red alge problem

[eleyan]

I'm new to this forum, so I'm not sure if this is a common problem to other members. I've been having some recuring red alge blooms in my reef tank. All my measurments seem to be fine, and I'm following the recomendations I found on other web sites for alge control, but I still keep getting it. Here is my setup( you can see photos on http://webspace.utexas.edu/eleyan/tank):

72G bow fron reef ready with 20G sump
Tunze skimmer
UV ster.
220W PC lighting (2x10K + 2x50/50 new coralife bulbs)
about 80lb fiji live rock
live sand
fish: 2 tangs, Flame angel, six line wrase, blenny, 2 goubies
inverts: 2 cleaner shrimps, hermit crabs, snails, reef lobster
corals: colt coral, yellow leather, xenia, tree corals, mushrooms, hammer coral
measurments:
ph: 8.2
amonia ~0
nitrite ~0
nitrate 5~10ppm
KH 8~9
Ca 300 (I know this is low)
Phosphate (waiting on the test kit I ordered)

I tried the knowen remedies I found on the web:
- reduced lighting time to 8 hours a day
- added phosphate remover (phosguard)
- removed carbon from sump in case it was leaching phosphates
- added macro alge
- feeding every other day.

Any other recomendations before I go the chimical route?

Thank you,

Nadeem
:roll:

[eleyan]

Oops, the link is bad. here is the right one:
http://webspace.utexas.edu/eleyan/tank

[Tim Marvin]

Nice tank! If it is in the sand only use nassarius snails, cucumber, and sand critters. Rocks, you can use hermits (sparingly) or just blow it off with something. Chemi-clean works great and no ill effects, but you need to remove the carbon when useing it.

[360Reef]

From looking at your pictures it looks like you only have one powerhead, I would first try increasing the water flow with some additional powerheads. I would bet that the red algea (cyanobacteria probably) accumulates in areas of low flow. I used to have this same problem until I added a SQWD to my tank and increased the water flow from about 1000gph to 1800gph. I also live in Austin and would be glad to come over and check out your wetup if need be.

-Greg

[eleyan]

Tim Marvin,

The sleeper goby keeps the sand pretty clean, I have patches on the live rock though. I have some hermit crabs and snails, but they are not touching it. I try to brush it off every time I do a water change, but its getting more, I'm afraid I'm just spreadding it by doing that. I've tryied Chemi-clean before and it worked great, but a friend of mine told me that it stoped working the second or third time he used it. I'm not sure if the alge became amune to it, that's why I'm keeping it as a last resort.

360Reef ,

I have the return pump from the sump pointed in one direction (MAG 700GPH) and then I have this other pump (350 GPH) pointing in the opposite direction. over the hollidays I put togather a small timer circuit to mimic a wave maker (only the 350GPH pump is switched on and off every 30sec). The water flow lookes pretty strong in most areas, but I have a couple of areas where I have more delicate corals that I can't make the water flow too strong in. you said you are running 1800GPH, How big is your tank? PM me if you want to take a look at the setup sometime.

Thanks,

Nadeem

[dan]

i agree with 360reef add more water flow. my fuge has a path of red algea because my water flow is low. in my main tank where my flow is high. NOTHING

[matt]

I would agree with the flow suggestions; it's very difficult to have too much water movement in an aquarium. But, i would take a different approach to fixing the cyano; I'd build up your sand bed until you have a good 4" of southdown or equivilent, and stock the sand with all sorts of worms, micro stars, other detrivores. I'd also remove the hermits and anything else that might eat the tiny sand critters you're adding. Eventually, when your sand bed is well populated, you'll have a much more efficient ability to process waste in the tank, and thus avoid the build up of nutrients that is responsible for the cyano. If you don't have a refugium to grow a big patch of caulerpa, I'd suggest setting one up if possible. It can easily be another tank sitting next to your main tank, plumbed into the same water circuit. Once you have a good functioning deep sand bed and a refugium, cyano (and almost all other problem algae) will disappear.

BTW, don't place a lot of stock in your phosphate test. Algae of all sorts take this stuff out of the water very efficiently; in fact, they're a much better indicator than most hobbyist kits. You could easily read zero, but that's because as son as gets produced in the system, the algae absorb it and reproduce.

[Instar]

nitrate 5~10ppm
KH 8~9
Ca 300 (I know this is low)

You have something missing in your cultures and filter system if these are your values. Also, with calcium of 300 and dKh of 8 to 9, your water is out of balance. You will not get rid of the cyano until you fix these problems no matter what you do. I've seen cyano grow on the pump nozzels, right in the blast path, so that rules out circulation for some cases such as this. Most fish need to eat 2x per day. There is no shortage in their natural habitat. Every other day is a death sentence. Maybe not today or tomorrow, but in the not too distant future. Many of these fish live well over 20 years (tangs and angels may live 50 years in captivity), but not when malnutrition sets in. It takes a while to become visible sometimes, but, it will eventually. Over feeding may cause some issues with water quality, but, normal feeding does not. You do have a problem with your bacteria culture, so cutting feedings to every other day will not really help that much anyway. Once you get set right, NH3, NO2, NO3 are all undetectable (0), and PO4 is less than the test kit will read or closer to the lower limit.

[rocketeer]

For what it's worth, I have had some red cyano. I bought new filters for my RO/DI unit. I was getting almost 300ppm from it before. Now it's almost zero. After a few water changes the red cyano is subsiding.

Jack

[eleyan]

Larry,

I understand NH3, NO2 should be 0 which is the case, but I though nitrate will build up between water changes, and I think I'm due for one soon. I'm tring to set up my overflow as a de-nitrification chamber using a raiser pipe ( https://webspace.utexas.edu/eleyan/tank/equip_page.html ), but i still can't detect a change, I also added some macro alge in ther now. I'll try feeding more often, but feeding smaller amount so nothing is left over. I'm trying to bring up my calcium and dkh using Kalk, calcium buffer and A/B. Its taking too long though.

Jack,

What was the 300ppm for, phosphate? I need to test my RO/DI output, but its a pretty new unit (<2 months)

[Instar]

eleyan, take your sweet time bringing the calcium up. Quick changes can cause irrepairable damage. The dKh is good, all you need to do right now is add a little calcium. If you also add buffer in equivalent amounts, you will not make headway with the calcium right now. Calcium and dKh work like a see-saw. As dKh rises, calcium goes down. As calcium is increased, dKh goes down. You can boost both in equal amounts (RE: kalk), but, if one is low and the other is optimal, adding in equal parts will not bring you into balance. Magnesium makes this process stabile providing its high enough. Test for that. IO in fresh mixed water runs a bit low, but, should be good to keep it in check as long as you have a source for Mg in your sand/rock/additives.
You have a 72, so in reality it might be safer and easier to balance things with partial water changes. 10% at at time, more frequently than you indicate you have been doing. If your add things and get a sudden swing back, and you can with a buffer system like this, it could really do some damage. A 300 calcium is not the end of the world or your tank life. A sudden change can be. Be thankful its taking a long time to change. That fact alone has spared you lots of grief at this point. You said you are using kalk. That helps get rid of the phosphates as well as some other things. The worst thing you can ever do with a reef tank or marine animals is to get into a hurry and try to solve perceived problems overnight. My first reaction to a problem so long as there isn't 50 gallons of water on the floor or something like that, is to chill and do my best not to react at all. Think thru a strategy to repair and research it, for maybe a week or so, and then start on a well researched plan of action that will eventually bring about results. Reef keeping: Its like the story of the tortoise and the hare.

[rocketeer]

The reading I was getting out of my RO/DI unit was just what my electronic TDS meter gave me. I think it's kind of a sum total of everything that disolves into ions. Whatever they are, they must have been accumulating in my reef, which probably isn't good. I would assume some of it is phosphate. But you know what they say about assumtions. :D

Jack

[GaryP]

TDS is Total Dissolved Solids, as opposed to TSS - Total Suspended Solids (i.e. particulates).

Gary