

Where can you find one of those locally? How much are we talking?

[::pete::]

DIY Pic and plans (http://mistressreef.homestead.com/files/DIY/diy.html#UPS)


Parts (http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/NTESearch?storeId=6970&N=0&Ntk=All&Ntt=inverter&Nt y=1&D=inverter&Ntx=mode+matchallpartial&Dx=mode+ma tchallpartial)

[NaCl_H2O]

Ok, now y'all have me really thinking about my investment!

Isn't there an electrician somewhere among our members? Or a friend of a member?

I want to get someone to install a manual transfer switch on my aquarium circuit. Main Aquarium panel box is outside, so it would be easy to connect a generator to the transfer switch during a power outage.

An honest & well known electrician would be appreciated :)

[::pete::]

Ill pass him your number

[NaCl_H2O]

Ill pass him your number

Thanks, now all I need is a 10,000 KW Generator :D :o :unsure

[falcondob]

Gator, I am really sorry for you and your tank. It has got to blow more than I can understand. If I can help just call me. The only silver lining is that your loss is a lesson for me.
John

[Gator]

i ahve some stuff rtn but it does not look to bad. thanks for everyones help

[Gator]

well i looked again and alot of stuff looks like it is rtn ****

[Tim Marvin]

All you need is a small piece to survive. Frag your favorites and cross your fingers.

[jaded]

depending on what it is, it could be simply beaching.. not good, but far better than rtn

[Instar]

Tims right, save the tips of any RTNs. Those tips will grow back fast after things settle down. Do some water changes and run some carbon to get any toxins out from the fish such as a foxface or over stressed softie. You have a lot of coral worth saving tips off from. When colonies get large like yours, they don't do so well when circulation is cut off. The good part is though that the ends will grow like crazy once they encrust.
Make lots of frags if you have to so you can plant them all over the place. Your reef will turn out to be more amazing than you ever dreamed possible when you frag and glue a bunch of tips from large colonies. Its like planting an amazing garden with lots of seedlings. I think my next reef is going to be tiny frags only and let them grow. It really is nice to grow them all yourself from little starts.

[::pete::]

Gator, how is everything doing today?

[Gator]

looking better some sps has started to turn a brown color and it was all brightly colored, hopefully the rtn has stopped t

thanks for asking

[::pete::]

Glad to hear it! It sounds like its getting better.

[Alamo]

Also i think they put pure oxygen in the transport bags....

[matt]

Huge bummer, Gator. All those chevrons! Keep us informed about the recovery.

[TexasTodd]

Man Gator you've had a crazy couple of weeks! Sorry to hear this.

What's the update now that it's been 10 days?

I think Steve hit it on surface area. Actually if you ship animals with a bunch of water and very little air in the bags they will die for the same reason. That's why there is always pleanty of air sealed in the bags too.

Todd