Lighting for a new tank

[scuba_steveo]

I just ordered a 215-display tank and I have figured out what I want to buy for all the other components except for lighting. The tank will be in-wall and will sit in the workroom so I will not have a canopy. The tank will be mostly SPS. I am thinking of running 3 – 400W MH with actinic support. The questions I have are as follows:
1. What type ballast should I use? Magnetic or electronic? HQI? Probe or Pulse start? What brand?
PFO 400 watt Dual HQI Metal Halide Ballast?
IceCap 400W Electronic MH & HQI Ballast?
Reef Fanatic 400W Electronic Halide Ballast?
E-Ballast 400watt w/plug
As you can see I am now lost on what ballast I should use.
2. What type bulb configuration should I use? I really want color over fast growth. I have heard that if I run just 20k the SPS will have awesome color but may not be healthy and over time can die. I was going to go with 20k and VHO actinic support but I am now thinking of using 14k bulbs and T5 support. I thought I had this figured out but I am really starting to get lost on this.
3. What should I use as the support? VHO or T5?
I do not want to cut any corners but I can’t spend a fortune either. If I had the money I would just use Giesemanns everywhere. Please help!

[alexwolf]

I think you should use the Perfecto strip lights, NO 45W, like 3 of em

[alexwolf]

Seriously though, I would like to know why corals will die under 20,000K lights. This really upsets me because i have not heard this before.

[RobertG]

Nice to here! Lighting is a tough call. The 400W will definitly have some heat issues. I have 4 250 HQI , 3 are Mag, one is elec. ballast. I would really look into Electronic ballasts. There smaller seem to put off less heat. The lumen output of a 250 HQI, I understand is the same as a 400W mogul base. I was told not to go this route as I already had the cadillac of light. I would strongly suggest the HQI's over the mogul base.

If somehow you can piece together some Geissmann I would. I bought a pendant dont know what kind thought it would match up in the spread. Not even close. I have three Geiss. & this odd ball. I have ordered another Geiss. pendant. There is no comparison. I think StephenA has some he is going to be parting with. You might be able to come accross a deal. Since the lights wont be visible the colors should'nt matter. Stephen has two, Tadkins 411 has one. & Tim Marvin has a friend with one. I would think you could make a deal with them.

IMO there is nothing better.

HTH

[StephenA]

As soon as my new all in one Geissmann comes in I'll sale current ones.

[matt]

Steve;

I'd consider the 250 DE 10k XM bulbs, I've heard great things about them. Then you'd need some actinic support; the classic set up is vhos. A word of warning, I've heard that the XM bulbs do not work with electronic ballasts. Maybe the PFO HQI ballast is the best choice; they also have nice pendants.

The deal with corals not doing well long term under the higher kelvin bulbs is that those bulbs typically do not have the PAR of decent 10k or 6.5k bulbs like iwasakis. There are lots of bulb tests on the web; Sanjay Joshi has done a bunch of them. Now, the mogule base XM 10ks tested almost as high as the iwasakis, and something like 25% better than ushios in terms of PAR. I assume the DE bulbs are similar in the way they compare to ushios.

[Tim Marvin]

Do two of the EYE bulbs. MT1000D/HOR/HTL-blue. They have the absolute best coverage of all colors in the spectrum that we need for color and growth.

[Tim Marvin]

Here is a link to them. They put out 80,000 lumens and 92 CRI each.
http://www.bestgrowlights.com/site/403863/product/ssi901796

[Tim Marvin]

If you don't like those do 4 of the 250w DE megachromes on IceCap ballast.

[GaryP]

I know there is a link somewhere to a study that was done showing the best combination of bulbs and ballasts. Does someone have that bookmarked? I think that might be very helpful to Steve. As I recall it looked at the best PAR results using various combinations of bulbs and ballasts.

Gary

[scuba_steveo]

Right now I am running a 13k 150 HQI Giesemann on my 37 with very nice results. So I am familiar with and I do like the HQI. The problem is that there are not any HQI 400W bulbs out yet. I think I really need to go up to 400 W because of the depth of the 215. So here is where I am leaning now.
PFO 400 watt Dual HQI Metal Halide Ballast
I know that it is a magnetic ballast but if I get two I will only have 2 boxes and 4 lights.
Then in the future when 400 W HQI bulbs come out I will only need to re-wire for the new bulbs.
Maybe I can find a similar ballast that is electronic, I will keep looking.
And then I would like to go with 14k bulbs with VHO actinic support

Anything wrong with this? Should I go another route?
Thanks for the help,
Steve

[scuba_steveo]

Ok, this is the other option. 400 watts electronic and HQI and pricy!

IceCap 400W Electronic MH & HQI Ballast

[matt]

Steve;

You're confusing a few terms here. There are no HQI bulbs; HQI is a ballast type. The bulbs you're thinking of are DE (double ended) rather than the larger mogule base bulbs which just screw in the socket.

Now, the DE bulbs require HQI ballasts, while the mogule bulbs (most of them, anyhow) can run on either standard or HQI ballasts. There are tests which show that HQI ballasts will burn some mogule bulbs more brightly. There are magnetic versions of both standard and HQI ballasts, and electronic ballasts which are not HQI, but claim to be able to run any bulb. (like the icecap) The primary advantage of the electronic ballasts is that they will run a variety of bulbs, and they are more energy efficient. A lot of electricity in the magnetic ballasts goes to produce heat.

Oh yeah, I almost forgot. The europeans have been running DE bulbs on HQI ballasts for a while, and this is reputed to be the most energy efficient and effective lighting for reef aquariums. A 250W DE HQI set up will produce more PAR than a 400W mogule set up with a standard magnetic ballast, and produce much less heat, all while providing excellent color for reefs. (At least that's the claim!) BUT, wht most people don't realize is that these bulbs and ballasts were originally designed to run on 220V; remember this is european stuff. Now, as I recall, you're having your fish room wired. IMO, you'd be well advised to get a 220V (or 240V, I don't kow which) circuit built in and run the 250W HQI ballasts on that circuit. It'll run better, use less electricity, and you can thumb your nose at the Germans!

[scuba_steveo]

LOL Matt
I do understand the difference betwen HQI, DE and mugule, but I see where my post was confusing.

My question now is:
When 400 Watt DE bulbs come out, will the
IceCap 400W Electronic MH & HQI Ballast
or the
PFO 400 watt Dual HQI Metal Halide Ballast
be able to be rewired to run the DE bulb?

will both be able to run a DE bulb in the future?
will neither?

I want to buy a ballast that is HQI so that I can run a double ended bulb. I would like the ballast to be 400W but I may drop down to 250 if neither ballast will work with future 400 W DE bulbs.

[scuba_steveo]

Ok, I just talked to the contractor...he is doing the wiring today....he is going to put a 240 in the new tank wall on its own breaker....This better work Matt!

So what ballast do I order now?

IceCap 400watt 220Volt Halide with R/S (Any Bulb)
http://www.premiumaquatics.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=PA&Product_Code =ICE-400NHB-220V&Category_Code=Ice-halide

[kaiser]

Oh yeah, I almost forgot. The europeans have been running DE bulbs on HQI ballasts for a while, and this is reputed to be the most energy efficient and effective lighting for reef aquariums. A 250W DE HQI set up will produce more PAR than a 400W mogule set up with a standard magnetic ballast, and produce much less heat, all while providing excellent color for reefs. (At least that's the claim!) BUT, wht most people don't realize is that these bulbs and ballasts were originally designed to run on 220V; remember this is european stuff. Now, as I recall, you're having your fish room wired. IMO, you'd be well advised to get a 220V (or 240V, I don't kow which) circuit built in and run the 250W HQI ballasts on that circuit. It'll run better, use less electricity, and you can thumb your nose at the Germans!

It is not that easy. Being German I can tell You You will not be able just to install a 220 outlet and use it the same as a german outlet. The 220 Outlet here in the states is in all reality 2 110V circuits, (2 hots 110V each, 1 Neutral and a gound) the german outlet is 220V (1 Hot 220V, 1 Neutral and 1 ground). If You were to try to combine the 2 110 in to one, You will be poping breakers. The other problem is the AC Frequency, german is 50Hz, US is 60Hz.
If You look closer at the US 220V appliances, ie a/c, You will notice that there are 2 circuits within the appliances, one to run the compressor the second to run the controls and the blower.
In order to get 220V out of any outlet in the US You will need a transformer and with the amount of power used by the MH it'll be pricey and that still does not solve the frequency problem.
Stepping of the soapbox
Kaiser

[scuba_steveo]

forget all that 220 stuff
here is the ballast I am going with unless someone say different

PFO 400 watt Dual HQI Metal Halide Ballast
http://www.premiumaquatics.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=PA&Product_Code =PFO400DHQI&Category_Code=PFOballast

[Tim Marvin]

Excellent choice! I use the 250 watt version with pulse starts and it works perfect! I also use the IceCaps and they do a great job also. That is what I will move to when they come out with a DE/400watt. That should give it about an equivelent of 800 watt mogul frying power!

[alexwolf]

do you have to shield DE bulbs? I havent seen anyone that has DE retro'd into a canopy.

[Tim Marvin]

Yes you do.

[alexwolf]

how do you do that? I can see hanging pendants in a canopy, but thats about all my feeble mind can figure out :D

[Tim Marvin]

The glass/UV shield comes with reflector set-ups for the DE units.