Warning Rio Seio pump failure

[dwdenny]

As most here know that rio is known as a failure pron pump but this is the first I heard of the seio doing the same thing.

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=4814392#post4814392

I don't want everyone to panic but here is the thread with the information.

I am starting to rethink my choice on powerheads now but not sure I will keep a watch though.

[bprewit]

sucks that he is loosing all his critters in his tank. I use GFCI outlets, test them monthly, use a ground probe, heck I hammered a 8' copper rod in the ground for sole purpose of being my tank ground. Electricity and water dont mix and every pump regardless of brand will someday fail. It may be one week or twenty years but still anything mechanical or electrical will fail someday as extended use takes its toll eventually. Sorry to hear this happened to him. I have had a couple of pumps short out in the past and luckily the gfci tripped out both times probably saving my tank and possibly my house from a fire since one of the pumps was run external and sitting on wood inside the stand. For anyone that is nervous about a gfci tripping for no reason and causing problems while they are gone its pretty simple to use two gfci's and split the pumps between the two outlets so that if one trips atleast some pumps will stay running and keep up the circulation. Also I installed GFCI breakers on the service that runs the outlets for the tank as a added safety. If the outlet fails to trip the breaker will and hey can never be too safe! Now if only I can get some of that netting like they use at batting cages and golf driving ranges and drape it around my tank to protect against crazy girlfriends that throw heavy objects :P

[captexas]

Yeah, electricity and water just don't mix. Even if it's not a complete short, a little stray voltage can still do plenty of damage to your livestock and other equipment. It doesn't matter what brand of power head or heater or whatever else you buy, if you don't take care of your equipment and routinely inspect for worn cords or other mechanical problems, you run a much greater risk of having something really bad happen. Just need to have respect for electricity and what it can do and remember that ANY piece of electrical equipment can fail.

[mathias]

I have reached in my fresh water tank and gotten a small shock.... but nothing happened to the fish....

[dwdenny]

Oh I agree with every word electricall items can and will fail. I started off with two rios and both failed with in about 6 months. They both schocked me lightly when i when to change them out. That was my first and only experience with rio products. I will still have to look at the seio pumps but Tunze keeps looking better and better just a little to much flow I think for me.

[z28pwr]

I agree that everything will fail at one point in time, but there is a diference between fail safe and not failing safe, and there is a big diference in the way a Rio will fail compared to a Mag or a Tunze and I'm not talking about a faulty cord, I'm talking about the POS motors inside the RIO's. I've personally had one go up in smoke in a tank, but I guess you get what you pay for, thus I rather save up and buy something a little better like a Mag or a Tunze stream.

[Brett Wilson]

I take that as a simple statistic of at most 1 in a thousand failing so far.

Considering who the company is and their strong reputation with their RIO line, I can see how one persons experience with their product would quickly create the 'bang wagon effect' on ReefCentral.
One person has a failure then shouts 'Oh my god it's just like a RIO!', then another person with a failure says 'Mine failed too! Just like a RIO!!!'
And then maybe a third person jumps in....
How many people are on RC (hundreds of thousands)? And out of those How many people are using these pumps (probably thousands)? And out of those how many are reporting failures (A few)?

I think I will still try one (I have a small 25g tank) but I will continue to watch around on places like RC for more reported failures keeping in mind how many are actually failing compared to how many people are using them. Like I would do with any pump....

FWIW I have had a Taam RIO 2500 fail on me before, refusing to start up on it's own. It didnt melt or anything though, nor kill any livestock.

[Shark_Bait]

To go with Brett's theory... I have a RIO pump that runs 24/7 (salt mix container) and has had no problems pump been going strong for over a year. One before that was on the skimmer and it ran for over 3 years before selling the skimmer.

[z28pwr]

Guess I'm just one of those one in a thousand and it just happened to occur with my first rio. A Rio 2100 :( . I've heard that they've gotten better but I have no need to try Mag pumps aren't that much more.

[dwdenny]

The ones I had did not kill any livestock either. I just got a little shock and it scared the heck out of more then anything. I feel the same way turbo. I will keep a close eye out as well. I agree and I did not post this to scre people I did this to keep everyone informed to what I read on that thread. I am sorry if it came across that way though.

[eric]

Rio 1800 going on 6 years 24/7. It's coming out soon because I think it heats the water too much.

[gjuarez]

I have had a Seio for about 5 months and it is doing great. I cleaned it once because I thought it was failing but it was just the flow control screw was a little loose. I thightened the little screwy thing and it has worked flawlessly. So far, I am more than pleased with the product.

[dwdenny]

I think this might be an isolate incident. The guy won't post picks after reading the entire thread. And like Turbo said all electronics might fail at some point even the tunxes have had a few problems. I am still looking at them in the tunze doesn't work out.

[gjuarez]

I checked out the Tunze before but decided to go with the SEIO. I spoke to 6 different people before I actually purchased it. THe only thing I regret is not going bigger. I should have gotten the 1500. If I had the choice, I think I would go with the TUNZE.

[Brett Wilson]

What size tank qjuarez?

[gjuarez]

my tank is a 29g mainly sps. It is holding a couple of lps and softies, i am just waiting for my nano to cycle so i can take them out.

[Brett Wilson]

When you say tunze do you mean stream? wouldnt that be a bit out of control for a 29g?

I have a 25g (2' long) and am considering a seio because I figured any tunze stream would be wayyyyyyy too much flow for such a small tank even though I am keeping SPS in it.

[dwdenny]

TruboBrett, I take it you don't think that the 6060 is too much for 45 breeder 36"X18"X16"?

[gjuarez]

Yeah, I meant a stream. So you think it will be too much? I have a bare bottom tank so sand storms isnt an issue. I need more flow in my tank to help keep it cleaner. I want zero detritus in my tank and I want it all settling in my sump where there is less flow or have it taken out by my skimmer. You think it will affect the corals in a negative way?

[dwdenny]

I was thinking it might be too much. The 6060 is like 1600gph. 55X turnover does not sound that bad when put that way but still might be a little too much. It would be like 35X turnover in my future 45g. Ten you have the sump return adding to that as well Jerry. Not sure though will soon find out in the 45 hopefully by July or August I will have water and rock in it. Crossing my fingers.

[Brett Wilson]

I have no idea, I've never used a stream. I was making those assumptions based on the size of the tanks people have been using them in and the pump ratings from tunze.
If a 6060 puts out 1585 GPH i would think it is way too much for a 25 considering two maxijet 1200's (at 295GPH each) are a lot....

As far as a 45 breeder goes i'd still be inclined to think that even if you found a way to subdue the stream you would be very limited on how you mounted it and where it was pointed.

But i've never had one so I am not entirely sure....
I'd be happy to try one if someone had one laying around that they would lend me. :D

-Brett

[CD]

It's going to be pushing the evelope to have a 6060 in a 45 breeder, but it may work with some creative placement. However, on a 29G I think that would be wayyyy overkill. Qjuarez - IMO I think you would be better off with a SEIO for your application. Has the same nice/wide flow area, but just not as much "push" as the Stream.
The 6060 in our 75G was actually pushing some water out of the opposite end of the tank, but we moved it around a bit and found a happy medium. You get A LOT of flow from a 6060. LOL...you should've seen it when we tried to put the 6080 (which was purchd. for the 210G) in our 75G...the poor fishies were hanging on for dear life. :blink

Wendy

[dwdenny]

As well as I would too. I was jut hinking that a seio 620 and seio 820 which equals 1440gph. Not that far off of the stream. But would be out of two not just one so probably more diffused flow that is for sure. Cost is about the same as one 6060. Will definately have to think about this one.

[gjuarez]

A lot of reefers have been telling me that it should be fine for sps only tank. I really dont want to mess up my tank setup so I will ask some experts first so I can get a definate answer. I think it was Tim Marvin that told me once it would be ok. Well, I am sending him a pm to see what he thinks. I will also ask Bomber, JBNY, and a couple of others from reefcentral to see what they think. I am copying Bomber's tank concept. He has extreme flows and he reccomends having a lot of flow to eliminate dead spots in a starboard bottom tank. His flow is created by eductors powered by huge pumps, can remember the name. The eductors work like jet pumps and they give ludricous amounts of flow. I will ask him and see what he thinks. I trust in what you guys are saying, but I feel I have to ask him since we have the same concept. I want as many opinions and ideas as possible so I can come up with a decision. THanks you all.

[CD]

A lot of reefers have been telling me that it should be fine for sps only tank


For a 29G, I don't think the question here is as much whether or not the SPS will like the flow...they can take a surprizing amount of flow and love it...the thing I would be worried about is whether the 6060 will be pushing the water right out of your tank. If you come to Austin anytime soon, we'd be glad to show you what kind of flow to expect from either the Stream or the SEIO...that may help you in making a decision.

Wendy

[gjuarez]

Well I have an SEIO and love it. It is the small one though. I do feel that I do need more flow. My friend has a stream in his 100g and I have put my hand in front of it, it is a very nice gentle flow. I do not know how the tunze will do in my 29. If any little drop splashes out then I do not want it. Maybe I can point it down since i dont have a sand bed to worry. Wendy, thanks for pointing that out to me.

[CD]

Wendy, thanks for pointing that out to me.


You are quite welcome! Yeah, judging how that water started pushing out of the other end of our 75G until we did some adjustments, I figure it would be *really* spectacular in a 29G...LOL...can you say "water fountain"? :P

Wendy

[Tim Marvin]

A 6060 works at it's max in a 45. smaller tanks no way. Your welcome to see my 45 mixed frag tank with the 6060 running in it.

[cpreefguy]

C'mon Will!!! Chime in here...

[LoneStar]

Yeah i've had problems with RIOs as well. I bought two 800s a few weeks ago and they didn't last all of 2 weeks. Went to feed the fish, got my hand wet and then ZAP! , felt a small dose of electricity. It was stronger in the sump were the two pumps were located. What a WASTE of money. They weren't worth saving/fixing so they got tossed and am looking for new pumps and new powerheads. >_<

[BIGBIRD123]

I think it was a scam. The guy was asked to return the pump, he didn't. He was asked to take pix he did not. I believe he used the famous Jersy words, Fa-get about it.