Ammonia in Temp Tank

[StephenA]

My temp tank has been up for 2 weeks. It's a 120Gal with 60Gal of water in it, 80Lbs of live rock, skimmer, powerhead and a return pump circlating water. It has 2 chromis, Kohl Tang, Ocellaris Clown, BTA, Cleaner Shrimp, Pep Shrimp, LPS, SPS and Leathers, and a Derasa Clam. My Ammonia shot up to 3 mg/l for several days. I did 50% water changes for 4 days. Now it is staying around 0.25 mg/l. I've only fed them twice since the tank was set up. I did have a Maxima Clam die the day after I put everything in the tank.

Should I be concerned about 0.25 mg/l for Ammonia?

[Jenn]

ABSOLUTELY! I had the smallest trace of ammonia in my tank and its what killed my clown trigger, lionfish, and my humu-humu trigger. I was consulting with Richard at CB Pets and he told me that ANY ammonia in the tank burns their gills and will kill. I can't believe all you lost is a maxima. Was this loaner tank set-up with stuff that was already cycled including the used water?
How long has the livestock been in it if the tank has only been set-up for 2 weeks? To rid my tank that had been established for over a year, I bought a poly filter and some instant live bacteria additive (I can't remember the name right now) that they put in tanks to cycle almost instantly. I chose this method upon recommendation from CB Pets against using chemicals and it worked. Hope this helps.

Jenn

[mharris7]

I think I read somewhere that clams actually eat/filter ammonia? Need to check the facts - it's been so long since I heard it.

[StephenA]

My 72Gal Bowfront blew a leak. (http://www.maast.org/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=viewtopic&p=37843&hig hlight=#37843) I moved everything from my 72 to the sump, a trash can and my Son's NanoReef. A day later I moved everything to the 120G. When the clam died is when the Ammonia when up. I removed all of the clam and did a 60% water change, then 2 50% the next 2 days. I've been changing about 5Gal every other day now. I'm still waiting for Oceanic to replace the floor and for my replacement tank to come in. The new tank should be here in 3 weeks.

I've also gone to 3 stores in Austin and no one has Poly Filter.

[Jenn]

I got my Poly filter here a the little lfs in NB, that's crazy that some of the Austin stores don't have them. Good luck to you. I hope all the rest of your livestock will pull through. :)

[GaryP]

Clams will use nitrate but I have never heard of them using ammonia. Ammonia is much more toxic than nitrate. Algae will use ammonia. See if you can get some Caulerpa and throw in there for a temporary fix but keep doing the water changes.

Gary

[StephenA]

I've got a good Clump of Caulerpa and a Mangrove in the tank.

[GaryP]

OK, that should help. Do you have a protein skimmer on the tank? If not, you should. That will help a lot.

Gary

[GaryP]

Never mind, I saw where you had originally said you had one. Make sure it is skimming properly.

Gary

[Instar]

Since you are not feeding the fish, you will have more deaths. You should feed them and give very serious credit to what I wrote about bacteria cultures. You would not have had a toxic ammonia spike if you had seen and tried the instructions I so often have put on here and you could have kept feeding the fish. I hope others will see this and it will spare them the same grief you are having. You can still solve the ammonia problem and start feeding, but, it could be too late because its been a long time since they had food. You need to get the culture called Bacter Vital made by Marc Weiss labs in Florida. We have it in SA. I don't care what anyone says, I guarentee you that it will solve that mess you have! All you have to do is follow the instructions. I always set up tanks in one or two days for herds of fish, fairly well cured rocks or sterile rocks and never have the troubles you have and never starve the fish to get there. My latest setup was in 250 mls of water with 8 to 10 anemones and 4 berghias. They laid eggs on the 5th day. Now you would think that 10 large aiptasias gut loaded with formual 1 would foul 250cc's of water, wouldn't you? It didn't, obviously. I used the culture as always. Since is was a striped down little thing, I did change 50% of the water for the first 5 days. I don't do that in tanks with rocks and substrate though. And this culture is so effective that I have given up testing for ammonia completely! Its useless. The only NH3 I ever get is in with a new hatch of hundreds of clowns in 5 gallons of water, but that is not what you are doing at all. Like I said, that culture will positively help you even if it is a little late for the fish. Sorry about the clam. I hope you can save the rest of them. There are other cultures, can't guarentee those. They probably work, but, I haven't used them in with fish that are so stressed as yours. I hope for the sake of the fish and what hope they may have that my sales pitch has been effective here. You might want to double up on the culture dose since you're behind the 8 ball on this.
This is pretty much the same thing Jenn said about the culture.

[StephenA]

Since you are not feeding the fish, you will have more deaths. You should feed them and give very serious credit to what I wrote about bacteria cultures.......

I've read your thread. Doubt it would help. This is not a new tank! The live rock and most animals are about a year old. The live rock cured many moons ago. The ammonia spike was caused by the lack of a DSB (which the tank and LR were used to) and the death of a Maxima Clam at the same time. With the few fish I have in my tank they could go weeks with no food. If you'd spend less time being condescending you would notice I have fed them some. You would have also noticed that my previous tank sprung a leak and things were done if a fast matter.

Jenn
I found some poly filter. Thanks for the advise!

[Instar]

Noticed all that. Glad I'm not in your position and sure it could happen to me and has. You doubt the culture, yet haven't tried it? There is not doubt that it will make a major difference in your problem. I'm on the side of your fish, not necessarily you. Nothing personal. If it be mine or yours, stressing them or having deaths gets me going. I was making my own cultures in the 70's and 80's before such a thing could be bought in a store. Even the home growns worked. Moved tanks across town and cross country. Never had one death, and never had to withhold a healthy portion of food to keep things under control.
I'm sorry to have cared so passionately about your situation as to be condescending. That was unintentional. I hope that you can work it all out.

[StephenA]

Thanks for caring. I care for the creatures in my tank as much as my dogs. So I would do anything to help them. The maxima was my first. He meant a lot to me. I think he was ill before the tank leak and it pushed him over the edge.

[Instar]

Really very sorry about that maxima. I get really bothered when something like that dies, even if its not my fault. I have two now and have not seen any just exactly like either of them. I know those things are unique. I'm a good way from you, but, if you need help with something, I'd take a shot at trying to help you out.

[StephenA]

Thanks, where is Floresville, TX?

[Instar]

Southeast of San Antonio, about 30 miles.