Topping off with 2 part additives

[MikeDeL]

I have been using Kents Tech CB 2 part CA and buffer for quite sometime now. I have been adding each part into seperate 1 gallon jugs and filling with RO. Then adding equal amounts everytime I topped off. The directions say you have to add them seperatly. I was wondering if after the 2 parts have been dilutted in RO, would it be ok to mix them together then add to the tank? Im wanting to set up air driven top off unit, but wasnt sure if it would be ok to mix the 2 dilluted parts.


Thanks,
Mike

[NaCl_H2O]

Mike, I am sure GaryP can chime in with the correct chemistry answer, but I don't think this will work. I don't think you will get enough dullution with 1g of RO/DI and you will just precipitate calcium if they are mixed.

How big is your tank and/or sump? I am not adding ESV anymore since my Ca Reactor is running, but I always just poured it into a brisk flow area in the sump. Then you could just topp off with plain old RO/DI?

[MikeDeL]

Its on my Nano Cube. I was afraid it would precipitate. Im just looking for an easier way for top off. I have had alot of stuff on my mind lately and have missed a few top offs here and there. I will proably just wait until I up grade and start dripping kalk instead. Im going through this stuff like crazy, and its getting pricey anyway.

[NaCl_H2O]

Its on my Nano Cube.

Never mind ... don't listen to anything I say - I have already proven that I don't know "Jack" about maintaining a Nano :unsure

[MikeDeL]

LOL Chemistry is chemistry, no matter how big the container you are putting it in.

[GaryP]

I was wondering if after the 2 parts have been dilutted in RO, would it be ok to mix them together then add to the tank? Im wanting to set up air driven top off unit, but wasnt sure if it would be ok to mix the 2 dilluted parts.

Only if your goal is to make sand. Mixing the two parts together results in a chemical reaction that creates Calcium Carbonate (Aragonite). That's why its sold as a two part.

Basic Chemistry: HCO3 (Part A) + Ca (Part B) ---> CaCO3 (aragonite) + H

What I do is use two top off water jugs. One is for part A and one is for part B. They are clearly labeled on top. That also has the advantage of pre-diluting the additives before you add them to your tank and minimizes the chance that they will precipitate after added. I use some air hose to slowly siphon the make-up water/additive into a high turbulent area of my sump such as where the returns spill in.

The problem, IMO, of using Kalk on a Nano is that a very small overdose of Kalk can create some pretty wild swings in pH. You just don't have a lot of room for error. My management technique for a Nano is not to use additives at all. The best way to manage Calcium and Alkalinity in a Nano is through water changes. Doing a weekly 10% water change should provide more than enough calcium and alkalinity supplements unless your nano is overgrown with SPS. If that is the case, the solution to your problem is to bring me a lot of frags. That should reduce your supplement requirements. From a time standpoint, it takes less time to do a 1-2 gal. water change than it does to add supplements anyway.

[Tim Marvin]

Why do I always miss all the good questions? Thanks GaryP for the excellent response.

[GaryP]

The funny thing is that sopmeone will put a water chemistry question out and someone like NaCl will say, "lets see what Gary says," and then I miss it and don't catch up to it until the poor guy gets about 20 different answers and whatever I say gets lost in the cacophany. We may need to do the Ca/Alk talk again. I've refined it some and maybe somebody besides JimD will stay awake through it. He was just waiting to ask some Kalk question that he already knew the answers to, anyway. :)

We probably need to back up with it and teach some basic high school chemistry before we launch into the details of water chemistry. Oh Misti!!!!

[OldSalty]

HEY GARY,
dont sell yourself short here, that talk you gave on this subject was IMO excelent and I think all that were there came away with knowlege we didn't have before. As we all know, it can be very confusing on the different additives and how to use then correctly, especially when it comes to using kalk. There is a proper and safe way to dose it as you know but most of us, unfortunatly use what I call the dump and pray method and yes this includes me as well. again just my 2cents here. ;)

Kelly

[GaryP]

Kelly,

Kinda like what the Marines call the spray and pray approach to marksmanship?

[OldSalty]

:lol

Good one there Gary

[GaryP]

Kelly,

What do you think about redoing an updated Chemistry talk? We seem to keep getting the same questions that the talk was designed to answer. Maybe we need to repeat it from time to time. That's kinda what I have in mind for the nuisance algae talk that we're going to do for this month's meeting. It might need to be repeated periodically too.

[NaCl_H2O]

The funny thing is that sopmeone will put a water chemistry question out and someone like NaCl will say, "lets see what Gary says," and then I miss it and don't catch up to it until the poor guy gets about 20 different answers and whatever I say gets lost in the cacophany.

Two options:
1) Give me the rights to lock a thread and I can give the "Wait for GaryP" response & then lock it up :D
2) Create a "Chemistry Forum" in which Gary is the moderator, and the ONLY one that can post responses :D :D
Ok three options:
3) I can PM you every time I see one ;)

[MikeDeL]

I was doing the 2 gallon weekly water changes, and it didnt seem to be keeping up. My Ca was never over 400. It usually peaked at 375. Kh was always around 7. Now Ca is about 450 an Kh is about 8.5 or 9. Dosing seems to be working better for me then just the water changes.

So how large of a tank would you think I would need before dripping Kalk? I would do the 2 jug drip but I think it would be a little difficult to adjust the to drips to where they were dripping at the exact same rate. Those plastic air valve dont seem to be the most precise pieces. Would IV drip regulators work any better?


Thanks,
Mike

[georgeortiz]

I found this calculator the other day. It may help maybe not. I have had time to put it into practice. I just thought I would through it out there.

http://www.kademani.com/reefchem.htm

[GaryP]

Mike,

Try alternating the A&B mixed with your make up water. I'm guessing you aren't using Oceanic Salt. What do you have in the tank that is using the Alk. & Calcium? sps? I use my DIY 2 part that I add to two seperate make up water jugs. So I end up with A & B make up water jugs. Of course I use about 5-6 gal. of make up water per day as compared to the much smaller amount you use for a nano.

[MikeDeL]

Gary I am using Oceanic. I do have both SPS and LPS in the tank. Unless I was missing something. What Im doing now seems to be going good for me. I guess I could still be missing something though.